4 ms·

Ofo and Mobike bikes use locks that block the wheel's rotation and can thus be parked anywhere. Seems like forcing to use an existing bike rack would be a non-

by devit 9y ago

Ofo and Mobike bikes use locks that block the wheel's rotation and can thus be parked anywhere. Seems like forcing to use an existing bike rack would be a non-starter, since the whole point of dockless bike sharing is that you can just leave the bike in front of your destination regardless of what is there. The "eyesore" factor is a trivial downside compared to the massive convenience of just being able to park the bike anywhere.

bkohlmann 9y ago
You may be right. And SF will be a natural experiment to see which model wins out. This seems a perfect example of concentrated benefits (riders being able to park wherever) vs. diffuse costs (eyesore to most of the population). An extremely ironic possible outcome is that given the example of uber, cities may legislate away dockless bikes as non-riders lobby their representatives to minimize eyesores.
- icantdrive55 9y ago
  In SF, they will need to worry about theft of their product. I have two electric bikes, and I just don't use them. What works for myself is throwing my old mountain bike (cheap bike) into the back of my truck. Look for free parking(which is getting harder, father every year)--and bike to work. When my bike gets stolen, I don't care. I have another rusty bike ready to go. That said, since I'm in construction, it doesn't matter if I'm sweating, or my hair looks like a tornado simulation. I couldn't imagine going into a business meeting after a hard bike ride. Then again--I hear times are changing in terms of attire, hair grooming?
- smichel17 9y ago
  Seems like it would make sense to convert 1 in X parking spots to bike-only parking spots. Now they're off the sidewalk yet there's still the convenience of being able to park very near your destination.
  - s0rce 9y ago
    That is basically what the bike docks are, most of them (at least in the East Bay) have replaced a few adjacent spots. You could simply distribute more frequent smaller racks. People believe parking is a right and anything that removes it is the end of the world so there is constant pushback.
robg 9y ago
Trivial eyesore? http://www.businessinsider.com/china-bike-sharing-frenzy-collapsing-2017-11 http://www.businessinsider.com/china-bike-sharing-frenzy-col...
saalweachter 9y ago
> The "eyesore" factor is a trivial downside compared to the massive convenience of just being able to park the bike anywhere. You're saying the problems they cause other people matter less than the convenience they give to you?
- vkou 9y ago
  Why are colorful bikes left on sidewalks an eyesore, but rows and rows of cars parked next to sidewalks not?
  - bkohlmann 9y ago
    Order. Cars along a sidewalk are almost always in a straight line - and we recognize via acclimation that this is "normal." 10+ bikes lined up on a sidewalk in a parallel and organized fashion actually aren't much of an eyesore. But ten haphazard bikes, often blocking the sidewalk for pedestrians, is chaotic. Our minds - and interpretation of eyesores - respond accordingly.
  - thomasahle 9y ago
    Don't the cars have to pay? Otherwise it seems fair that they should compete for the space.
    - vkou 9y ago
      1. No, most curb parking in most of the United States is free. 2. Where they do have to pay, they pay way under true market value of the land.
      - briandear 9y ago
        ..and there are car registration fees, but rarely do I see a requirement for licensing and registration or bikes — nor insurance requirements. Cars in many states are subject to property tax. And gasoline taxes and required annual inspections. Bikes have none of those requirements. Cars definitely pay for the infrastructure they use. As far as fair market value for the land: what’s the value of a square meter of sidewalk in Manhattan? Are bikes paying fair market value for the sidewalks upon which they park? These anti-car arguments are starting to get absurd.
moonka 9y ago
>The "eyesore" factor is a trivial downside compared to the massive convenience of just being able to park the bike anywhere. Also, seems like less of an eyesore than the numerous cars we (including me) leave parked on the side of the street. Maybe it's just a question of what we are used to.
- jerrycruncher 9y ago
  You should visit Seattle once the weather clears up. You'll see that they "eyesore factor" is very, very real.
  - moonka 9y ago
    I live in Seattle.
    - jerrycruncher 9y ago
      Maybe you're ok with a dozen+ orange, green, and yellow bikes intermittently on your corner, in front of your house, or strewn on the paths of public parks. I'm not.
      - taeric 9y ago
        The bikes are obnoxious, but I confess that the cars are just as obnoxious when you first start letting people park on the street. "Clean" lines typically means nothing there. And it does have a pleasantness that is hard to state. I say this as someone that now lives somewhere where everyone parks on the street in front of their house. For me, I loved the month or so we didn't have a car, because it was actually somewhat likely that there would be no car in front of our house. None of this is to defend the bikes that are being left everywhere. Just trying to strengthen the thought that the cars are just as obnoxious, but we have grown to accept that. If anything, I fear we will grow to accept these bikes. I'm still hopeful that the bikes will actually get used and not just strewn about.
txcwpalpha 9y ago
It's not just a "trivial" eyesore in Dallas. It's gotten to the point where there are so many of these dockless bikes around Dallas that there literally isn't enough space on the sidewalk for them, so they start spilling onto roads, train tracks (which cause delays and accidents), blocking sidewalks/paths, etc. Dockless sounds great in theory, but in practice, humans are assholes and have no problem tossing the bike on the ground with no care to the fact that it's now blocking the sidewalk, road, etc. Then you also have other people who have no problem vandalizing bikes and essentially creating litter that other people are then responsible for cleaning up. See http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/dallas-bike-share-mess-photos-10228055 http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/dallas-bike-share-mess-ph...
- jerrycruncher 9y ago
  Ditto in Seattle. And I think it's important to understand that it's not primarily the riders (of whom there are very very few) who are paying to ride these things and then dumping them wherever, it is the "assholes" employed by the bike rental companies who are doing the park-uglifying, yard-infringing, sidewalk-blocking bike spamming. "Dockless" in theory is only nice if there are a limited number of bikes in distribution. In practice, it means that the employees of the bike rental companies will leave as many of their bikes as they can wherever they want for however long they want (case in point: late last fall there were at least 40 bikes dumped by three rental companies on one two block length of one street in my neighborhood). Cities with city councils that actually care about the quality of life of their residents (SF, Oakland) moved quickly to prohibit these rental companies from spamming their products all over streets, parks, sidewalks, yards. The rest of us have to suffer.
  - txcwpalpha 9y ago
    That's exactly the issues that Dallas is going through right now. A few of the bikeshare companies (Ofo, Mobike) are Chinese companies that mass produce cheap bicycles and they don't really seem to care if the bikes get damaged/lost, so they are pretty careless about where and how they place them. I've personally witnessed one of the bikeshare trucks slowly driving down the street while someone in the back literally just threw bikes off the truck onto the sidewalk. The bikeshare companies also currently seem to be using the method of spamming bikes everywhere and hoping they get used, rather than trying to place them where they are actually needed. There was a picture of one of the companies in Dallas placing bikes on the side of a highway, with no pedestrian access, no sidewalks, and nothing even resembling a bike lane. That's just dangerous. Fortunately the city is starting to crack down on them a bit, but it's a real shame that these companies took a cool idea and are pretty much ruining it with their piss-poor execution.

