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Too quick to blame, "the screen". Is it really just the existence of social media that caused this, or is it maybe a change of culture that emerged with the spr

Too quick to blame, "the screen". Is it really just the existence of social media that caused this, or is it maybe a change of culture that emerged with the spread of the Internet and social media? For example, today a child from a religious community might encounter atheism at 12 or 13 whereas previously they would encounter it when they went off to college. Maybe that child happens to be suffering from depression and their faith would have provided them with the hope that they needed to persevere, but having discovered atheism at such a tender age, they are left hopeless and desolate. Not mature enough to deal with their problems on their own and with no reason to believe that things will get any better. I am not saying that the rise of atheism is a factor. It is just one example I came up with, on the spot, to explain how the change of culture due to the Internet might be the actual cause powering this trend, rather than the usage of the social media itself.

Momquist 9y ago
I find your example is extremely odd and disturbing. Facing other mindsets and cultures at a young age as a reason, or at least contributing, to depression? That's really a stretch. Are children also at risk when meeting with other kids of different religions? It could shake their own faith too, by the same logic.
- flukus 9y ago
  > Facing other mindsets and cultures at a young age as a reason, or at least contributing, to depression? That's really a stretch. I can see it contributing. Humans are tribal animals and teenagers are the extreme of this with all sorts of cliques and clubs that form in high schools. Imagine being a teenager and discovering that your in the wrong tribe, then imagine that the tribe you like is "at war" with your tribe. Even with modern communications it would be easy to feel isolated without that face to face interaction.
- abusoufiyan 9y ago
  Facing other mindsets and cultures is wholly different in real life versus solely online. Why do you think racism / anti-Semitism / anti-Muslim sentiment is so prominent online and so much less prominent in real life? Why does so much research show that actual, in-person interactions with people of other backgrounds reduces the strength of racist stereotypes in people's minds?
  - Momquist 9y ago
    > Why do you think racism / anti-Semitism / anti-Muslim sentiment is so prominent online and so much less prominent in real life? Mainly because speech isn't regulated online, and there's little to no repercussions when going beyond what's acceptable in "real life". Online discourse has become a way to show what's behind the facade that many feel forced to adopt when talking face to face. Basically there's less hypocrisy online, at least for a vocal minority, for good or bad. > Why does so much research show that actual, in-person interactions with people of other backgrounds reduces the strength of racist stereotypes in people's minds? That's the Intergroup Contact Theory. But I still don't see why it's useful to explain an increase in depression in young people. The primary "tribe" of a kid is close family, anyone else beyond is an outsider: they have different values and perspectives; even your neighbour may be of a different religion, another race, another economical class, etc... Meeting this otherness is simply life and unavoidable. Online social life just displays this otherness in a harsher light, the extremes are more apparent. Or are you proposing that we should lock up kids in their house for fear of their minds not being able to cope with what's outside? I'd argue that this overprotective mindset might actually be one of the reasons kids are more prone to depression these days, similar to how allergies are more prominent because we are less exposed to normal pathogens in early childhood. Kids falling back on online activities may be merely a side-effect of this, not the real cause of their anxiety/depression.
majewsky 9y ago
> Is it really just the existence of social media that caused this, or is it maybe a change of culture that emerged with the spread of the Internet and social media? I don't see how the difference would matter. You can never think technological progress without the societal changes it entails, even if software developers etc. like to do so to ignore the responsibility.
throwaway2801 9y ago
> having discovered atheism at such a tender age, they are left hopeless and desolate. (emphasis mine) What?? As if atheists were monsters. As an atheist (more agnostic actually - I cannot be sure no gods exist), your answer feels interesting but also surprising, very saddening and actually chocking. Let's not make atheists look like evil people who make children depressed. This is not OK. I never needed to have any "faith" to be happy. Solving my problems actually seems to be the solution to my happiness, not to believe or have faith in anything. On the other side, a big part of many religions seems to involve thinking about death and guilt. This can seem depressing and desolating from the point of view of an atheist. Can you imagine an atheist child being exposed to such a desolating way of seeing life? What happens when this child learns that there have been wars about such things as religions when the claim is that they are about tolerence? The child have rights to feel outright disoriented (guess what: I have been such a child). Fortunately, one people I know is very positive in their life (the most by far) and also happens to be a believer, and most people (including believers) I know are fine people and against wars, so I understand that believers do not have to approach religions like this. Anyway, though your example is insightful and enlightening, you could have made your point with a way better example. Or your point was the wrong one.
- xupybd 9y ago
  Perhaps the original post was not saying atheists are monsters but to encounter a massive challenge to their world view at a young age, may disrupt the comfort of children? Children are wrapped in the bubble of comfort by the boundaries they're raised in. When you mature you question those boundaries and find your own way in the world. But during your early years you may lack the maturity to challenge the foundation of your world view. Being exposed to other ways of thinking may lead to anxiety. It's only a recent thing that people have been so easily exposed to ideas from outside of the creed they were raised in. But I don't really know, just playing the devils advocate.
- darkstar999 9y ago
  I think you're taking it the wrong way. Perhaps they feel hopeless and desolate because they are stuck in the religious group after learning about other things.
rdm_blackhole 9y ago
So religious people never get depressed? What a stupid argument! Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems is completely delusional.
- sumedh 9y ago
  > Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems is completely delusional. Have you heard of the placebo effect?
- Momquist 9y ago
  You're exagerating the parent's claims. It is possible that religion can reduce stress, and help against depression without being an absolute defense. Our brain may just be wired that way. This doesn't even involve God or the supernatural actually existing for these effects to be real. You should check some of the talks, and lectures by Robert Sapolsky (an atheist), who advances this in several of them. Biological Underpinnings of Religiosity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WwAQqWUkpI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WwAQqWUkpI Religion Is Nature's Antidepressant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oldj11NEsc0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oldj11NEsc0
- abusoufiyan 9y ago
  Everyone believes in something unproven. Nobody has the capacity to create a worldview solely based on things they have personally proven to themselves. You have to trust someone somewhere without the ability to verify their claims. Every human being has to do this somewhere in their life.
- ageofwant 9y ago
  You are delusional if you claim you have evidence for everything you believe. You believe facts from sources you trust. And no human today has the capacity to independently verify what it believes to be True. You live your live by faith, just like everybody else.
- tomhoward 9y ago
  Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems Few religious people believe anything so simplistic, and many religious believers have a much greater sense of personal responsibility and empowerment than the norm. I'm not a religious believer, and only a few years ago I was an indignant anti-theist, but I can now easily accept that the decline of religion could be a factor in the rise in depression (having experienced much depression in my own life). Some of the factors in religion that may reduce the propensity for depression include: a sense of meaning beyond one's self; a sense of belonging and community; a sense of the transcendent; the sense of fulfilment that comes from charity and/or service to others; having a set of stories, principles, metaphors etc that can help in working through difficult life problems. Religion may not be for you, and the "benefits" I've suggested above may seem absurd given your own understanding or experience of religion, but please try to consider that perhaps the reason so many people still find it compelling is that there's more in it for them than there might seem from a simplistic assessment.

