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Why does anyone have an account at Bank of America or Wells Fargo? There is a community bank in every town in the country.

supermarine 9y ago
Community banks are usually worse than regular banks. Credit unions are better, but large banks (Chase, Wells Fargo, BoA, etc) have (usually) more offerings (credit card + checking + car + mortgage + investing) and are usually a lot more accessible for normal people. Also: big banks advertise.
- dsmithatx 9y ago
  I haven't found this to be true. My credit union (for 10+ years) has never charged me any fees for checking and has had free online bill paying. They also gave me a great rate on my car loan. My previous credit union was very comparable. I had very bad experiences with BOA and Chase who hit me up with fees and made serious mistakes. Once I tried to make two payments because i was late the previous month. They manually decided that I must of made a mistake and failed to make one of the payments (they assumed it was mistake and never notified me). As a result my insurance was cancelled and renewing my policy cost me around $1700. That was at BOA 20 years ago and I've used credit unions ever since. Since I was barley getting by at the time I had no recourse.
  - supermarine 9y ago
    As I said: "Credit unions are better" So, you have found it to be true.
    - chipperyman573 9y ago
      Not the OP but I read your statement as "community banks are bad, credit unions are okay but larger banks are the best". I believe GP is arguing that credit unions are the best and larger banks are just okay.
  - delinka 9y ago
    About two years ago, my credit union started taking lessons from national banks. Charged late fees on a two loan accounts that had never been late (auto-drafted payments from a direct deposit destination); charged me for a replacement debit card when I reported one stolen; can't figure out that "wiring money" is actually free and points me at a third-party service they've hired for transferring money between banks - there's a fee for that; converted my free checking account into a fee checking account without notice. In all these cases, I could not get the fees reversed on the phone, but had to visit a branch in person, where the branch manager was indignant that I had the gall to rob the financial institution of their fees. I did get the fees refunded. And two weeks ago, I closed all my accounts with them. I am fortunate to have a community bank that acts the way my credit union once did. The only quibble I've ever had with them is with the staff not knowing the rules on overdraft fees.
    - hidenotslide 9y ago
      I think outgoing wires are almost never free, maybe you are thinking of ACH transfers? The rest of the things sound unfortunate though, and potentially illegal in the case of converting to a fee account without notice. Customer friendliness can vary a lot even within a bank/credit union depending on the customer and personal banker, since a lot of fee waivers are discretionary. E.g. if a banker has a fee waiver limit per month then they can help you at the start but not later in the month. Part of the issue is that since rates have been so low, the traditional net interest margin of banks has been squeezed so they turn to fees to compensate.
      - delinka 9y ago
        The issue was indeed with ACH. My apologies.
nfriedly 9y ago
Agreed. Bank with a local credit union. It's a better deal in general, and, when you hit an issue, you can talk to a human who a) gives a shit, and b) can actually do something to help you.
- AdamJacobMuller 9y ago
  I spent about 6 hours in a local credit union finalizing a loan for a new car I purchased early last year. They had made some mistakes, specifically saying they could extend the initial certification beyond 30 days when they could not, and couldn't disperse the funds without having the loan re-certified by a loan officer. Unfortunately, it was a Saturday and there were no loan officers on-hand. Double unfortunately, they needed the original bill of sale (pink carbon paper) to certify the loan. Every single bit of the process of getting this loan was like pulling teeth. That said, they pulled it off even on a Saturday. They realized they had made a mistake, they called in a loan officer who came to the branch on a Saturday and certified the loan. They even stayed open about two hours late so we could drive to the dealership and get the pink-slip and drive back. While the whole process was kafkaesque compared to dealer financing, unlike dealer financing these people were friendly and genuinely seemed to want to help and they did genuinely everything in their power to actually help. And, I got a crazy-low interest rate on my loan too. If they just spent a bit more time on their process, say, a PDF with a list of information on what you need to provide for a loan and when and things like approval expiration timelines they could make the process so much more pleasurable. In any event, A+++ would credit union again.
- romwell 9y ago
  I used to give this advice. But recently I realized that my primary credit union account, opened around 2007 or so, charges an ATM withdrawal fee ON TOP OF the ATM fee of the bank that owns the ATM. I withdraw cash so rarely that I haven't noticed this when the policy changed (when I opened the account, the credit union was REFUNDING the ATM fee assessed by other banks). Needless to say, I'm getting out of there. Probably to another credit union, though; I've had less-than-pleasant experiences with banks in the past (especially before the Obama administration outlawed opt-out "overdraft protection" scams that these banks were running).