by devit 9y ago

bkohlmann 9y ago

You may be right. And SF will be a natural experiment to see which model wins out. This seems a perfect example of concentrated benefits (riders being able to park wherever) vs. diffuse costs (eyesore to most of the population). An extremely ironic possible outcome is that given the example of uber, cities may legislate away dockless bikes as non-riders lobby their representatives to minimize eyesores.

icantdrive55 9y ago
In SF, they will need to worry about theft of their product. I have two electric bikes, and I just don't use them. What works for myself is throwing my old mountain bike (cheap bike) into the back of my truck. Look for free parking(which is getting harder, father every year)--and bike to work. When my bike gets stolen, I don't care. I have another rusty bike ready to go. That said, since I'm in construction, it doesn't matter if I'm sweating, or my hair looks like a tornado simulation. I couldn't imagine going into a business meeting after a hard bike ride. Then again--I hear times are changing in terms of attire, hair grooming?
smichel17 9y ago
Seems like it would make sense to convert 1 in X parking spots to bike-only parking spots. Now they're off the sidewalk yet there's still the convenience of being able to park very near your destination.
- s0rce 9y ago
  That is basically what the bike docks are, most of them (at least in the East Bay) have replaced a few adjacent spots. You could simply distribute more frequent smaller racks. People believe parking is a right and anything that removes it is the end of the world so there is constant pushback.

robg 9y ago

Trivial eyesore? http://www.businessinsider.com/china-bike-sharing-frenzy-collapsing-2017-11 http://www.businessinsider.com/china-bike-sharing-frenzy-col...

saalweachter 9y ago

> The "eyesore" factor is a trivial downside compared to the massive convenience of just being able to park the bike anywhere. You're saying the problems they cause other people matter less than the convenience they give to you?