Momquist 9y ago

I find your example is extremely odd and disturbing. Facing other mindsets and cultures at a young age as a reason, or at least contributing, to depression? That's really a stretch. Are children also at risk when meeting with other kids of different religions? It could shake their own faith too, by the same logic.

flukus 9y ago
> Facing other mindsets and cultures at a young age as a reason, or at least contributing, to depression? That's really a stretch. I can see it contributing. Humans are tribal animals and teenagers are the extreme of this with all sorts of cliques and clubs that form in high schools. Imagine being a teenager and discovering that your in the wrong tribe, then imagine that the tribe you like is "at war" with your tribe. Even with modern communications it would be easy to feel isolated without that face to face interaction.
abusoufiyan 9y ago
Facing other mindsets and cultures is wholly different in real life versus solely online. Why do you think racism / anti-Semitism / anti-Muslim sentiment is so prominent online and so much less prominent in real life? Why does so much research show that actual, in-person interactions with people of other backgrounds reduces the strength of racist stereotypes in people's minds?
- Momquist 9y ago
  > Why do you think racism / anti-Semitism / anti-Muslim sentiment is so prominent online and so much less prominent in real life? Mainly because speech isn't regulated online, and there's little to no repercussions when going beyond what's acceptable in "real life". Online discourse has become a way to show what's behind the facade that many feel forced to adopt when talking face to face. Basically there's less hypocrisy online, at least for a vocal minority, for good or bad. > Why does so much research show that actual, in-person interactions with people of other backgrounds reduces the strength of racist stereotypes in people's minds? That's the Intergroup Contact Theory. But I still don't see why it's useful to explain an increase in depression in young people. The primary "tribe" of a kid is close family, anyone else beyond is an outsider: they have different values and perspectives; even your neighbour may be of a different religion, another race, another economical class, etc... Meeting this otherness is simply life and unavoidable. Online social life just displays this otherness in a harsher light, the extremes are more apparent. Or are you proposing that we should lock up kids in their house for fear of their minds not being able to cope with what's outside? I'd argue that this overprotective mindset might actually be one of the reasons kids are more prone to depression these days, similar to how allergies are more prominent because we are less exposed to normal pathogens in early childhood. Kids falling back on online activities may be merely a side-effect of this, not the real cause of their anxiety/depression.

