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I'm not sure which post-communist countries you're talking about, but at least in my country virtually every job offer gives you a choice: full time employment

by mamon 9y ago

I'm not sure which post-communist countries you're talking about, but at least in my country virtually every job offer gives you a choice: full time employment or self-employment contract with daily rate. And for your employer/agency it usually does not matter which one you choose. For you it matters because self-employment get's you 30-50% higher salary, thanks to lower taxes and social security payments. And daily rates in self employment are usually around 250-300 Euro (for senior roles), so you can almost match Western European salaries.

DyslexicAtheist 9y ago
I'm currently living in Eastern EU (actually one of the cheapest of all the Eastern-EU markets) and there hardly are any jobs to begin with. The "good" people here know their value and all have left the country so sadly there is a massive brain drain. There is a huge difference between bringing added value as a consultant that sees a new environment / incl all its challenges, every 3-6 months, and those remote workers peddling their service on upwork.com / freelance.com. Those who sell only their coding fall into this category while those who sell their know-how will be way above that rate. If you want to compete on price (and always stay there work via upwork & Co) but if you want to separate yourself from the rest some legwork isn't optional. Just because somebody is a freelancer and writes an invoice (to the same client) every month doesn't add value to most clients. And so this doesn't get anywhere near the rates you get if you carve out your niche and name for yourself. If you work with 2 or 3 agencies w/ changing clients every 12-18 months then you are already in a sweet spot.
slavoingilizov 9y ago
You ignore the value of all benefits you get from full time employment. The 30-50% salary is not that rosy in reality. You're assuming that you don't contribute to a pension, pay out of pocket for every expense if any, additional cost of transportation, gym membership etc. Many full time employees get these by default. So you're over-simplifying and distorting the size of the difference. In addition, self-employment has an added cost to do all admin (accounting, tax returns, communication and negotiation, etc.). The devs I know hate that, so you're just getting more money by doing extra shitty work (from one perspective at least). Apples and oranges.
- mamon 9y ago
  Accounting and stuff costs you around 40$ per month, so that's negligible. Gym membership? that's maybe another 40$. Not to mention that you get tax credit for those, and other business-related expenses. Pension plans are all government-sponsored Ponzi schemes, so I wouldn't count on them anyway, but if you insist then paying your own, private pension fund is hell lot cheaper than state-owned one. The only significant downside of self-employment is that you can't get paid vacation so easily, but still it is possible to negotiate some. All things considered, the only thing that could force me to sign full-time employment contract would be a gun put to my head.

by mamon 9y ago

DyslexicAtheist 9y ago

I'm currently living in Eastern EU (actually one of the cheapest of all the Eastern-EU markets) and there hardly are any jobs to begin with. The "good" people here know their value and all have left the country so sadly there is a massive brain drain. There is a huge difference between bringing added value as a consultant that sees a new environment / incl all its challenges, every 3-6 months, and those remote workers peddling their service on upwork.com / freelance.com. Those who sell only their coding fall into this category while those who sell their know-how will be way above that rate. If you want to compete on price (and always stay there work via upwork & Co) but if you want to separate yourself from the rest some legwork isn't optional. Just because somebody is a freelancer and writes an invoice (to the same client) every month doesn't add value to most clients. And so this doesn't get anywhere near the rates you get if you carve out your niche and name for yourself. If you work with 2 or 3 agencies w/ changing clients every 12-18 months then you are already in a sweet spot.

slavoingilizov 9y ago

You ignore the value of all benefits you get from full time employment. The 30-50% salary is not that rosy in reality. You're assuming that you don't contribute to a pension, pay out of pocket for every expense if any, additional cost of transportation, gym membership etc. Many full time employees get these by default. So you're over-simplifying and distorting the size of the difference. In addition, self-employment has an added cost to do all admin (accounting, tax returns, communication and negotiation, etc.). The devs I know hate that, so you're just getting more money by doing extra shitty work (from one perspective at least). Apples and oranges.

mamon 9y ago
Accounting and stuff costs you around 40$ per month, so that's negligible. Gym membership? that's maybe another 40$. Not to mention that you get tax credit for those, and other business-related expenses. Pension plans are all government-sponsored Ponzi schemes, so I wouldn't count on them anyway, but if you insist then paying your own, private pension fund is hell lot cheaper than state-owned one. The only significant downside of self-employment is that you can't get paid vacation so easily, but still it is possible to negotiate some. All things considered, the only thing that could force me to sign full-time employment contract would be a gun put to my head.