3 ms·

Yes, they do both control a lot of information that people see, BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making change

by wpasc 9y ago

Yes, they do both control a lot of information that people see, BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making changes. Not saying they're doing it perfectly or even well, but still. On the other hand Tobacco companies for years lied about the risks and promoted false science Energy companies regularly fund climate change denial organizations (see Heartland Institute) Monsanto sends detectives after farmers who get tangled with them (https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farmerssued.php https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farme...) Tyson, Purdue regularly keep chicken farmers in poverty and silenced about chicken farming conditions. Volkswagen created emission cheating software to hide their emissions... Again, tech companies aren't great and control a lot of information, but what about the food we eat and the air we breathe?

Tyrek 9y ago
While I do agree that all these areas need regulatory improvements, I feel like you're falling into the what-about-ism trap. I personally feel like increased regulatory scrutiny about tech companies (i.e. regulating information) would be a strong first step in allowing society to then regulate the other industries that you mentioned.
- wpasc 9y ago
  I think you make a good point about what-about-ism. Unfortunately, the attention of regulators, the U.S. government, and the media is a rival good and areas of focus are definitely mutually exclusive. It's a sad fact of the national attention span, but still likely a fact.
ameister14 9y ago
Every one of those other companies is incredibly heavily regulated. >Tobacco companies for years lied about the risks and promoted false science And were punished severely, rightly so. They paid out billions. >Energy companies regularly fund climate change denial organizations (see Heartland Institute) This is difficult to solve within the existing legal infrastructure and might require a constitutional amendment >Monsanto sends detectives after farmers who get tangled with them (https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farme... https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farme...) I'm not sure that should be illegal - they sued the farmers and lawyers use investigators. >Tyson, Purdue regularly keep chicken farmers in poverty and silenced about chicken farming conditions. This should be more regulated and there are serious calls to do so. >Volkswagen created emission cheating software to hide their emissions... And are now paying billions for it.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
s73v3r_ 9y ago
I'm seeing you listing bad companies, but I'm not seeing a reason not to regulate the big tech ones. Not to mention, it's not like the government can't do both at once. Most of those industries you mentioned have other departments that regulate them.
CaptainZapp 9y ago
BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making changes I can't rid myself of the impression that such changes are only applied to avoid the hammer coming down. For example : Facebook gave exactly zero fucks about harrassing - or hate posts in specific markets despite the fact that such posts were illegal in such markets. Only when Germany started to crack down severely you saw change. Same with other tech companies. Uber and Airbnb don't only not give a shit they actively flout the law and you only see changes in their behavior when the hammer of the law threatened to come crashing down. While I agree with your examples that doesn't mean that we should give tech companies a pass. Rotten (and potentially illegal) behavior is hurting us all for the benefits of very, very few. I'm glad, that Europe is at least trying to put a stop at the most egregious behavior. The US seems more inclined to give a pass even when borderline crimninal behavior is involved. (Equifax?)
Slansitartop 9y ago
It's not society can only pursue one bad actor at a time. This is a tech forum so we're going to focus on the tech side. Also, I would say the flow if information is a more pressing priority, because its vital to solving those other problems as well. Imagine a future Facebook that takes a payoff from Monsanto to opaquely bury all criticism of it. > BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making changes. Not saying they're doing it perfectly or even well, but still. Facebook's algorithm tweaks don't solve the problem of its market position and dominance.
- edraferi 9y ago
  There ARE real limits to regulatory capacity though. - Major merger approvals tie up DC for months at a time. - The SEC is perpetually unable to keep up with Wall Streets’ shenanigans - Major procurement programs like the F35 dominate the military’s buying capacity Etc etc

by wpasc 9y ago

Tyrek 9y ago

While I do agree that all these areas need regulatory improvements, I feel like you're falling into the what-about-ism trap. I personally feel like increased regulatory scrutiny about tech companies (i.e. regulating information) would be a strong first step in allowing society to then regulate the other industries that you mentioned.

wpasc 9y ago
I think you make a good point about what-about-ism. Unfortunately, the attention of regulators, the U.S. government, and the media is a rival good and areas of focus are definitely mutually exclusive. It's a sad fact of the national attention span, but still likely a fact.

ameister14 9y ago

Every one of those other companies is incredibly heavily regulated. >Tobacco companies for years lied about the risks and promoted false science And were punished severely, rightly so. They paid out billions. >Energy companies regularly fund climate change denial organizations (see Heartland Institute) This is difficult to solve within the existing legal infrastructure and might require a constitutional amendment >Monsanto sends detectives after farmers who get tangled with them (https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farme... https://www.organicconsumers.org/old_articles/Monsanto/farme...) I'm not sure that should be illegal - they sued the farmers and lawyers use investigators. >Tyson, Purdue regularly keep chicken farmers in poverty and silenced about chicken farming conditions. This should be more regulated and there are serious calls to do so. >Volkswagen created emission cheating software to hide their emissions... And are now paying billions for it.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

s73v3r_ 9y ago

I'm seeing you listing bad companies, but I'm not seeing a reason not to regulate the big tech ones. Not to mention, it's not like the government can't do both at once. Most of those industries you mentioned have other departments that regulate them.

CaptainZapp 9y ago

BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making changes I can't rid myself of the impression that such changes are only applied to avoid the hammer coming down. For example : Facebook gave exactly zero fucks about harrassing - or hate posts in specific markets despite the fact that such posts were illegal in such markets. Only when Germany started to crack down severely you saw change. Same with other tech companies. Uber and Airbnb don't only not give a shit they actively flout the law and you only see changes in their behavior when the hammer of the law threatened to come crashing down. While I agree with your examples that doesn't mean that we should give tech companies a pass. Rotten (and potentially illegal) behavior is hurting us all for the benefits of very, very few. I'm glad, that Europe is at least trying to put a stop at the most egregious behavior. The US seems more inclined to give a pass even when borderline crimninal behavior is involved. (Equifax?)

Slansitartop 9y ago

It's not society can only pursue one bad actor at a time. This is a tech forum so we're going to focus on the tech side. Also, I would say the flow if information is a more pressing priority, because its vital to solving those other problems as well. Imagine a future Facebook that takes a payoff from Monsanto to opaquely bury all criticism of it. > BUT Facebook already changed their news feed algorithm and many tech companies are making changes. Not saying they're doing it perfectly or even well, but still. Facebook's algorithm tweaks don't solve the problem of its market position and dominance.

edraferi 9y ago
There ARE real limits to regulatory capacity though. - Major merger approvals tie up DC for months at a time. - The SEC is perpetually unable to keep up with Wall Streets’ shenanigans - Major procurement programs like the F35 dominate the military’s buying capacity Etc etc