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Not great news if you use container Linux: https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/faq-red-hat-acquire-coreos https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/faq-red-hat-acquire-coreos

Not great news if you use container Linux: https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/faq-red-hat-acquire-coreos https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/faq-red-hat-acquire-coreos Container Linux and its investment in container-optimized Linux and automated “over the air” software updates are complementary to Red Hat Enterprise Linux, Red Hat Enterprise Linux Atomic Host and Red Hat’s integrated container runtime and platform management capabilities. Red Hat Enterprise Linux’s content, the foundation of our application ecosystem will remain our only Linux offering. Whereas, some of the delivery mechanisms pioneered by Container Linux will be reviewed by a joint integration team and reconciled with Atomic.

puzzle 9y ago
Which delivery mechanisms? The ContainerLinux boot image updater comes from Chrome and ChromeOS (Omaha). They must be talking about the higher-level partitioning of a cluster into groups with separate policies, etc. Congratulations to the CoreOS team, by the way.
- merb 9y ago
  tectonic, ignition, matchbox? Also CoreUpdate is based on Chrome and ChromeOS but it's the only os that integrated it nicely. Running CoreOS is way simpler to manage than most other distro's because of that fact.
  - rzzzt 9y ago
    Atomic uses rpm-ostree, which looks similar to Omaha from a client perspective (update, roll back to previous version): http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/os-updates/ http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/os-updates/
    - merb 9y ago
      is there an alternative to locksmith? the "automatic" update (https://coreos.com/os/docs/latest/update-strategies.html https://coreos.com/os/docs/latest/update-strategies.html) and/or https://github.com/coreos/container-linux-update-operator https://github.com/coreos/container-linux-update-operator? basically on coreos I don't need to run "rpm-ostree" to have an updated system. it is actually updated automatically.
      - vidarh 9y ago
        And importantly, you can control updates across a whole cluster by limiting how many machines are allowed to update simultaneously.
    - Already__Taken 9y ago
      I just can't get a decent "This is how to get started" from windows guide with atomic. It's all assuming I'm perfectly happy on linux. Not to knock it, but I just want to start some VMs on hyper-v and have a go.
      - mattdm 9y ago
        This is good feedback. I'll bring it to the Fedora docs team.
  - puzzle 9y ago
    I was thinking of locksmith. It's nice, as you say, to be able to have no more than N nodes per pool restart at any time, so that rolling updates are automatic and in the background. You can't replicate it easily without a cluster-wide etcd and ignition. I forgot about matchbox. There was also good old fleet, but that one is dead.
  - arianvanp 9y ago
    Container Optimised OS (Which is just ChromiumOS stripped down) has been working pretty nicely for me on GCloud. Just reboot and you have the latest updates. https://cloud.google.com/container-optimized-os/docs/concepts/features-and-benefits https://cloud.google.com/container-optimized-os/docs/concept... It's also open source But yeh, Matchbox + Ignition for automatically bringing up configured nodes with iPXE was an extremely powerful combination. However, those ideas can be easily ported over or already exist through cloud-init.
    - merb 9y ago
      well basically we use that on gcloud k8s in the future. but we still have a bare metal cluster. we only used ignition + vmware to provision it in the first place and it was a breeze.. etcd was configured on the fly in a HA setup, k8s was made ready to bootstrap (just needed to run kubeadm init --config...) and we had basically a working cluster. highly available, with as many nodes we wanted, just copy the worker.yaml and edit what's needed. we actually play around with tectonic at the moment.
    - kuschku 9y ago
      Container Optimised OS also says they don't support use cases outside of GCloud, and it also relies on CoreOS' services itself. So for bare metal use cases, I'm EOL?
- bogomipz 9y ago
  >"The ContainerLinux boot image updater comes from Chrome and ChromeOS (Omaha)." Could you or anyone else recommend any literature on ContainerLinux boot image and its use of ChromeOS as a foundation?
politician 9y ago
Yeah, not great. That sounds like an EOL announcement. EDIT: Thanks for everything CoreOS team, and congrats on the sale! This immutable distribution was a breath of fresh air in a crowded "enterprise / kitchen sink" space.
- joshuak 9y ago
  Man have I really enjoyed CoreOS/Container Linux, etcd and generally all the work the CoreOS guys have done, and boy have I hated Red Hat's business practices. I moved away from Red Hat back when they split the OS into Enterprise and Fedora flavors. I was a big fan of Red Hat back when they were leading the way in the early days of linux with things like application packaging, and a general vision towards simplicity. This is the same thing that attracted me to CoreOS' elegant engineering. I don't object to companies focusing more on revenue, as Red Hat's Enterprise move clearly was. But I cannot abide the erosion of vision in pursuit of profits. In particular when elegance and simplicity are replaced with complexity, and user hostile design to increase switching costs. I realize there is probably a natural selection process at work here, and user hostile design is clearly a more profitable strategy, but I can't keep from hoping that one of these times the well engineered, simplicity focused, user centric design will find the right business model and survive... vision intact.
  - freedomben 9y ago
    Interesting, I totally disagree. The split of Fedora and RHEL was a great move for users IMHO. Serving the needs of desktop users and enterprise (servers) with the same distro just isn't doable. They have wildly different and incompatible needs. I've been a happy fedora user for years. Red Hat has also done tons of things that directly fly in the face of a company seeking profits. Like continuing to release your full source code, even when punks like Oracle just rip it off and sell it for less. They even directly support the CentOS project, even tho it cannabalizes people who might otherwise buy RHEL. Red Hat is an amazing company that has poured countless millions of dollars in both money and time to make all of our lives better. Even the Gnome project may not be a thing without Red Hat's contributions, and everybody on linux benefits from that work. I wish there were more companies out there like Red Hat. Disclaimer: I have zero affiliation with Red Hat. I'm just an appreciative observer and beneficiary.
numbsafari 9y ago
Super disappointed in this part of it. Is anyone else aware/familiar with a decent immutable lightweight Linux distro like Container Linux?
- zapita 9y ago
  Linuxkit: https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit
- pierrebeaucamp 9y ago
  If you're looking for immutability, I can recommend NixOS. However what is drawing me to container Linux is mainly its update process
  - flowless 9y ago
    +1 We've also built https://github.com/vpsfreecz/vpsadminos https://github.com/vpsfreecz/vpsadminos recently which is based on not-os / NixOS
  - chrissnell 9y ago
    The draw of CoreOS Linux for me is its curated pairing of the Linux kernel, Docker, and etcd. There was a commercial entity reviewing upstream changelogs and making sure that they were pairing components appropriately. I wonder if an non-commercial district can really get this right.
    - zapita 9y ago
      Take a look at Linuxkit by Docker: https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit . I didn't develop it, but I use it indirectly via Docker for Mac, which I use a lot. The latest version supports Kubernetes. This means Docker commercially maintains a Linux/Docker/Kubernetes stack that needs to run reliably on what I think is a very large install base. They have open-sourced the system they use for this, it's called Linuxkit and it's a very cool, underrated project.
  - 9y ago

