9 ms·

The fanciest shopping center in America is expanding

84 points by lnguyen 9y ago

twblalock 9y ago
I'm not surprised that high-end retail is still doing fine. People want the luxury purchasing experience to be luxurious -- they'd rather buy their luxury goods in boutiques than get them delivered in a cardboard box from Amazon. Part of that may simply be wariness about spending a lot of money on stuff that's going to be shipped and could be lost, but that's not all. Owning the luxury goods themselves is only part of the experience -- being treated well during the purchase and during future customer service interactions is a big part of the draw of luxury items. You don't get that from most online retailers.
- GeneralMayhem 9y ago
  I think the bigger part is that a lot of luxury goods are very hard to select without seeing them in person. Clothes are an obvious one, since you wouldn't want to buy them without trying them on (and, at the higher end, getting them tailored). But the same goes for all sorts of fashion products - leather, handbags, jewelry... you don't know whether it's what you want until you can try it on, feel the material, and see the true color.
  - celim307 9y ago
    Very true, and staff at these places offer an experience. They curate a specific look for you and are subject matter experts. I went to a high end dispensary and the experience vs a more basic one was more than worth the premium
  - ijidak 9y ago
    And the fear of counterfeit. Buy a $100 handbag and maybe it's counterfeit, oh well. Buy a $2,000 handbag and maybe it's counterfeit, unacceptable. Except for dedicated online outlets delivered by the luxury brand itself, which luxury brands are no doubt loathe to do (e.g. why cannibalize my own stores, when no other company distributes my brand anyway), I doubt people would ever buy specific high-end brands they covet online without some serious guarantees of authenticity. But again as a high end exclusive brand, why do I want to make it easier to buy my exclusive goods online?
- skellera 9y ago
  Unless you buy that kind of stuff, you don't really know how well they treat you in those situations. You are literally a client of the sales person, not just some shopper. They keep in touch, they let you know when things that you might like come in, just all around amazing service. Obviously that comes with the cost.
  - xxpor 9y ago
    That honestly sounds like a nightmare. The last thing I want when shopping is to be hassled by salespeople.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - MiddleEndian 9y ago
      Agreed. I recently went to a store like this to purchase a light fixture where I continuously had to interact with a salesperson who referred to their customers as "clients" and I quickly became exhausted. I will purchase my light fixture online or perhaps Home Depot.
    - skellera 9y ago
      It isn't "hassled." The way sales people interact with you at normal stores is nothing like the interaction at a higher end store. If you don't want to be bothered in a high end store, you aren't bothered.
  - dillondoyle 9y ago
    Really good stores and salespeople are magic and I totally buy into their illusion. I love going to the Gucci store it's kind of the pinnacle of service you can't get online. 1:1 salesperson follows you and helps pick out pieces and pull sizes, usually with sparkling water to take your time. As you mention you can build a relationship past one transaction. They always compliment: you look great, good fit, makes you look skinny, etc. Really good salespeople pick up on your style and provide actual good direction. Sometimes I'll get this is the last size we have in the US type tactic, which for most stores would be total BS to me right away but for them I almost buy it (Gucci does intentional small runs to sell out now it seems). The psychology of it works (for me at least) even if you know they're tricking you to spend more (less deceitful hard to describe, like massaging you with dopamine into spending more $)! That's the magic. I always go in with one specific item in mind that I researched online but never leave with just one thing... I recently saw that Intuit is now offering a live 'accountant' videoconference to fill out your turbotax. I wonder how far off we are from using some AR/VR and live person to facilitate more of this in person shopping service remotely.
- paulcole 9y ago
  > People want the luxury purchasing experience to be luxurious -- they'd rather buy their luxury goods in boutiques than get them delivered in a cardboard box from Amazon. Just curious, did you look at the article? This is one of the main points in it.
- Animats 9y ago
  It's that mindset that leads many semi-rich people to bankruptcy. Most NFL and NBA athletes go bust after their athletic career. You can only spend about 4% a year of what you've got.
  - twblalock 9y ago
    Athletes don't go bankrupt because they buy expensive things. They go bankrupt because their family, friends, and financial advisors take advantage of them and siphon off their money for their own purposes.
    - hueving 9y ago
      Of course they do. They buy cars, boats, restaurants, etc that all plummet in value.
      - twblalock 9y ago
        Yeah, but they do that because their corrupt financial advisors tell them to, and enrich themselves on the fees.
        hueving 9y ago
        There is no financial advisor suggesting the purchase of boats or cars.
- icantdrive55 9y ago
  High-end retail boutiques will do just fine because the rich love to buy. Especially new money. They literally think their luxury cars are cool. And how do you get a wife, if you don't showcase your wealth? Personally, I would like to close up the rich boy clause in citizenship clause. (Note: This eyesore is in Miami. They could cut off Miami from the United States, and only foreigners would notice. I think I'll get creamed for this post. Don't care for the wealthy, and that goes double for the thieving foreigners who escape here with their wad.)
acheron 9y ago
Since the title doesn't tell you, it's about Bal Harbour Shops in Miami Beach, though others are name-checked too.
indescions_2018 9y ago
