4 ms·

Strict restrictions? I can chose whatever hospital I want and the government will pay for it regardless as long as a GP has referred me to them. If you want you

by tyfon 9y ago

Strict restrictions? I can chose whatever hospital I want and the government will pay for it regardless as long as a GP has referred me to them. If you want you can just pay out of your pocket as well without going through a GP. There is even a portal where you can search for your ailment and choose hospital (private or public) based on their waiting lists. https://helsenorge.no/velg-behandlingssted https://helsenorge.no/velg-behandlingssted The government also buys up a lot of the private spots to reduce public waiting lists. Last time I was in due to sinus infection, I went to a private and a public clinic both paid for in full by the government.

ucaetano 9y ago
Restrictions aren't just on users, but on providers as well. If you don't see restrictions as an user, it's because most of the restrictions are on the providers. And nothing wrong with that, I actually support that model, just like in Switzerland, where healthcare is private, but mandated by the government and heavily regulated (with less-regulated private complimentary insurance options). It allows for innovation and competition between providers, without the harm to users due to the asymmetry of power. Oh, and births are free.
- tyfon 9y ago
  Yeah, the the post I replied to claimed there were restrictions on private clinics specifically, but the public clinics/hospitals have to follow the same rules. Also: are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me.
  - ucaetano 9y ago
    > Also: are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me. Then the entire US healthcare system will sound ridiculous and insane to you :) And, to be honest, it is. I have American friends who had accidents while in developing countries (broke an arm in Costa Rica) and were puzzled that they were treated and didn't have to pay anything, or very little (broke feet in Croatia).
  - michaelchisari 9y ago
    are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me. In the U.S., if you have decent insurance, you'll still end up paying a couple thousand or more after insurance payouts. And that's just for the birth and short (1-2 days) hospital stay. Any complications and you're potentially paying much, much more. Especially NICU, it's not unusual to pay hundreds of dollars per day of NICU care after insurance, and non-insured costs can easily end up in the tens or hundreds of thousands, and in rare situations in the millions.
  - vidarh 9y ago
    I think you misunderstand. The restrictions in Norway are on which services private providers are licensed to provide. It's not that many years ago that private providers were unable to offer surgeries that were covered by public healthcare at all. E.g. most private providers in Norway once they started getting licensed at all only offered things like cosmetic surgery. The first private hospital in Norway wasn't started until 1985 (Ring Medisinske Senter, now Volvat) and I remember the controversy it caused, even though it's services originally were very restricted (they were "famous" early on for being the first place in Norway you could get breast enlargements, as they were not covered by public healthcare) It's been softened up gradually, but you'll note i you click around on the linked provided earlier that for many types of operations the only providers are either non-profits like LHL or government run hospitals - for some this is simply because no private providers have wanted to enter that space yet, but for others it's down to concerns about availability/training making the government hesitant to allow more providers, as described elsewhere. As I pointed out in my other reply, I'm not criticizing it (at least not as long as it is regularly evaluated for whether or not it continues to offer the best treatment options, as it seems to have been).
vidarh 9y ago
Yes, strict regulations. Private providers in Norway have a number restrictions on which services they can provide which tends to be much stricter than most places. The argument for this has traditionally been that there is a unique scalability problem in medicine: You can't e.g. just educate twice as many heart surgeons, because they need a sufficient number of operations that they can assist in etc. to gain proficiency with real patients, and that pool of patients is limited. This creates a problem where not restricting which services can be offered has the potential to lower quality of service for all. Something that's a particular concern in countries with smaller populations. The services that are not restricted are in general areas where there's either a higher volume of patients, or where it requires less training. A sinus infection is a good example of both. Note that I'm not arguing that this is worse in any way, but used it to delineate one of the most restrictive alternatives when it comes to the availability of private services.

by tyfon 9y ago

ucaetano 9y ago

Restrictions aren't just on users, but on providers as well. If you don't see restrictions as an user, it's because most of the restrictions are on the providers. And nothing wrong with that, I actually support that model, just like in Switzerland, where healthcare is private, but mandated by the government and heavily regulated (with less-regulated private complimentary insurance options). It allows for innovation and competition between providers, without the harm to users due to the asymmetry of power. Oh, and births are free.

tyfon 9y ago
Yeah, the the post I replied to claimed there were restrictions on private clinics specifically, but the public clinics/hospitals have to follow the same rules. Also: are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me.
- ucaetano 9y ago
  > Also: are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me. Then the entire US healthcare system will sound ridiculous and insane to you :) And, to be honest, it is. I have American friends who had accidents while in developing countries (broke an arm in Costa Rica) and were puzzled that they were treated and didn't have to pay anything, or very little (broke feet in Croatia).
- michaelchisari 9y ago
  are there any places that charge for births???? That sounds ridiculous and insane to me. In the U.S., if you have decent insurance, you'll still end up paying a couple thousand or more after insurance payouts. And that's just for the birth and short (1-2 days) hospital stay. Any complications and you're potentially paying much, much more. Especially NICU, it's not unusual to pay hundreds of dollars per day of NICU care after insurance, and non-insured costs can easily end up in the tens or hundreds of thousands, and in rare situations in the millions.
- vidarh 9y ago
  I think you misunderstand. The restrictions in Norway are on which services private providers are licensed to provide. It's not that many years ago that private providers were unable to offer surgeries that were covered by public healthcare at all. E.g. most private providers in Norway once they started getting licensed at all only offered things like cosmetic surgery. The first private hospital in Norway wasn't started until 1985 (Ring Medisinske Senter, now Volvat) and I remember the controversy it caused, even though it's services originally were very restricted (they were "famous" early on for being the first place in Norway you could get breast enlargements, as they were not covered by public healthcare) It's been softened up gradually, but you'll note i you click around on the linked provided earlier that for many types of operations the only providers are either non-profits like LHL or government run hospitals - for some this is simply because no private providers have wanted to enter that space yet, but for others it's down to concerns about availability/training making the government hesitant to allow more providers, as described elsewhere. As I pointed out in my other reply, I'm not criticizing it (at least not as long as it is regularly evaluated for whether or not it continues to offer the best treatment options, as it seems to have been).

vidarh 9y ago

Yes, strict regulations. Private providers in Norway have a number restrictions on which services they can provide which tends to be much stricter than most places. The argument for this has traditionally been that there is a unique scalability problem in medicine: You can't e.g. just educate twice as many heart surgeons, because they need a sufficient number of operations that they can assist in etc. to gain proficiency with real patients, and that pool of patients is limited. This creates a problem where not restricting which services can be offered has the potential to lower quality of service for all. Something that's a particular concern in countries with smaller populations. The services that are not restricted are in general areas where there's either a higher volume of patients, or where it requires less training. A sinus infection is a good example of both. Note that I'm not arguing that this is worse in any way, but used it to delineate one of the most restrictive alternatives when it comes to the availability of private services.