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I would love it if somebody would make a guide to create a "privacy car": disabling OnStar, shutting off all telematics that manufacturers put into the navigati

I would love it if somebody would make a guide to create a "privacy car": disabling OnStar, shutting off all telematics that manufacturers put into the navigation and infotainment systems, changing or disabling the serial numbers in the tire-pressure monitoring system, and similar things. I imagine that this would need to be model-specific, but I'm amenable to choosing a new car based the availability of a privacy hack, the same as developers who choose their computers/phones/routers based on availability of firmware replacement and known jailbreaks.

daveguy 9y ago
Privacy Car = classic car. Or even just a bit older car. If it's from the 90s and before it probably won't be able to track you. Of course, it will probably be less safe in a crash too.
- woolvalley 9y ago
  How many cars that are not GM with their on star system & tesla have remote access? That cell phone SIM plan costs some money.
  - bbarn 9y ago
    My 2018 VW has "car-net" I believe, which is the same thing. Built in button on the roof panel that calls someone instantly.
    - carlmr 9y ago
      car calls the cloud, the clouds are in the sky, sky-net
  - daveguy 9y ago
    That's a good point. You can definitely choose cars that are both more recent than 20 years old and do not have tracking. I have a car from 2011 and I didn't even feel the need to consider tracking when I got it 4 years ago.
joering2 9y ago
My neighbor has a small parking lot in his backyard with 10 old cars. Everyone calls it "junk yard" because all his cars are old with chipping off paint, dusty windshields, etc. The ironic part is that most of those cars have such basic electronics, that EMP hits us, he is the only one comfortably driving off on four wheels. Everyone else will need bicycles, horses, or plain walk.
bonestamp2 9y ago
I agree that would be cool, although with 2018+ cars this is going to get very difficult. Manufacturers are starting to encrypt bus traffic and add firewalls that will prevent unauthorized communication between certain ECUs and from the J1962 connector (aka "OBDII Port"). I work for an auto supplier that supplies vehicle communication software, so I can confirm first hand that some 2018 vehicles currently on sale already have these firewalls: http://www.bosch-mobility-solutions.com/en/products-and-services/passenger-cars-and-light-commercial-vehicles/connectivity-solutions/central-gateway-cgw/ http://www.bosch-mobility-solutions.com/en/products-and-serv...
- StillBored 9y ago
  Which is to keep the evil hackers out, but has the additional benefit that they can have a captive market for a $100 part that would normally be $1. The aftermarket suppliers are locked out of the market because they don't have the private keys to handshake on the bus. (happily keeping my late 90's car running, although my most recent car literally has gone 100k miles with _NOTHING_ but oil, tires and brake pads). Its now at its first service interval and I'm wondering if I should just trade it in before anything breaks.
  - millzlane 9y ago
    I'd keep it until the wheels fell off. I had a 91 Nissan that had very few problems unlike my 13' vw tdi. I'm not excited about the future of automobiles for people that like driving and repairing their own vehicles. With countries legislating gas burning vehicles it's likely to increase the production of electric vehicles and most likely self driving vehicles. Which is great if you want to live a couple hours away and sleep on the way in to work. But imagine the vehicle malfunctioning for something like a simple cold start issue that can be resolved with a can of starter fluid. A quick trip to the part store turns into a month in the service center. Not excited at all.
  - bonestamp2 9y ago
    > The aftermarket suppliers are locked out of the market because they don't have the private keys to handshake on the bus. That is a potential problem, especially for "hacker" type suppliers (offering performance components for example). That said, the manufacturer I work with sells their diagnostic tool to the aftermarket, so at least aftermarket garages can get access for repairs.
staron88 9y ago
There may not be a guide, but I would think general rules are to avoid OnStar, navigation systems, cellular-to-WiFi, etc. I heard about the TPMS/RFID stuff. It seems like there is so much we just can't find out without manufacturers telling their secrets or tearing down our cars. Also, one thing I really want to know is what happens to all the data from frontal collision warning systems, rear view cameras, etc. I wish there was in-depth information about this what manufacturers do. I found an article but it is light on datails.[1] [1]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2018/01/15/big-brother-on-wheels-why-your-car-company-may-know-more-about-you-than-your-spouse/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2018/01/1...
totalZero 9y ago
Step 1. Buy an old car. On a similar note... Eventually some genius consultant for an automaker will earn a handsome bonus for introducing the idea of a secure car: one with no network or wireless functionality whatsoever.