puzzle 9y ago

Which delivery mechanisms? The ContainerLinux boot image updater comes from Chrome and ChromeOS (Omaha). They must be talking about the higher-level partitioning of a cluster into groups with separate policies, etc. Congratulations to the CoreOS team, by the way.

merb 9y ago
tectonic, ignition, matchbox? Also CoreUpdate is based on Chrome and ChromeOS but it's the only os that integrated it nicely. Running CoreOS is way simpler to manage than most other distro's because of that fact.
- rzzzt 9y ago
  Atomic uses rpm-ostree, which looks similar to Omaha from a client perspective (update, roll back to previous version): http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/os-updates/ http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/os-updates/
  - merb 9y ago
    is there an alternative to locksmith? the "automatic" update (https://coreos.com/os/docs/latest/update-strategies.html https://coreos.com/os/docs/latest/update-strategies.html) and/or https://github.com/coreos/container-linux-update-operator https://github.com/coreos/container-linux-update-operator? basically on coreos I don't need to run "rpm-ostree" to have an updated system. it is actually updated automatically.
    - vidarh 9y ago
      And importantly, you can control updates across a whole cluster by limiting how many machines are allowed to update simultaneously.
  - Already__Taken 9y ago
    I just can't get a decent "This is how to get started" from windows guide with atomic. It's all assuming I'm perfectly happy on linux. Not to knock it, but I just want to start some VMs on hyper-v and have a go.
    - mattdm 9y ago
      This is good feedback. I'll bring it to the Fedora docs team.
- puzzle 9y ago
  I was thinking of locksmith. It's nice, as you say, to be able to have no more than N nodes per pool restart at any time, so that rolling updates are automatic and in the background. You can't replicate it easily without a cluster-wide etcd and ignition. I forgot about matchbox. There was also good old fleet, but that one is dead.
- arianvanp 9y ago
  Container Optimised OS (Which is just ChromiumOS stripped down) has been working pretty nicely for me on GCloud. Just reboot and you have the latest updates. https://cloud.google.com/container-optimized-os/docs/concepts/features-and-benefits https://cloud.google.com/container-optimized-os/docs/concept... It's also open source But yeh, Matchbox + Ignition for automatically bringing up configured nodes with iPXE was an extremely powerful combination. However, those ideas can be easily ported over or already exist through cloud-init.
  - merb 9y ago
    well basically we use that on gcloud k8s in the future. but we still have a bare metal cluster. we only used ignition + vmware to provision it in the first place and it was a breeze.. etcd was configured on the fly in a HA setup, k8s was made ready to bootstrap (just needed to run kubeadm init --config...) and we had basically a working cluster. highly available, with as many nodes we wanted, just copy the worker.yaml and edit what's needed. we actually play around with tectonic at the moment.
  - kuschku 9y ago
    Container Optimised OS also says they don't support use cases outside of GCloud, and it also relies on CoreOS' services itself. So for bare metal use cases, I'm EOL?
bogomipz 9y ago
>"The ContainerLinux boot image updater comes from Chrome and ChromeOS (Omaha)." Could you or anyone else recommend any literature on ContainerLinux boot image and its use of ChromeOS as a foundation?