Bal Harbour is chic no question. With excellent people (and autos) watching ;) But the "vias" in Palm Beach off of Worth Avenue are much more charming. And the conversation much more stimulating!
martingordon 9y ago
I grew up five minutes from Bal Harbour Shops and thought it was a pretty terrible mall all throughout my childhood since it had no arcade, KB Toys, or Electronics Boutique. It’s pretty amazing how it and Aventura Mall continue to grow. I guess Latin America hasn’t gotten the message that retail is dead (in reality, a flight to Miami and an empty suitcase is a bargain compared to the prices folks see at home).
- mpetrovich 9y ago
  I used to live in Surfside, which is right next door to the Bal Harbour Shops. Hard to tell from photos, but the mall is TINY. Also, the foot traffic is really light. Most people seem to hang out at the few cafés or restaurants. But I suppose with prices like that, they need a lot less traffic to pay rent.
  - themark 9y ago
    You mentioned them hanging out at restaurants. I think malls are reinventing themselves into destinations for high end cuisine more than retail. This is a place where people go to see and be seen, no better place for that than a bar/restaurant.
    - goshx 9y ago
      I agree with you. I’ve been to Bal Harbour Shops multiple times to eat and hangout at Carpaccio. I’ve never purchased anything from the stores. I see other malls in Miami bulding new restaurants.
  - martingordon 9y ago
    Small world! I grew up in Surfside (from 1991 until I left for college in 2003).
cyberpunk0 9y ago
Why wouldn't rich people be doing fine while everyone else suffers? They've exploited and sucked up the wealth from everyone else, desolating entire populations to enrich themselves while quality of life nose dives and the environment is further raped and poisoned in order to extract resources to be manufacturered and sold to 'consumers'.
flyGuyOnTheSly 9y ago
High end malls in the GTA are the only ones expanding currently as well. Yorkdale and Square One are pretty much complete with their massive new buildouts.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
phnofive 9y ago
If nothing else, don’t miss the mini management game: https://www.bloomberg.com/features/american-mall-game/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/american-mall-game/ I’m always happy to see these kinds of games accompany articles as a different way of communicating the message (like the one for driving a rideshare).
- 2sk21 9y ago
  This was really fascinating. This game just confirmed the patterns that I have seen in declining Malls
aj7 9y ago
The money the 5% have is expanding.
- CodeWriter23 9y ago
  Not as fast a the money of the 0.5%.
Animats 9y ago
Check out the Stanford mall. Sign at food store: "Champagne and caviar - enjoy them tonight". Or, as I once overheard from a female freshman, "Did you know this place has a totally awesome mall?"
baus 9y ago
I think malls in FL in general are doing ok because of the tourists from Latin America. This is just an anecdotal observation, but The Florida Mall in Orlando is always filled with Brazilian and other Latin American tourists looking to find a deal in the US
- goshx 9y ago
  Yes, spanish and portuguese is all you hear when walking through the malls in South Florida.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
loopdoend 9y ago
The Bal Harbour shops are honestly done. Miami Design District has literally transformed Miami into the Mecca of fashion shopping. Anyone who has their things in a twist about Bal Harbour after all these years has some kind of old beef or something going on. S@BH are already over. Miami Design District has put a total end to Bal Harbour. It has no hope. Take a trip to Miami, go to NE 40th and NE 1st and then let me know about how great Bal Harbour is. It's over.
- fastball 9y ago
  Would you like to say the same thing in a different way one more time?
  - loopdoend 9y ago
    Repetition makes reputation and reputation makes customers.
    - fastball 9y ago
      Are you a Markov Chain?
- cylinder 9y ago
  Your writing is confusing. Your first sentence should have been structured as such: The Bal Harbour shops are honestly done for. or, Honestly, the Bal Harbour shops are done.
  - loopdoend 9y ago
    Honestly, you're right.
- sho 9y ago
  > Miami Design District has literally transformed Miami into the Mecca of fashion shopping. Lol no it hasn't. It wouldn't even be number one in the USA, let alone globally. Just having a few high-end stores doesn't make Miami a "Mecca" of anything. Maybe South Americans fly to Miami specifically for fashion shopping but no-one else would, not even from within the US.
peterwwillis 9y ago
I saw the title and I thought, "Bal Harbor Shops is expanding?" Yep. This article leaves out one of the more bizarre parts of Bal Harbor to me. As you drive around, you mainly notice three things: really expensive shops, super-expensive cars, and families of Orthodox Jews. When I lived in South Florida, somebody once explained to me that the orthodox Jews lived in a different area nearby until they were pushed into North Miami Beach. Around the mid-1980s, they successfully sued the local government to remove racist laws preventing black and Jewish people from moving into the neighborhood (though it would appear something prevented any black people from moving in). The Sephardic Jewish population in this absolutely tiny, super-rich "village" between Miami Bay and the Atlantic Ocean is growing so much, they just spent $20 Million to expand their one shul. The power of the local orthodox Jewish population is such that they recently passed a local ordinance to include "criticism of Israel" as a potential hate crime. It's hard for me to not sound really racist while describing this, but it really is strange to go through the entirety of Miami/Dade and nearby counties and cities, which is basically mostly full of caribbean and latino people, and then hit this super-rich exclusive pocket of real estate, which just happens to be super Orthodox and European. It's just weird. (The only other area nearby that I know of that has a similar population is Hollywood, Florida, though I have no idea why)
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

