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Could we not exaggerate? It doesn't help the discussion. plus all the violence committed by Nazis (e.g. the Heather Heyer murder and the other actions counted

Could we not exaggerate? It doesn't help the discussion. plus all the violence committed by Nazis (e.g. the Heather Heyer murder and the other actions counted as right-wing domestic terrorism) "all of the violence", you listed one death. One death is a tragedy, but it's not a massively systematic problem unless we act like it is and turn it into one. You also act like there isn't such a thing as left-wing domestic terrorism. That terrorism killed more people in a single event, 7/7/16, than that nutjob running someone over did. What about the mob of nazis and anti-facists getting into fights in Berkeley? If you're not committed to one of those groups, it's just as bad. It's mob violence either way. Nazis suck, but please try to be objective. When you frame the argument as you are, you are setting up flamebait. Some nazi will use your exaggerations against you.

mschuster91 9y ago
> One death is a tragedy, but it's not a massively systematic problem unless we act like it is and turn it into one. It is a systematic problem. 150 incidents between 1993 and 2017, an average of 6 terrorist incidents a year or once every two months. 255 people died, 603 people were injured. Source: https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/dark-constant-rage-25-years-of-right-wing-terrorism-in-united-states https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/dark-constan... Note: this is just the violence that got counted as terrorist violence, not your ordinary Nazi running around and slapping PoC.
- aaron-lebo 9y ago
  It is a problem, but not the way you are exaggerating it to be. You act as if there is a nazi army ready to march on the nation, but that's not happening. We do have pockets of bigots and racists and god knows what else, but they don't have huge bases of support unless we act like they do. Nazis want to feel important, they want people to get riled up and fight them. That's what the actual nazis did. ordinary Nazi running around and slapping PoC There are a lot of bigots and racists doing thaT, but unless we're being really loose with the term nazi, we don't actually have that many nazis running around. Their worst acts were in the mid 1990s (OKC). Hell, in 1999 in Jasper, some racists lynched a man. 1999! Those people have always been around, they always will be around. There's always going to be some number of incidents. That does not mean they have real power nor should people act like they do. This is a decent read: https://www.npr.org/2017/06/16/533255619/fact-check-is-left-wing-violence-rising https://www.npr.org/2017/06/16/533255619/fact-check-is-left-...
  - UncleEntity 9y ago
    Basically, from what I can tell, nazi is anyone with an opposing viewpoint. I would also posit the majority of recent political violence is from the Antifa folks who believe they can shutdown their opponents through pure and simple violence. In fact there was one act of violence attributed to all the "tea party" protests during the Obama era and that was instigated by an anti-tea party person. For two generations political protests were virtually 100% violence-free until the current crop of kids took to the streets with their anti- trump activities. Makes me sad really...
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - RandomTisk 9y ago
      There is a sort of folly that makes one overestimate the value they place on something. Imagine a knight who wants to be brave and courageous, whose pursuit of valor takes him to a place where he heard many evil creatures are gathered. So he goes into a starving mongrel's den and attempts to slay the wild beasts. He kills one, strikes another, and the rest get away. He drags the dead one back to the city square where his minstrels sing his praises. He killed one wild animal, that may or may not have hurt anyone, and achieves a great deal of valor, all at very little risk to himself in his shiny armor. Meanwhile the next town over is being raped and pillaged by bears, lions, pirates and wildfires.
    - SolaceQuantum 9y ago
      > For two generations political protests were virtually 100% violence-free Two generations? So 60 years? Political protests were virtually 100% violence free? [1][2][3] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodney_King https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodney_King 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democratic_National_Convention#Protests_and_police_response https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democratic_National_Conve...
      - UncleEntity 9y ago
- mizzack 9y ago
  You're still exaggerating and conflating here. The majority of those deaths (168/250) came from a single incident--the OKC bombing--where neither perpetrator was a Nazi/racial extremist. Hell, even trying to call the OKC bombing "right wing" might be a stretch. They were anti govt separatists!
balthasar 9y ago
Considering the U.S. government was just shutdown over a purge of immigrants I'm not sure what more proof you need.
- aaron-lebo 9y ago
  That being anti-illegal immigration is being a nazi? That's evidence of exaggerated rhetoric, which distorts the discussion.
  - mschuster91 9y ago
    > That's evidence of exaggerated rhetoric, which distorts the discussion. Simply apply this old quote whenever you hear an "alt-righter", a "white nationalist" or a "teabagger" talking, and replace "duck" with "nazi": "When I see a bird that walks like a duck and swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, I call that bird a duck." It's not exaggerated rhetoric when you call out that the core ideals of these groups equate those of Nazism (or fascism, but the distinction is really nitpicking). It's simply new words for old hate. These groups and their friends and supporters are as dangerous as Hitler was before rising to power!