vkou 9y ago
Why are colorful bikes left on sidewalks an eyesore, but rows and rows of cars parked next to sidewalks not?
- bkohlmann 9y ago
  Order. Cars along a sidewalk are almost always in a straight line - and we recognize via acclimation that this is "normal." 10+ bikes lined up on a sidewalk in a parallel and organized fashion actually aren't much of an eyesore. But ten haphazard bikes, often blocking the sidewalk for pedestrians, is chaotic. Our minds - and interpretation of eyesores - respond accordingly.
- thomasahle 9y ago
  Don't the cars have to pay? Otherwise it seems fair that they should compete for the space.
  - vkou 9y ago
    1. No, most curb parking in most of the United States is free. 2. Where they do have to pay, they pay way under true market value of the land.
    - briandear 9y ago
      ..and there are car registration fees, but rarely do I see a requirement for licensing and registration or bikes — nor insurance requirements. Cars in many states are subject to property tax. And gasoline taxes and required annual inspections. Bikes have none of those requirements. Cars definitely pay for the infrastructure they use. As far as fair market value for the land: what’s the value of a square meter of sidewalk in Manhattan? Are bikes paying fair market value for the sidewalks upon which they park? These anti-car arguments are starting to get absurd.

moonka 9y ago

>The "eyesore" factor is a trivial downside compared to the massive convenience of just being able to park the bike anywhere. Also, seems like less of an eyesore than the numerous cars we (including me) leave parked on the side of the street. Maybe it's just a question of what we are used to.

jerrycruncher 9y ago
You should visit Seattle once the weather clears up. You'll see that they "eyesore factor" is very, very real.
- moonka 9y ago
  I live in Seattle.
  - jerrycruncher 9y ago
    Maybe you're ok with a dozen+ orange, green, and yellow bikes intermittently on your corner, in front of your house, or strewn on the paths of public parks. I'm not.
    - taeric 9y ago
      The bikes are obnoxious, but I confess that the cars are just as obnoxious when you first start letting people park on the street. "Clean" lines typically means nothing there. And it does have a pleasantness that is hard to state. I say this as someone that now lives somewhere where everyone parks on the street in front of their house. For me, I loved the month or so we didn't have a car, because it was actually somewhat likely that there would be no car in front of our house. None of this is to defend the bikes that are being left everywhere. Just trying to strengthen the thought that the cars are just as obnoxious, but we have grown to accept that. If anything, I fear we will grow to accept these bikes. I'm still hopeful that the bikes will actually get used and not just strewn about.

txcwpalpha 9y ago

It's not just a "trivial" eyesore in Dallas. It's gotten to the point where there are so many of these dockless bikes around Dallas that there literally isn't enough space on the sidewalk for them, so they start spilling onto roads, train tracks (which cause delays and accidents), blocking sidewalks/paths, etc. Dockless sounds great in theory, but in practice, humans are assholes and have no problem tossing the bike on the ground with no care to the fact that it's now blocking the sidewalk, road, etc. Then you also have other people who have no problem vandalizing bikes and essentially creating litter that other people are then responsible for cleaning up. See http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/dallas-bike-share-mess-photos-10228055 http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/dallas-bike-share-mess-ph...

jerrycruncher 9y ago
Ditto in Seattle. And I think it's important to understand that it's not primarily the riders (of whom there are very very few) who are paying to ride these things and then dumping them wherever, it is the "assholes" employed by the bike rental companies who are doing the park-uglifying, yard-infringing, sidewalk-blocking bike spamming. "Dockless" in theory is only nice if there are a limited number of bikes in distribution. In practice, it means that the employees of the bike rental companies will leave as many of their bikes as they can wherever they want for however long they want (case in point: late last fall there were at least 40 bikes dumped by three rental companies on one two block length of one street in my neighborhood). Cities with city councils that actually care about the quality of life of their residents (SF, Oakland) moved quickly to prohibit these rental companies from spamming their products all over streets, parks, sidewalks, yards. The rest of us have to suffer.
- txcwpalpha 9y ago
  That's exactly the issues that Dallas is going through right now. A few of the bikeshare companies (Ofo, Mobike) are Chinese companies that mass produce cheap bicycles and they don't really seem to care if the bikes get damaged/lost, so they are pretty careless about where and how they place them. I've personally witnessed one of the bikeshare trucks slowly driving down the street while someone in the back literally just threw bikes off the truck onto the sidewalk. The bikeshare companies also currently seem to be using the method of spamming bikes everywhere and hoping they get used, rather than trying to place them where they are actually needed. There was a picture of one of the companies in Dallas placing bikes on the side of a highway, with no pedestrian access, no sidewalks, and nothing even resembling a bike lane. That's just dangerous. Fortunately the city is starting to crack down on them a bit, but it's a real shame that these companies took a cool idea and are pretty much ruining it with their piss-poor execution.