norikki 9y ago
Most community banks shut down or got bought up as a result of the past 30 years of lobbying from big banks. My town's bank had operated independently for almost 100 years before being bought up a few years ago. Now my choices are BoA, Wells Fargo, or stashing bills under my mattress. Thanks crony capitalism.
- ac29 9y ago
  > Now my choices are BoA, Wells Fargo, or stashing bills under my mattress. For many, many years, I used an online-only checking/savings account. Its pretty viable, unless you have frequent urgent needs (like getting paid, and needing cash from that check the same day).
willart4food 9y ago
Yup. I have been using my very small (10 branches) local bank for >20 years. Totally free checking account, no minimum and not even direct deposit required.
thesagan 9y ago
Quite a few community banks were purchased over the last few years in my region. Many communities around me don't have anything but a regional or national bank today. The one in my hometown went from carries the bland name of "Commercial Bank" instead of "<Town Name> State Bank".
alsetmusic 9y ago
> Why does anyone have an account at Bank of America or Wells Fargo? There is a community bank in every town in the country. I used a credit union for a short period as a means for managing my finances during a rough period. I had to walk three miles to open the account. Same when there was a delay between signing up for direct deposit and I needed to cash my paycheck. I was also doing side gigs in my free time, so more walks for personal checks. I managed to get through it, but I was lucky. This was during a time of year when the weather was accommodating, but it easily could have happened during the winter. There is a Wells Fargo less than a five minute walk from me, however. I can easily imagine that some people can’t take the time (kids) or don’t have good enough health to make the sacrifice involved in choosing a small institution over what is geographically accessible.
- dkersten 9y ago
  I don’t really see the problem, honestly. I don’t live in the US, but I also don’t own a car and I live on the outskirts of a town. The closest supermarket is only half a mile away, but I regularly walk into the town center (either to go to a wider range of shops or to get the train or bus) which is approx. 1.5 mile walk (so 3 miles round trip). If I go to the city (by bus/train), I often walk 6 or 7 miles in a day. A few months ago, I commuted to the city and did that walk most days (I did work from home some of the days though). Its not been a big deal at all, for me. It also rains a lot here. Having said that, if there’s a Wells Fargo 5 minutes away, then I absolutely get why someone would choose to bank there than walk 3 miles to a credit union. Just because I don’t find walking to be a particularly big deal, doesn’t mean I wouldn’t minimise it if options exist to do so.
  - lazyasciiart 9y ago
    You probably didn't mean it, but it sounds like you're saying you don't understand why anyone could have trouble walking three miles? In case that's actually what you meant, then some of the reasons include disabilities (whether temporary like a broken leg, or permanent like arthritis), organizational constraints like having a small child with you, time constraints, or unsafe environments for the walk.
PostOnce 9y ago
My credit union was charging me between $10-20 (cant remember) per day for a 30 cent overdraft ... for a month, and never contacted me or emailed or anything to let me know my account was being perpetually driven further into debt. Not too sure about all this credit union fanaticism I hear about since that incident.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  There are presumably credit unions that suck (and yours sounds like it was one), but overall credit unions are generally superior in customer orientation to banks simply because they don't have a structural conflict between delivering customer value and serving shareholder interests. While the common interest requirements for credit unions have been weakened, the best credit unions are probably ones that still are attached to a strong community of common interest.
  - kaycebasques 9y ago
    > overall credit unions are generally superior in customer orientation to banks simply because they don't have a structural conflict between delivering customer value and serving shareholder interests Can you elaborate on the difference? I.e. why credit union incentives are different than big banks.
    - dllthomas 9y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_union > A credit union is a member-owned financial cooperative, democratically controlled by its members[.]
MachinShinn- 9y ago
I have the exact opposite question. Why would you bank anywhere BUT Bank of America/Chase/Wells Fargo? These banks are national and (along with a few others) issue all credit cards, even the ones you get at your local community bank. Its not like the Community Banks don't have fees...
loco5niner 9y ago
I have an old account from when I worked for BofA. Then my mortgage just happened to get sold to them. Free account! Now their app on my phone allows me to deposit checks! So for me, it's free and makes my life easier. If they ever charge me a monthly fee though, I am SO out of there. Closed my old Washington Mutual account when Chase bought them and introduced a fee. sad.
kaycebasques 9y ago
So, maybe one of the things that we here on HN can do, is to figure out a way to educate impoverished people on the benefits of credit unions (or community banks, I have no experience with those) over big banks.