majewsky 9y ago

> Is it really just the existence of social media that caused this, or is it maybe a change of culture that emerged with the spread of the Internet and social media? I don't see how the difference would matter. You can never think technological progress without the societal changes it entails, even if software developers etc. like to do so to ignore the responsibility.

throwaway2801 9y ago

> having discovered atheism at such a tender age, they are left hopeless and desolate. (emphasis mine) What?? As if atheists were monsters. As an atheist (more agnostic actually - I cannot be sure no gods exist), your answer feels interesting but also surprising, very saddening and actually chocking. Let's not make atheists look like evil people who make children depressed. This is not OK. I never needed to have any "faith" to be happy. Solving my problems actually seems to be the solution to my happiness, not to believe or have faith in anything. On the other side, a big part of many religions seems to involve thinking about death and guilt. This can seem depressing and desolating from the point of view of an atheist. Can you imagine an atheist child being exposed to such a desolating way of seeing life? What happens when this child learns that there have been wars about such things as religions when the claim is that they are about tolerence? The child have rights to feel outright disoriented (guess what: I have been such a child). Fortunately, one people I know is very positive in their life (the most by far) and also happens to be a believer, and most people (including believers) I know are fine people and against wars, so I understand that believers do not have to approach religions like this. Anyway, though your example is insightful and enlightening, you could have made your point with a way better example. Or your point was the wrong one.

xupybd 9y ago
Perhaps the original post was not saying atheists are monsters but to encounter a massive challenge to their world view at a young age, may disrupt the comfort of children? Children are wrapped in the bubble of comfort by the boundaries they're raised in. When you mature you question those boundaries and find your own way in the world. But during your early years you may lack the maturity to challenge the foundation of your world view. Being exposed to other ways of thinking may lead to anxiety. It's only a recent thing that people have been so easily exposed to ideas from outside of the creed they were raised in. But I don't really know, just playing the devils advocate.
darkstar999 9y ago
I think you're taking it the wrong way. Perhaps they feel hopeless and desolate because they are stuck in the religious group after learning about other things.

rdm_blackhole 9y ago

So religious people never get depressed? What a stupid argument! Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems is completely delusional.

sumedh 9y ago
> Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems is completely delusional. Have you heard of the placebo effect?
Momquist 9y ago
You're exagerating the parent's claims. It is possible that religion can reduce stress, and help against depression without being an absolute defense. Our brain may just be wired that way. This doesn't even involve God or the supernatural actually existing for these effects to be real. You should check some of the talks, and lectures by Robert Sapolsky (an atheist), who advances this in several of them. Biological Underpinnings of Religiosity: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WwAQqWUkpI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WwAQqWUkpI Religion Is Nature's Antidepressant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oldj11NEsc0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oldj11NEsc0
abusoufiyan 9y ago
Everyone believes in something unproven. Nobody has the capacity to create a worldview solely based on things they have personally proven to themselves. You have to trust someone somewhere without the ability to verify their claims. Every human being has to do this somewhere in their life.
ageofwant 9y ago
You are delusional if you claim you have evidence for everything you believe. You believe facts from sources you trust. And no human today has the capacity to independently verify what it believes to be True. You live your live by faith, just like everybody else.
tomhoward 9y ago
Believing that some (unproven and nonexistent) entity is going to solve all your problems Few religious people believe anything so simplistic, and many religious believers have a much greater sense of personal responsibility and empowerment than the norm. I'm not a religious believer, and only a few years ago I was an indignant anti-theist, but I can now easily accept that the decline of religion could be a factor in the rise in depression (having experienced much depression in my own life). Some of the factors in religion that may reduce the propensity for depression include: a sense of meaning beyond one's self; a sense of belonging and community; a sense of the transcendent; the sense of fulfilment that comes from charity and/or service to others; having a set of stories, principles, metaphors etc that can help in working through difficult life problems. Religion may not be for you, and the "benefits" I've suggested above may seem absurd given your own understanding or experience of religion, but please try to consider that perhaps the reason so many people still find it compelling is that there's more in it for them than there might seem from a simplistic assessment.