daveguy 9y ago

Privacy Car = classic car. Or even just a bit older car. If it's from the 90s and before it probably won't be able to track you. Of course, it will probably be less safe in a crash too.

woolvalley 9y ago
How many cars that are not GM with their on star system & tesla have remote access? That cell phone SIM plan costs some money.
- bbarn 9y ago
  My 2018 VW has "car-net" I believe, which is the same thing. Built in button on the roof panel that calls someone instantly.
  - carlmr 9y ago
    car calls the cloud, the clouds are in the sky, sky-net
- daveguy 9y ago
  That's a good point. You can definitely choose cars that are both more recent than 20 years old and do not have tracking. I have a car from 2011 and I didn't even feel the need to consider tracking when I got it 4 years ago.

joering2 9y ago

My neighbor has a small parking lot in his backyard with 10 old cars. Everyone calls it "junk yard" because all his cars are old with chipping off paint, dusty windshields, etc. The ironic part is that most of those cars have such basic electronics, that EMP hits us, he is the only one comfortably driving off on four wheels. Everyone else will need bicycles, horses, or plain walk.

bonestamp2 9y ago

I agree that would be cool, although with 2018+ cars this is going to get very difficult. Manufacturers are starting to encrypt bus traffic and add firewalls that will prevent unauthorized communication between certain ECUs and from the J1962 connector (aka "OBDII Port"). I work for an auto supplier that supplies vehicle communication software, so I can confirm first hand that some 2018 vehicles currently on sale already have these firewalls: http://www.bosch-mobility-solutions.com/en/products-and-services/passenger-cars-and-light-commercial-vehicles/connectivity-solutions/central-gateway-cgw/ http://www.bosch-mobility-solutions.com/en/products-and-serv...

StillBored 9y ago
Which is to keep the evil hackers out, but has the additional benefit that they can have a captive market for a $100 part that would normally be $1. The aftermarket suppliers are locked out of the market because they don't have the private keys to handshake on the bus. (happily keeping my late 90's car running, although my most recent car literally has gone 100k miles with _NOTHING_ but oil, tires and brake pads). Its now at its first service interval and I'm wondering if I should just trade it in before anything breaks.
- millzlane 9y ago
  I'd keep it until the wheels fell off. I had a 91 Nissan that had very few problems unlike my 13' vw tdi. I'm not excited about the future of automobiles for people that like driving and repairing their own vehicles. With countries legislating gas burning vehicles it's likely to increase the production of electric vehicles and most likely self driving vehicles. Which is great if you want to live a couple hours away and sleep on the way in to work. But imagine the vehicle malfunctioning for something like a simple cold start issue that can be resolved with a can of starter fluid. A quick trip to the part store turns into a month in the service center. Not excited at all.
- bonestamp2 9y ago
  > The aftermarket suppliers are locked out of the market because they don't have the private keys to handshake on the bus. That is a potential problem, especially for "hacker" type suppliers (offering performance components for example). That said, the manufacturer I work with sells their diagnostic tool to the aftermarket, so at least aftermarket garages can get access for repairs.

staron88 9y ago

There may not be a guide, but I would think general rules are to avoid OnStar, navigation systems, cellular-to-WiFi, etc. I heard about the TPMS/RFID stuff. It seems like there is so much we just can't find out without manufacturers telling their secrets or tearing down our cars. Also, one thing I really want to know is what happens to all the data from frontal collision warning systems, rear view cameras, etc. I wish there was in-depth information about this what manufacturers do. I found an article but it is light on datails.[1] [1]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2018/01/15/big-brother-on-wheels-why-your-car-company-may-know-more-about-you-than-your-spouse/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2018/01/1...

totalZero 9y ago

Step 1. Buy an old car. On a similar note... Eventually some genius consultant for an automaker will earn a handsome bonus for introducing the idea of a secure car: one with no network or wireless functionality whatsoever.