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No updates might actually be better than forced (practically? I don't use iOS) updates that make your device less desirable to you, and can't be undone. It's m

No updates might actually be better than forced (practically? I don't use iOS) updates that make your device less desirable to you, and can't be undone. It's more fair and conceivable that Apple should be forced to meet certain standards for updates they choose to release, than for any manufacturer to be forced to make updates for some arbitrary/indefinite period of time.

dogma1138 9y ago
This is effectively an anti vaxxer argument. Security patches provide herd immunity and today it’s more important that everyone around you is patched than you or just you. You share a metric ton of personal information with people and if their devices are compromised so is your data. Now you might be on top of every vulnerability and wake up in be middle of the night to check up the NVD RSS feed but I would bet my life on the fact that the majority of your social circle doesn’t. You wouldn’t accept Facebook or Google not patching their servers why would you accept your friends and family not patching their devices when they are in a much better position to compromise you if they are compromised?
- scintill76 9y ago
  OK, my comment wasn't clear in the security context, because the post I was responding to didn't talk about security specifically. Sure, I'd like security updates and I'll apply them. Too often, as someone else noted here, my only choice of getting them also includes the latest design and heavy framework fads. In the ideal world, I'd be able to secure my device, without changing unrelated things I liked about how it used to work. Against my will, 99.5% of my email and social connections are saved by Google, Facebook, and the servers of whatever random apps slurped my friends' contacts. (Example: Venmo has a large and accurate friend suggestion list for me, somehow. I assume all those people have my number in their phone and their Venmo app matched it with my number.) So that ship has kind of sailed anyway. Their devices are compromised by design.
sol_remmy 9y ago
> No updates might actually be better than forced (practically? I don't use iOS) updates that make your device less desirable to you, and can't be undone No real people hold this opinion. You don't hold this opinion. You're saying that phone OS updates in general (whether from Google or Apple) are so low quality that its better NOT to get them on older phones?
- icebraining 9y ago
  Lots of real people hold that position. Just go to any Android-related forum, lots of owners of older tablets/phones recommend not upgrading past version X (usually for performance reasons.)
- scintill76 9y ago
  I've read/heard enough people disappointed in how buggy, slow, etc. their new iOS is on their old phone, to believe there are quite a few people who would rather not update if Apple didn't coerce them (or they would revert if Apple let them.) Grandparent post talks about Android vendors wasting our money and materials, but just this weekend my sister-in-law was complaining about how she needs a new iPhone because hers updated and is slow now. [Maybe related to the famous battery issue.] I didn't take a general position; I expressed skepticism in GP's implicit argument that every update is a good update, and my frustration at the idea of having updates shoved down my throat. I included some other related ideas without explaining clearly enough, partially because I'm not sure how/if this should actually be regulated.
wvenable 9y ago
I have a Samsung tablet that no longer receives updates and it's the only device of this type I've owned for years which operates at exactly the same performance as when I got it. I literally have no reason to upgrade it; all the apps I want work and get updates. My old iPhone 5 started with iOS 6.0 and went all the way to iOS 10 but got noticeably less performant with each new major update. I'm certainly not arguing those updates were necessarily bad but I think it's worth discussing. Security and bug fixes are tethered with changes designed for much more powerful hardware.

dogma1138 9y ago

This is effectively an anti vaxxer argument. Security patches provide herd immunity and today it’s more important that everyone around you is patched than you or just you. You share a metric ton of personal information with people and if their devices are compromised so is your data. Now you might be on top of every vulnerability and wake up in be middle of the night to check up the NVD RSS feed but I would bet my life on the fact that the majority of your social circle doesn’t. You wouldn’t accept Facebook or Google not patching their servers why would you accept your friends and family not patching their devices when they are in a much better position to compromise you if they are compromised?

scintill76 9y ago
OK, my comment wasn't clear in the security context, because the post I was responding to didn't talk about security specifically. Sure, I'd like security updates and I'll apply them. Too often, as someone else noted here, my only choice of getting them also includes the latest design and heavy framework fads. In the ideal world, I'd be able to secure my device, without changing unrelated things I liked about how it used to work. Against my will, 99.5% of my email and social connections are saved by Google, Facebook, and the servers of whatever random apps slurped my friends' contacts. (Example: Venmo has a large and accurate friend suggestion list for me, somehow. I assume all those people have my number in their phone and their Venmo app matched it with my number.) So that ship has kind of sailed anyway. Their devices are compromised by design.

sol_remmy 9y ago

> No updates might actually be better than forced (practically? I don't use iOS) updates that make your device less desirable to you, and can't be undone No real people hold this opinion. You don't hold this opinion. You're saying that phone OS updates in general (whether from Google or Apple) are so low quality that its better NOT to get them on older phones?

icebraining 9y ago
Lots of real people hold that position. Just go to any Android-related forum, lots of owners of older tablets/phones recommend not upgrading past version X (usually for performance reasons.)
scintill76 9y ago
I've read/heard enough people disappointed in how buggy, slow, etc. their new iOS is on their old phone, to believe there are quite a few people who would rather not update if Apple didn't coerce them (or they would revert if Apple let them.) Grandparent post talks about Android vendors wasting our money and materials, but just this weekend my sister-in-law was complaining about how she needs a new iPhone because hers updated and is slow now. [Maybe related to the famous battery issue.] I didn't take a general position; I expressed skepticism in GP's implicit argument that every update is a good update, and my frustration at the idea of having updates shoved down my throat. I included some other related ideas without explaining clearly enough, partially because I'm not sure how/if this should actually be regulated.

wvenable 9y ago

I have a Samsung tablet that no longer receives updates and it's the only device of this type I've owned for years which operates at exactly the same performance as when I got it. I literally have no reason to upgrade it; all the apps I want work and get updates. My old iPhone 5 started with iOS 6.0 and went all the way to iOS 10 but got noticeably less performant with each new major update. I'm certainly not arguing those updates were necessarily bad but I think it's worth discussing. Security and bug fixes are tethered with changes designed for much more powerful hardware.