84 points by lnguyen 9y ago

I'm not surprised that high-end retail is still doing fine. People want the luxury purchasing experience to be luxurious -- they'd rather buy their luxury goods in boutiques than get them delivered in a cardboard box from Amazon. Part of that may simply be wariness about spending a lot of money on stuff that's going to be shipped and could be lost, but that's not all. Owning the luxury goods themselves is only part of the experience -- being treated well during the purchase and during future customer service interactions is a big part of the draw of luxury items. You don't get that from most online retailers.

GeneralMayhem 9y ago
I think the bigger part is that a lot of luxury goods are very hard to select without seeing them in person. Clothes are an obvious one, since you wouldn't want to buy them without trying them on (and, at the higher end, getting them tailored). But the same goes for all sorts of fashion products - leather, handbags, jewelry... you don't know whether it's what you want until you can try it on, feel the material, and see the true color.
- celim307 9y ago
  Very true, and staff at these places offer an experience. They curate a specific look for you and are subject matter experts. I went to a high end dispensary and the experience vs a more basic one was more than worth the premium
- ijidak 9y ago
  And the fear of counterfeit. Buy a $100 handbag and maybe it's counterfeit, oh well. Buy a $2,000 handbag and maybe it's counterfeit, unacceptable. Except for dedicated online outlets delivered by the luxury brand itself, which luxury brands are no doubt loathe to do (e.g. why cannibalize my own stores, when no other company distributes my brand anyway), I doubt people would ever buy specific high-end brands they covet online without some serious guarantees of authenticity. But again as a high end exclusive brand, why do I want to make it easier to buy my exclusive goods online?
skellera 9y ago
Unless you buy that kind of stuff, you don't really know how well they treat you in those situations. You are literally a client of the sales person, not just some shopper. They keep in touch, they let you know when things that you might like come in, just all around amazing service. Obviously that comes with the cost.
- xxpor 9y ago
  That honestly sounds like a nightmare. The last thing I want when shopping is to be hassled by salespeople.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - MiddleEndian 9y ago
    Agreed. I recently went to a store like this to purchase a light fixture where I continuously had to interact with a salesperson who referred to their customers as "clients" and I quickly became exhausted. I will purchase my light fixture online or perhaps Home Depot.
  - skellera 9y ago
    It isn't "hassled." The way sales people interact with you at normal stores is nothing like the interaction at a higher end store. If you don't want to be bothered in a high end store, you aren't bothered.
- dillondoyle 9y ago
  Really good stores and salespeople are magic and I totally buy into their illusion. I love going to the Gucci store it's kind of the pinnacle of service you can't get online. 1:1 salesperson follows you and helps pick out pieces and pull sizes, usually with sparkling water to take your time. As you mention you can build a relationship past one transaction. They always compliment: you look great, good fit, makes you look skinny, etc. Really good salespeople pick up on your style and provide actual good direction. Sometimes I'll get this is the last size we have in the US type tactic, which for most stores would be total BS to me right away but for them I almost buy it (Gucci does intentional small runs to sell out now it seems). The psychology of it works (for me at least) even if you know they're tricking you to spend more (less deceitful hard to describe, like massaging you with dopamine into spending more $)! That's the magic. I always go in with one specific item in mind that I researched online but never leave with just one thing... I recently saw that Intuit is now offering a live 'accountant' videoconference to fill out your turbotax. I wonder how far off we are from using some AR/VR and live person to facilitate more of this in person shopping service remotely.
