5 ms·

> Apple famously doesn't advertise RAM or processor clock speed on iPhones. As long as I can remember, they've always under-specced their hardware and then jac

> Apple famously doesn't advertise RAM or processor clock speed on iPhones. As long as I can remember, they've always under-specced their hardware and then jacked the prices up for the cost of "experience". And my memory goes back to the mid 80's. Same old game then as it is now.

mrtksn 9y ago
What does under-specced even mean? How do you provide better experience by "under-spec" a product?
- phil248 9y ago
  It means you provide the minimum hardware necessary to provide a quality experience now, without regard to (and in anticipation of) near-future developments that render that hardware under-powered.
  - mrtksn 9y ago
    I didn't knew that Apple is doing it. iPhones are used for very long time, holding 2nd hand value the most of any other smartphone. The same goes for Macs, people tend to use these things for many years. In fact, Apple is still selling Macbook Airs like hot cakes despite the device not being significantly updated for almost a half decade now and people are happy with that product. The claim sounds like induced anxiety of a user who just couldn't swallow the premium paid over the same Ghz laptop or same Megapixel smartphone :)
    - hesarenu 9y ago
      Maybe they are happy with Air because its the cheapest Apple. I know since i got one recently for development purpose. I would have liked a better spec'd once, but others were costly.
      - mrtksn 9y ago
        I also have an 2015 Air, it performs as advertised. I can't say that the performance degraded over time, contrary to the claim.
        crankylinuxuser 9y ago
        I'm also going as far back as their first 20 MB SCSI drive that they charged $550 for when IBM compats were charging $400. They did something goofy, unsurprisingly to the hardware to prevent users from using the cheaper SCSI drives. And this was back in the '80 s. Its not surprising they still play their stupid games. People in tech have such short term memories - much here is on a day by day basis, or weekly. Yet, its the same actors in the Apple administration (well, minus Jobs).
    - fpig 9y ago
      I used my iPhone 4 for 6 years. I was very happy with it and it was virtually indestructible. The battery was also pretty decent even after 6 years. The iPhone 4 felt like a device that "lasts forever", like some pre-smartphone devices used to be. However, it did get slower over time more so than I would expect from a phone and became almost unusable near the end. Not sure whether it was OS updates, application updates, or what, but it was very noticeable. So I would agree with the grandparent comment in that respect. If I used my phone a lot, I would have probably bought a new phone MUCH earlier due to how slow the 4 became.
matte_black 9y ago
They do not "under-spec" their phones. They spec them to exactly what they need. Over-speccing a phone is useless and a waste of battery life. Remember: YAGNI.
- TeMPOraL 9y ago
  YAGNI is bullshit for infrastructure (including platforms). In fact, the opposite is true - the more you give, the more interesting uses follow. Every extra sensor, every screen resolution increase could be dismissed on the basis of YAGNI. Hell, that 64K quote comes to mind. Also, battery life and Apple phones - that's rich too, given that Apple was found to make iPhones reduce their computing power over time to preserve battery life, instead of educating their customers that batteries are not magic pixie dust, and they degrade over time.
  - freehunter 9y ago
    With that mindset, I demand Apple make an iPhone with a serial port and a built-in fax machine given how often I need a serial port and the ability to fax a piece of paper. I find myself morally outraged that they did not consider my very common use case when building their smartphone.
    - TeMPOraL 9y ago
      Not sure about the iPhone, but on Android phones you should be able to do both of those with appropriate USB-to-$whatever connector and an app. And this is possible precisely because people didn't go all YAGNI about a proper micro USB port and ability of apps to use it.
  - matte_black 9y ago
    Bwahaa, is this not the same Apple we're talking about? The one that eliminates headphone jacks and Flash and usb ports and cd drives and anything else people hold dear all in the name of YAGNI? If they could eliminate even less, I'm sure they would. The fact is, we need exactly what we have now, nothing more and nothing less.
crooked-v 9y ago
Actually, the latest iPhones are the fastest thing on the market. https://www.tomsguide.com/us/iphone-8-benchmarks-fastest-phone,review-4676.html https://www.tomsguide.com/us/iphone-8-benchmarks-fastest-pho...
coldtea 9y ago
>And my memory goes back to the mid 80's Your memory is faulty. They usually beat competing flagship models by a long margin, ever since the first model: E.g. https://www.gsmarena.com/a11_in_iphone_x_crushes_top_android_competition_in_geekbench-news-27302.php https://www.gsmarena.com/a11_in_iphone_x_crushes_top_android... Or: Until now, Samsung's flagship smartphones have always been king of the Android phones – but Google's latest offering has finally knocked it off its perch. Another shock is just how badly the new Sony XZ performed. It finished in last place, some two minutes slower than the iPhone 7. This isn’t the first time the Apple iPhone has won Gold in a speed test. Earlier this year, the team at PhoneBuff pitted the iPhone 7 against the now-discontinued Samsung Galaxy Note 7. The iPhone managed to open and close the chosen apps in a total time of 1 minute 40 seconds, while it took the Galaxy Note 7 a whole 3 minutes and 14 seconds to complete the same task. https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/science-technology/739606/iPhone-7-Google-Pixel-Samsung-Galaxy-S7-Speed-Test https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/science-technology/7396...