politician 9y ago

Yeah, not great. That sounds like an EOL announcement. EDIT: Thanks for everything CoreOS team, and congrats on the sale! This immutable distribution was a breath of fresh air in a crowded "enterprise / kitchen sink" space.

joshuak 9y ago
Man have I really enjoyed CoreOS/Container Linux, etcd and generally all the work the CoreOS guys have done, and boy have I hated Red Hat's business practices. I moved away from Red Hat back when they split the OS into Enterprise and Fedora flavors. I was a big fan of Red Hat back when they were leading the way in the early days of linux with things like application packaging, and a general vision towards simplicity. This is the same thing that attracted me to CoreOS' elegant engineering. I don't object to companies focusing more on revenue, as Red Hat's Enterprise move clearly was. But I cannot abide the erosion of vision in pursuit of profits. In particular when elegance and simplicity are replaced with complexity, and user hostile design to increase switching costs. I realize there is probably a natural selection process at work here, and user hostile design is clearly a more profitable strategy, but I can't keep from hoping that one of these times the well engineered, simplicity focused, user centric design will find the right business model and survive... vision intact.
- freedomben 9y ago
  Interesting, I totally disagree. The split of Fedora and RHEL was a great move for users IMHO. Serving the needs of desktop users and enterprise (servers) with the same distro just isn't doable. They have wildly different and incompatible needs. I've been a happy fedora user for years. Red Hat has also done tons of things that directly fly in the face of a company seeking profits. Like continuing to release your full source code, even when punks like Oracle just rip it off and sell it for less. They even directly support the CentOS project, even tho it cannabalizes people who might otherwise buy RHEL. Red Hat is an amazing company that has poured countless millions of dollars in both money and time to make all of our lives better. Even the Gnome project may not be a thing without Red Hat's contributions, and everybody on linux benefits from that work. I wish there were more companies out there like Red Hat. Disclaimer: I have zero affiliation with Red Hat. I'm just an appreciative observer and beneficiary.

numbsafari 9y ago

Super disappointed in this part of it. Is anyone else aware/familiar with a decent immutable lightweight Linux distro like Container Linux?

zapita 9y ago
Linuxkit: https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit
pierrebeaucamp 9y ago
If you're looking for immutability, I can recommend NixOS. However what is drawing me to container Linux is mainly its update process
- flowless 9y ago
  +1 We've also built https://github.com/vpsfreecz/vpsadminos https://github.com/vpsfreecz/vpsadminos recently which is based on not-os / NixOS
- chrissnell 9y ago
  The draw of CoreOS Linux for me is its curated pairing of the Linux kernel, Docker, and etcd. There was a commercial entity reviewing upstream changelogs and making sure that they were pairing components appropriately. I wonder if an non-commercial district can really get this right.
  - zapita 9y ago
    Take a look at Linuxkit by Docker: https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit https://github.com/linuxkit/linuxkit . I didn't develop it, but I use it indirectly via Docker for Mac, which I use a lot. The latest version supports Kubernetes. This means Docker commercially maintains a Linux/Docker/Kubernetes stack that needs to run reliably on what I think is a very large install base. They have open-sourced the system they use for this, it's called Linuxkit and it's a very cool, underrated project.
- 9y ago