supermarine 9y ago

Community banks are usually worse than regular banks. Credit unions are better, but large banks (Chase, Wells Fargo, BoA, etc) have (usually) more offerings (credit card + checking + car + mortgage + investing) and are usually a lot more accessible for normal people. Also: big banks advertise.

dsmithatx 9y ago
I haven't found this to be true. My credit union (for 10+ years) has never charged me any fees for checking and has had free online bill paying. They also gave me a great rate on my car loan. My previous credit union was very comparable. I had very bad experiences with BOA and Chase who hit me up with fees and made serious mistakes. Once I tried to make two payments because i was late the previous month. They manually decided that I must of made a mistake and failed to make one of the payments (they assumed it was mistake and never notified me). As a result my insurance was cancelled and renewing my policy cost me around $1700. That was at BOA 20 years ago and I've used credit unions ever since. Since I was barley getting by at the time I had no recourse.
- supermarine 9y ago
  As I said: "Credit unions are better" So, you have found it to be true.
  - chipperyman573 9y ago
    Not the OP but I read your statement as "community banks are bad, credit unions are okay but larger banks are the best". I believe GP is arguing that credit unions are the best and larger banks are just okay.
- delinka 9y ago
  About two years ago, my credit union started taking lessons from national banks. Charged late fees on a two loan accounts that had never been late (auto-drafted payments from a direct deposit destination); charged me for a replacement debit card when I reported one stolen; can't figure out that "wiring money" is actually free and points me at a third-party service they've hired for transferring money between banks - there's a fee for that; converted my free checking account into a fee checking account without notice. In all these cases, I could not get the fees reversed on the phone, but had to visit a branch in person, where the branch manager was indignant that I had the gall to rob the financial institution of their fees. I did get the fees refunded. And two weeks ago, I closed all my accounts with them. I am fortunate to have a community bank that acts the way my credit union once did. The only quibble I've ever had with them is with the staff not knowing the rules on overdraft fees.
  - hidenotslide 9y ago
    I think outgoing wires are almost never free, maybe you are thinking of ACH transfers? The rest of the things sound unfortunate though, and potentially illegal in the case of converting to a fee account without notice. Customer friendliness can vary a lot even within a bank/credit union depending on the customer and personal banker, since a lot of fee waivers are discretionary. E.g. if a banker has a fee waiver limit per month then they can help you at the start but not later in the month. Part of the issue is that since rates have been so low, the traditional net interest margin of banks has been squeezed so they turn to fees to compensate.
    - delinka 9y ago
      The issue was indeed with ACH. My apologies.

nfriedly 9y ago

Agreed. Bank with a local credit union. It's a better deal in general, and, when you hit an issue, you can talk to a human who a) gives a shit, and b) can actually do something to help you.

AdamJacobMuller 9y ago
I spent about 6 hours in a local credit union finalizing a loan for a new car I purchased early last year. They had made some mistakes, specifically saying they could extend the initial certification beyond 30 days when they could not, and couldn't disperse the funds without having the loan re-certified by a loan officer. Unfortunately, it was a Saturday and there were no loan officers on-hand. Double unfortunately, they needed the original bill of sale (pink carbon paper) to certify the loan. Every single bit of the process of getting this loan was like pulling teeth. That said, they pulled it off even on a Saturday. They realized they had made a mistake, they called in a loan officer who came to the branch on a Saturday and certified the loan. They even stayed open about two hours late so we could drive to the dealership and get the pink-slip and drive back. While the whole process was kafkaesque compared to dealer financing, unlike dealer financing these people were friendly and genuinely seemed to want to help and they did genuinely everything in their power to actually help. And, I got a crazy-low interest rate on my loan too. If they just spent a bit more time on their process, say, a PDF with a list of information on what you need to provide for a loan and when and things like approval expiration timelines they could make the process so much more pleasurable. In any event, A+++ would credit union again.
romwell 9y ago
I used to give this advice. But recently I realized that my primary credit union account, opened around 2007 or so, charges an ATM withdrawal fee ON TOP OF the ATM fee of the bank that owns the ATM. I withdraw cash so rarely that I haven't noticed this when the policy changed (when I opened the account, the credit union was REFUNDING the ATM fee assessed by other banks). Needless to say, I'm getting out of there. Probably to another credit union, though; I've had less-than-pleasant experiences with banks in the past (especially before the Obama administration outlawed opt-out "overdraft protection" scams that these banks were running).