mrtksn 9y ago

What does under-specced even mean? How do you provide better experience by "under-spec" a product?

phil248 9y ago
It means you provide the minimum hardware necessary to provide a quality experience now, without regard to (and in anticipation of) near-future developments that render that hardware under-powered.
- mrtksn 9y ago
  I didn't knew that Apple is doing it. iPhones are used for very long time, holding 2nd hand value the most of any other smartphone. The same goes for Macs, people tend to use these things for many years. In fact, Apple is still selling Macbook Airs like hot cakes despite the device not being significantly updated for almost a half decade now and people are happy with that product. The claim sounds like induced anxiety of a user who just couldn't swallow the premium paid over the same Ghz laptop or same Megapixel smartphone :)
  - hesarenu 9y ago
    Maybe they are happy with Air because its the cheapest Apple. I know since i got one recently for development purpose. I would have liked a better spec'd once, but others were costly.
    - mrtksn 9y ago
      I also have an 2015 Air, it performs as advertised. I can't say that the performance degraded over time, contrary to the claim.
      - crankylinuxuser 9y ago
        I'm also going as far back as their first 20 MB SCSI drive that they charged $550 for when IBM compats were charging $400. They did something goofy, unsurprisingly to the hardware to prevent users from using the cheaper SCSI drives. And this was back in the '80 s. Its not surprising they still play their stupid games. People in tech have such short term memories - much here is on a day by day basis, or weekly. Yet, its the same actors in the Apple administration (well, minus Jobs).
  - fpig 9y ago
    I used my iPhone 4 for 6 years. I was very happy with it and it was virtually indestructible. The battery was also pretty decent even after 6 years. The iPhone 4 felt like a device that "lasts forever", like some pre-smartphone devices used to be. However, it did get slower over time more so than I would expect from a phone and became almost unusable near the end. Not sure whether it was OS updates, application updates, or what, but it was very noticeable. So I would agree with the grandparent comment in that respect. If I used my phone a lot, I would have probably bought a new phone MUCH earlier due to how slow the 4 became.

matte_black 9y ago

They do not "under-spec" their phones. They spec them to exactly what they need. Over-speccing a phone is useless and a waste of battery life. Remember: YAGNI.

TeMPOraL 9y ago
YAGNI is bullshit for infrastructure (including platforms). In fact, the opposite is true - the more you give, the more interesting uses follow. Every extra sensor, every screen resolution increase could be dismissed on the basis of YAGNI. Hell, that 64K quote comes to mind. Also, battery life and Apple phones - that's rich too, given that Apple was found to make iPhones reduce their computing power over time to preserve battery life, instead of educating their customers that batteries are not magic pixie dust, and they degrade over time.
- freehunter 9y ago
  With that mindset, I demand Apple make an iPhone with a serial port and a built-in fax machine given how often I need a serial port and the ability to fax a piece of paper. I find myself morally outraged that they did not consider my very common use case when building their smartphone.
  - TeMPOraL 9y ago
    Not sure about the iPhone, but on Android phones you should be able to do both of those with appropriate USB-to-$whatever connector and an app. And this is possible precisely because people didn't go all YAGNI about a proper micro USB port and ability of apps to use it.
- matte_black 9y ago
  Bwahaa, is this not the same Apple we're talking about? The one that eliminates headphone jacks and Flash and usb ports and cd drives and anything else people hold dear all in the name of YAGNI? If they could eliminate even less, I'm sure they would. The fact is, we need exactly what we have now, nothing more and nothing less.

crooked-v 9y ago

Actually, the latest iPhones are the fastest thing on the market. https://www.tomsguide.com/us/iphone-8-benchmarks-fastest-phone,review-4676.html https://www.tomsguide.com/us/iphone-8-benchmarks-fastest-pho...

coldtea 9y ago

>And my memory goes back to the mid 80's Your memory is faulty. They usually beat competing flagship models by a long margin, ever since the first model: E.g. https://www.gsmarena.com/a11_in_iphone_x_crushes_top_android_competition_in_geekbench-news-27302.php https://www.gsmarena.com/a11_in_iphone_x_crushes_top_android... Or: Until now, Samsung's flagship smartphones have always been king of the Android phones – but Google's latest offering has finally knocked it off its perch. Another shock is just how badly the new Sony XZ performed. It finished in last place, some two minutes slower than the iPhone 7. This isn’t the first time the Apple iPhone has won Gold in a speed test. Earlier this year, the team at PhoneBuff pitted the iPhone 7 against the now-discontinued Samsung Galaxy Note 7. The iPhone managed to open and close the chosen apps in a total time of 1 minute 40 seconds, while it took the Galaxy Note 7 a whole 3 minutes and 14 seconds to complete the same task. https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/science-technology/739606/iPhone-7-Google-Pixel-Samsung-Galaxy-S7-Speed-Test https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/science-technology/7396...