4 ms·

Thinking of the economics behind this feat, if these were not slaves, but paid employees, I would assume that a whole ecosystem would exist nearby. These peopl

Thinking of the economics behind this feat, if these were not slaves, but paid employees, I would assume that a whole ecosystem would exist nearby. These people would need to be housed, buy food with their salaries (stores/markets), send kids to 'school'. A city would need to have been developed to accommodate that population. Also, if they were slaves they wouldn't have been given the luxury of a proper burial/cremation, so somewhere nearby there should be mass graves. I am not an archeologist, I am just trying to think with modern days analogies.

lucozade 9y ago
The article helpfully addresses a lot of this. The majority of the article talks about the town that they excavated that existed for precisely this reason. The evidence strongly suggests that the residents were very well looked after. They also speculate that the town was populated as a consequence of a form of feudal duty called bak. This feudalism is documented but isn't known to have been used specifically to build the great pyramids (though it seems likely). On the assumption that this is true, the lack of family accommodation etc is entirely plausible: the workers are seconded to the town for periods rather than live there full time. I would really recommend reading the article, even if you're not an archaeologist. It's very interesting what you can learn from the evidence.
- pjmlp 9y ago
  Yep, that is why I love reading any kind of document that has managed to survive to our days.
Steve44 9y ago
An acquaintance works in in the oil industry and they can have tens of thousands of people working on projects costing tens of billions. This looks like a similar scenario.
ljf 9y ago
OK I know the city has encroached more recently - but the pyramids aren't 'in the middle of the desert with nothing around for miles' - https://twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/aerial-view-of-pyramids-of-giza-egypt-density.jpg?w=800&h=527 https://twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/aerial-vie... and http://www.geographylists.com/egypt_sphinx_backside http://www.geographylists.com/egypt_sphinx_backside
Maken 9y ago
You are thinking about this as a state-sponsored project, however it is more akin a governmental agency dedicated to building the Pyramids. People there (almost certainly all men) were likely not paid employees but instead people taken from all over Egypt enrolled in a mandatory public service (akin to mandatory military service), fed and supplied by the Egyptian government, with goods which likely came from taxes created with the explicit purpose of supporting the construction of the Pyramids. So, all considered, this place must look more akin an ancient Egyptian military camp of a massive scale than a regular city, thus lacking some 'basic' civilian like markets or schools. Also, ancient Egyptians cared a lot about their death ones, so likely a proper burial were given to everybody who died while working in the Pharaon's tomb. On an unrelated note, I wonder why they were wasting all these massive logistics into piling rocks in middle of the dessert, when they could, you know, be building roads or dams or walls across all their frontiers.
- hutzlibu 9y ago
  "On an unrelated note, I wonder why they were wasting all these massive logistics into piling rocks in middle of the dessert, when they could, you know, be building roads or dams or walls across all their frontiers" Was that rhetorical? In case not: religion. They believed it served a higher purpose. The afterlife of their godlike emperor. And all who took part and did good, got better chances of a better afterlife themself ...
  - Maken 9y ago
    I honestly believe religion to be mostly an instrument to convince people to follow a certain agenda. Which means, from my point of view, that there must be a real reason for the Egyptian religion to promote the construction of pyramids instead of more, let's say, practical goals.
    - hutzlibu 9y ago
      This is definitely what religion was and is widely used for, but I am very sure, that the Pharaoh's for example really believed, that they were incarnations of a god. I mean, imagine you are being raised up this way, everyone bows his head to you as long as you can remember and they do believe that you are a god in human form ... how can you not believe likewise? Besides, I met quite a lot people by now who were not raised like this, but developed such an ego that they consider themselve to be enlightened and allmost godlike ... Also, building a big monument for your glory, is a very practical goal, even if you do get doubts, about there usefulness in afterlife, but when everyone of your underlings measures your greatness in the size of your grave, than you also really have not much choice ...

lucozade 9y ago

The article helpfully addresses a lot of this. The majority of the article talks about the town that they excavated that existed for precisely this reason. The evidence strongly suggests that the residents were very well looked after. They also speculate that the town was populated as a consequence of a form of feudal duty called bak. This feudalism is documented but isn't known to have been used specifically to build the great pyramids (though it seems likely). On the assumption that this is true, the lack of family accommodation etc is entirely plausible: the workers are seconded to the town for periods rather than live there full time. I would really recommend reading the article, even if you're not an archaeologist. It's very interesting what you can learn from the evidence.

pjmlp 9y ago
Yep, that is why I love reading any kind of document that has managed to survive to our days.

Steve44 9y ago

An acquaintance works in in the oil industry and they can have tens of thousands of people working on projects costing tens of billions. This looks like a similar scenario.

ljf 9y ago

OK I know the city has encroached more recently - but the pyramids aren't 'in the middle of the desert with nothing around for miles' - https://twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/aerial-view-of-pyramids-of-giza-egypt-density.jpg?w=800&h=527 https://twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/aerial-vie... and http://www.geographylists.com/egypt_sphinx_backside http://www.geographylists.com/egypt_sphinx_backside

Maken 9y ago

You are thinking about this as a state-sponsored project, however it is more akin a governmental agency dedicated to building the Pyramids. People there (almost certainly all men) were likely not paid employees but instead people taken from all over Egypt enrolled in a mandatory public service (akin to mandatory military service), fed and supplied by the Egyptian government, with goods which likely came from taxes created with the explicit purpose of supporting the construction of the Pyramids. So, all considered, this place must look more akin an ancient Egyptian military camp of a massive scale than a regular city, thus lacking some 'basic' civilian like markets or schools. Also, ancient Egyptians cared a lot about their death ones, so likely a proper burial were given to everybody who died while working in the Pharaon's tomb. On an unrelated note, I wonder why they were wasting all these massive logistics into piling rocks in middle of the dessert, when they could, you know, be building roads or dams or walls across all their frontiers.

hutzlibu 9y ago
"On an unrelated note, I wonder why they were wasting all these massive logistics into piling rocks in middle of the dessert, when they could, you know, be building roads or dams or walls across all their frontiers" Was that rhetorical? In case not: religion. They believed it served a higher purpose. The afterlife of their godlike emperor. And all who took part and did good, got better chances of a better afterlife themself ...
- Maken 9y ago
  I honestly believe religion to be mostly an instrument to convince people to follow a certain agenda. Which means, from my point of view, that there must be a real reason for the Egyptian religion to promote the construction of pyramids instead of more, let's say, practical goals.
  - hutzlibu 9y ago
    This is definitely what religion was and is widely used for, but I am very sure, that the Pharaoh's for example really believed, that they were incarnations of a god. I mean, imagine you are being raised up this way, everyone bows his head to you as long as you can remember and they do believe that you are a god in human form ... how can you not believe likewise? Besides, I met quite a lot people by now who were not raised like this, but developed such an ego that they consider themselve to be enlightened and allmost godlike ... Also, building a big monument for your glory, is a very practical goal, even if you do get doubts, about there usefulness in afterlife, but when everyone of your underlings measures your greatness in the size of your grave, than you also really have not much choice ...