paulcole 9y ago
> People want the luxury purchasing experience to be luxurious -- they'd rather buy their luxury goods in boutiques than get them delivered in a cardboard box from Amazon. Just curious, did you look at the article? This is one of the main points in it.
Animats 9y ago
It's that mindset that leads many semi-rich people to bankruptcy. Most NFL and NBA athletes go bust after their athletic career. You can only spend about 4% a year of what you've got.
- twblalock 9y ago
  Athletes don't go bankrupt because they buy expensive things. They go bankrupt because their family, friends, and financial advisors take advantage of them and siphon off their money for their own purposes.
  - hueving 9y ago
    Of course they do. They buy cars, boats, restaurants, etc that all plummet in value.
    - twblalock 9y ago
      Yeah, but they do that because their corrupt financial advisors tell them to, and enrich themselves on the fees.
      - hueving 9y ago
        There is no financial advisor suggesting the purchase of boats or cars.
icantdrive55 9y ago
High-end retail boutiques will do just fine because the rich love to buy. Especially new money. They literally think their luxury cars are cool. And how do you get a wife, if you don't showcase your wealth? Personally, I would like to close up the rich boy clause in citizenship clause. (Note: This eyesore is in Miami. They could cut off Miami from the United States, and only foreigners would notice. I think I'll get creamed for this post. Don't care for the wealthy, and that goes double for the thieving foreigners who escape here with their wad.)

acheron 9y ago

Since the title doesn't tell you, it's about Bal Harbour Shops in Miami Beach, though others are name-checked too.

indescions_2018 9y ago

Bal Harbour is chic no question. With excellent people (and autos) watching ;) But the "vias" in Palm Beach off of Worth Avenue are much more charming. And the conversation much more stimulating!

martingordon 9y ago

I grew up five minutes from Bal Harbour Shops and thought it was a pretty terrible mall all throughout my childhood since it had no arcade, KB Toys, or Electronics Boutique. It’s pretty amazing how it and Aventura Mall continue to grow. I guess Latin America hasn’t gotten the message that retail is dead (in reality, a flight to Miami and an empty suitcase is a bargain compared to the prices folks see at home).

mpetrovich 9y ago
I used to live in Surfside, which is right next door to the Bal Harbour Shops. Hard to tell from photos, but the mall is TINY. Also, the foot traffic is really light. Most people seem to hang out at the few cafés or restaurants. But I suppose with prices like that, they need a lot less traffic to pay rent.
- themark 9y ago
  You mentioned them hanging out at restaurants. I think malls are reinventing themselves into destinations for high end cuisine more than retail. This is a place where people go to see and be seen, no better place for that than a bar/restaurant.
  - goshx 9y ago
    I agree with you. I’ve been to Bal Harbour Shops multiple times to eat and hangout at Carpaccio. I’ve never purchased anything from the stores. I see other malls in Miami bulding new restaurants.
- martingordon 9y ago
  Small world! I grew up in Surfside (from 1991 until I left for college in 2003).