norikki 9y ago

Most community banks shut down or got bought up as a result of the past 30 years of lobbying from big banks. My town's bank had operated independently for almost 100 years before being bought up a few years ago. Now my choices are BoA, Wells Fargo, or stashing bills under my mattress. Thanks crony capitalism.

ac29 9y ago
> Now my choices are BoA, Wells Fargo, or stashing bills under my mattress. For many, many years, I used an online-only checking/savings account. Its pretty viable, unless you have frequent urgent needs (like getting paid, and needing cash from that check the same day).

willart4food 9y ago

Yup. I have been using my very small (10 branches) local bank for >20 years. Totally free checking account, no minimum and not even direct deposit required.

thesagan 9y ago

Quite a few community banks were purchased over the last few years in my region. Many communities around me don't have anything but a regional or national bank today. The one in my hometown went from carries the bland name of "Commercial Bank" instead of "<Town Name> State Bank".

alsetmusic 9y ago

> Why does anyone have an account at Bank of America or Wells Fargo? There is a community bank in every town in the country. I used a credit union for a short period as a means for managing my finances during a rough period. I had to walk three miles to open the account. Same when there was a delay between signing up for direct deposit and I needed to cash my paycheck. I was also doing side gigs in my free time, so more walks for personal checks. I managed to get through it, but I was lucky. This was during a time of year when the weather was accommodating, but it easily could have happened during the winter. There is a Wells Fargo less than a five minute walk from me, however. I can easily imagine that some people can’t take the time (kids) or don’t have good enough health to make the sacrifice involved in choosing a small institution over what is geographically accessible.

dkersten 9y ago
I don’t really see the problem, honestly. I don’t live in the US, but I also don’t own a car and I live on the outskirts of a town. The closest supermarket is only half a mile away, but I regularly walk into the town center (either to go to a wider range of shops or to get the train or bus) which is approx. 1.5 mile walk (so 3 miles round trip). If I go to the city (by bus/train), I often walk 6 or 7 miles in a day. A few months ago, I commuted to the city and did that walk most days (I did work from home some of the days though). Its not been a big deal at all, for me. It also rains a lot here. Having said that, if there’s a Wells Fargo 5 minutes away, then I absolutely get why someone would choose to bank there than walk 3 miles to a credit union. Just because I don’t find walking to be a particularly big deal, doesn’t mean I wouldn’t minimise it if options exist to do so.
- lazyasciiart 9y ago
  You probably didn't mean it, but it sounds like you're saying you don't understand why anyone could have trouble walking three miles? In case that's actually what you meant, then some of the reasons include disabilities (whether temporary like a broken leg, or permanent like arthritis), organizational constraints like having a small child with you, time constraints, or unsafe environments for the walk.

PostOnce 9y ago

My credit union was charging me between $10-20 (cant remember) per day for a 30 cent overdraft ... for a month, and never contacted me or emailed or anything to let me know my account was being perpetually driven further into debt. Not too sure about all this credit union fanaticism I hear about since that incident.

dragonwriter 9y ago
There are presumably credit unions that suck (and yours sounds like it was one), but overall credit unions are generally superior in customer orientation to banks simply because they don't have a structural conflict between delivering customer value and serving shareholder interests. While the common interest requirements for credit unions have been weakened, the best credit unions are probably ones that still are attached to a strong community of common interest.
- kaycebasques 9y ago
  > overall credit unions are generally superior in customer orientation to banks simply because they don't have a structural conflict between delivering customer value and serving shareholder interests Can you elaborate on the difference? I.e. why credit union incentives are different than big banks.
  - dllthomas 9y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_union > A credit union is a member-owned financial cooperative, democratically controlled by its members[.]

MachinShinn- 9y ago

I have the exact opposite question. Why would you bank anywhere BUT Bank of America/Chase/Wells Fargo? These banks are national and (along with a few others) issue all credit cards, even the ones you get at your local community bank. Its not like the Community Banks don't have fees...

loco5niner 9y ago

I have an old account from when I worked for BofA. Then my mortgage just happened to get sold to them. Free account! Now their app on my phone allows me to deposit checks! So for me, it's free and makes my life easier. If they ever charge me a monthly fee though, I am SO out of there. Closed my old Washington Mutual account when Chase bought them and introduced a fee. sad.

kaycebasques 9y ago

So, maybe one of the things that we here on HN can do, is to figure out a way to educate impoverished people on the benefits of credit unions (or community banks, I have no experience with those) over big banks.