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I heartily disagree. You're chasing a ghost. Morality is how people react to what is done, how they enforce the rules and such. That's the "doing" I'm pointing

I heartily disagree. You're chasing a ghost. Morality is how people react to what is done, how they enforce the rules and such. That's the "doing" I'm pointing at. I'm sorry if that was unclear in my initial statement. It seems you may have thought I was assuming perfect moral behavior from all people. No, that's silly. People are cheating trash, lol. Not all the time, of course, but it's in the grain. Morality is as fractal as truth is, entirely dependent on the depth of questions being asked, the edge of inside and outside determined on the number of iterations. And morality is certainly not something to be determined in the vacuum of thought, it's a gritty, dirty, and nasty thing with edges in the slow slime and quick muck, it's ornate and like the rest of reality. > but you can't coherently argue that physical facts both exist and can be determined by empirical observation... Heh-heh, gotcha! ;)

dragonwriter 9y ago
> Morality is how people react to what is done That is a loose description of one sense of the word, but not the sense associated with “moral facts” in its usual use. “Morality” can refer to either “what ought to be done” or to “beliefs about what ought to be done”; the elements of the former (if they exist as facts, a point which is a matter of substantial dispute) are “moral facts”; the elements of the latter are “facts about morality” or, more clearly, “facts about moral sentiments”. The latter indisputably exist and are normal material facts subject to empirical inquiry, but they aren't the same thing as the former, nor (even assuming the former exist) do they have any necessary relationship to the former.
- kleer001 9y ago
  Beliefs matter nothing next to action. Especially if you want to get something done or make a statement that can be proven false about the world as it is. Electrons don't believe anything, but you can pretend they do, if you like.

dragonwriter 9y ago

> Morality is how people react to what is done That is a loose description of one sense of the word, but not the sense associated with “moral facts” in its usual use. “Morality” can refer to either “what ought to be done” or to “beliefs about what ought to be done”; the elements of the former (if they exist as facts, a point which is a matter of substantial dispute) are “moral facts”; the elements of the latter are “facts about morality” or, more clearly, “facts about moral sentiments”. The latter indisputably exist and are normal material facts subject to empirical inquiry, but they aren't the same thing as the former, nor (even assuming the former exist) do they have any necessary relationship to the former.

kleer001 9y ago
Beliefs matter nothing next to action. Especially if you want to get something done or make a statement that can be proven false about the world as it is. Electrons don't believe anything, but you can pretend they do, if you like.