cyberpunk0 9y ago

Why wouldn't rich people be doing fine while everyone else suffers? They've exploited and sucked up the wealth from everyone else, desolating entire populations to enrich themselves while quality of life nose dives and the environment is further raped and poisoned in order to extract resources to be manufacturered and sold to 'consumers'.

flyGuyOnTheSly 9y ago

High end malls in the GTA are the only ones expanding currently as well. Yorkdale and Square One are pretty much complete with their massive new buildouts.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

phnofive 9y ago

If nothing else, don’t miss the mini management game: https://www.bloomberg.com/features/american-mall-game/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/american-mall-game/ I’m always happy to see these kinds of games accompany articles as a different way of communicating the message (like the one for driving a rideshare).

2sk21 9y ago
This was really fascinating. This game just confirmed the patterns that I have seen in declining Malls

aj7 9y ago

The money the 5% have is expanding.

CodeWriter23 9y ago
Not as fast a the money of the 0.5%.

Animats 9y ago

Check out the Stanford mall. Sign at food store: "Champagne and caviar - enjoy them tonight". Or, as I once overheard from a female freshman, "Did you know this place has a totally awesome mall?"

baus 9y ago

I think malls in FL in general are doing ok because of the tourists from Latin America. This is just an anecdotal observation, but The Florida Mall in Orlando is always filled with Brazilian and other Latin American tourists looking to find a deal in the US

goshx 9y ago
Yes, spanish and portuguese is all you hear when walking through the malls in South Florida.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

loopdoend 9y ago

The Bal Harbour shops are honestly done. Miami Design District has literally transformed Miami into the Mecca of fashion shopping. Anyone who has their things in a twist about Bal Harbour after all these years has some kind of old beef or something going on. S@BH are already over. Miami Design District has put a total end to Bal Harbour. It has no hope. Take a trip to Miami, go to NE 40th and NE 1st and then let me know about how great Bal Harbour is. It's over.

fastball 9y ago
Would you like to say the same thing in a different way one more time?
- loopdoend 9y ago
  Repetition makes reputation and reputation makes customers.
  - fastball 9y ago
    Are you a Markov Chain?
cylinder 9y ago
Your writing is confusing. Your first sentence should have been structured as such: The Bal Harbour shops are honestly done for. or, Honestly, the Bal Harbour shops are done.
- loopdoend 9y ago
  Honestly, you're right.
sho 9y ago
> Miami Design District has literally transformed Miami into the Mecca of fashion shopping. Lol no it hasn't. It wouldn't even be number one in the USA, let alone globally. Just having a few high-end stores doesn't make Miami a "Mecca" of anything. Maybe South Americans fly to Miami specifically for fashion shopping but no-one else would, not even from within the US.

peterwwillis 9y ago

I saw the title and I thought, "Bal Harbor Shops is expanding?" Yep. This article leaves out one of the more bizarre parts of Bal Harbor to me. As you drive around, you mainly notice three things: really expensive shops, super-expensive cars, and families of Orthodox Jews. When I lived in South Florida, somebody once explained to me that the orthodox Jews lived in a different area nearby until they were pushed into North Miami Beach. Around the mid-1980s, they successfully sued the local government to remove racist laws preventing black and Jewish people from moving into the neighborhood (though it would appear something prevented any black people from moving in). The Sephardic Jewish population in this absolutely tiny, super-rich "village" between Miami Bay and the Atlantic Ocean is growing so much, they just spent $20 Million to expand their one shul. The power of the local orthodox Jewish population is such that they recently passed a local ordinance to include "criticism of Israel" as a potential hate crime. It's hard for me to not sound really racist while describing this, but it really is strange to go through the entirety of Miami/Dade and nearby counties and cities, which is basically mostly full of caribbean and latino people, and then hit this super-rich exclusive pocket of real estate, which just happens to be super Orthodox and European. It's just weird. (The only other area nearby that I know of that has a similar population is Hollywood, Florida, though I have no idea why)

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]