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Obviously not all working class people are part of the same culture, but I think the very fact that the stereotype of "Chav" exists beyond merely being obnoxiou

Obviously not all working class people are part of the same culture, but I think the very fact that the stereotype of "Chav" exists beyond merely being obnoxious (since there are obviously obnoxious people who we wouldn't consider "Chavs") suggests there is a cultural component. And it's when you say including aspects like clothing that the idea starts to sound classist. How exactly does someone "dress like an arsehole"? Is their clothing somehow inherently offensive, or do you just dislike it because it doesn't fit your own aesthetics, and/or because you associate it with a negative type of person?

Nursie 9y ago
>> Is their clothing somehow inherently offensive, or do you just dislike it because it doesn't fit your own aesthetics, and/or because you associate it with a negative type of person? The latter, the association. My aesthetics are questionable in various ways all by themselves. But associations are a different thing. People pre-judge each other on clothing all the time, and people very often broadcast who they are and their group affiliations through clothing. If a pub is full of people in football shirts I'm probably not going in because it's not my sort of place. I have no desire to be around loud sports appreciation. It's not because I think they're beneath me but I know what to expect. The question of class and chavs is an interesting one to some extent - I don't judge them because they are poor, working class people. It's the behaviour, the general poor education etc. I don't think it's wrong to judge this as bad, nor to associate particular behaviours and outlooks with clothing when there is an associated look - I'm an old goth, we definitely had our look and our commonalities. Let's turn this around - a woman goes to the supermarket in her food-covered pyjamas, with a kid in tow, screaming at them to 'shuh uh!'. You're not going to make any judgement on that? How's about a massive guy with long hair in a metal t-shirt and a denim waistcoat? No preconceptions?
dazc 9y ago
'How exactly does someone "dress like an arsehole"?' Just guessing, as a random sample of the ways some people choose to dress in the UK. Wearing pyjamas and bathrobe in the supermarkt? Wearing sports clothing despite looking like they don't ever actually do any sports? Wearing trousers/jeans that don't go all the way up to the waist?

Nursie 9y ago

>> Is their clothing somehow inherently offensive, or do you just dislike it because it doesn't fit your own aesthetics, and/or because you associate it with a negative type of person? The latter, the association. My aesthetics are questionable in various ways all by themselves. But associations are a different thing. People pre-judge each other on clothing all the time, and people very often broadcast who they are and their group affiliations through clothing. If a pub is full of people in football shirts I'm probably not going in because it's not my sort of place. I have no desire to be around loud sports appreciation. It's not because I think they're beneath me but I know what to expect. The question of class and chavs is an interesting one to some extent - I don't judge them because they are poor, working class people. It's the behaviour, the general poor education etc. I don't think it's wrong to judge this as bad, nor to associate particular behaviours and outlooks with clothing when there is an associated look - I'm an old goth, we definitely had our look and our commonalities. Let's turn this around - a woman goes to the supermarket in her food-covered pyjamas, with a kid in tow, screaming at them to 'shuh uh!'. You're not going to make any judgement on that? How's about a massive guy with long hair in a metal t-shirt and a denim waistcoat? No preconceptions?

dazc 9y ago

'How exactly does someone "dress like an arsehole"?' Just guessing, as a random sample of the ways some people choose to dress in the UK. Wearing pyjamas and bathrobe in the supermarkt? Wearing sports clothing despite looking like they don't ever actually do any sports? Wearing trousers/jeans that don't go all the way up to the waist?