mschuster91 9y ago

> One death is a tragedy, but it's not a massively systematic problem unless we act like it is and turn it into one. It is a systematic problem. 150 incidents between 1993 and 2017, an average of 6 terrorist incidents a year or once every two months. 255 people died, 603 people were injured. Source: https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/dark-constant-rage-25-years-of-right-wing-terrorism-in-united-states https://www.adl.org/education/resources/reports/dark-constan... Note: this is just the violence that got counted as terrorist violence, not your ordinary Nazi running around and slapping PoC.

aaron-lebo 9y ago
It is a problem, but not the way you are exaggerating it to be. You act as if there is a nazi army ready to march on the nation, but that's not happening. We do have pockets of bigots and racists and god knows what else, but they don't have huge bases of support unless we act like they do. Nazis want to feel important, they want people to get riled up and fight them. That's what the actual nazis did. ordinary Nazi running around and slapping PoC There are a lot of bigots and racists doing thaT, but unless we're being really loose with the term nazi, we don't actually have that many nazis running around. Their worst acts were in the mid 1990s (OKC). Hell, in 1999 in Jasper, some racists lynched a man. 1999! Those people have always been around, they always will be around. There's always going to be some number of incidents. That does not mean they have real power nor should people act like they do. This is a decent read: https://www.npr.org/2017/06/16/533255619/fact-check-is-left-wing-violence-rising https://www.npr.org/2017/06/16/533255619/fact-check-is-left-...
- UncleEntity 9y ago
  Basically, from what I can tell, nazi is anyone with an opposing viewpoint. I would also posit the majority of recent political violence is from the Antifa folks who believe they can shutdown their opponents through pure and simple violence. In fact there was one act of violence attributed to all the "tea party" protests during the Obama era and that was instigated by an anti-tea party person. For two generations political protests were virtually 100% violence-free until the current crop of kids took to the streets with their anti- trump activities. Makes me sad really...
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - RandomTisk 9y ago
    There is a sort of folly that makes one overestimate the value they place on something. Imagine a knight who wants to be brave and courageous, whose pursuit of valor takes him to a place where he heard many evil creatures are gathered. So he goes into a starving mongrel's den and attempts to slay the wild beasts. He kills one, strikes another, and the rest get away. He drags the dead one back to the city square where his minstrels sing his praises. He killed one wild animal, that may or may not have hurt anyone, and achieves a great deal of valor, all at very little risk to himself in his shiny armor. Meanwhile the next town over is being raped and pillaged by bears, lions, pirates and wildfires.
  - SolaceQuantum 9y ago
    > For two generations political protests were virtually 100% violence-free Two generations? So 60 years? Political protests were virtually 100% violence free? [1][2][3] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodney_King https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodney_King 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democratic_National_Convention#Protests_and_police_response https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democratic_National_Conve...
    - UncleEntity 9y ago
mizzack 9y ago
You're still exaggerating and conflating here. The majority of those deaths (168/250) came from a single incident--the OKC bombing--where neither perpetrator was a Nazi/racial extremist. Hell, even trying to call the OKC bombing "right wing" might be a stretch. They were anti govt separatists!

balthasar 9y ago

Considering the U.S. government was just shutdown over a purge of immigrants I'm not sure what more proof you need.

aaron-lebo 9y ago
That being anti-illegal immigration is being a nazi? That's evidence of exaggerated rhetoric, which distorts the discussion.
- mschuster91 9y ago
  > That's evidence of exaggerated rhetoric, which distorts the discussion. Simply apply this old quote whenever you hear an "alt-righter", a "white nationalist" or a "teabagger" talking, and replace "duck" with "nazi": "When I see a bird that walks like a duck and swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, I call that bird a duck." It's not exaggerated rhetoric when you call out that the core ideals of these groups equate those of Nazism (or fascism, but the distinction is really nitpicking). It's simply new words for old hate. These groups and their friends and supporters are as dangerous as Hitler was before rising to power!