5 ms·

Honestly, I think he's more seen as a pulp-y xenophobe than a genius. But could he write portentous purple prose, or what?

ekianjo 9y ago
> xenophobe More than the people of his time?
- scandox 9y ago
  Yes extremely more. And I like his stories.
  - ekianjo 9y ago
    Someone born in 1890 like Lovecraft would have been educated in the early 1900s where it was all about the White Race superiority to all other ones (check school books of the time) on top of hundreds of years of such thinking, so my guess is that you'd find people thinking like Lovecraft pretty much everywhere in his time. And regarding antisemitism, it's not like Lovecraft was an exception, antisemitism was rampant in early 20th century. So while Lovecraft was vocal about it in his letters, I doubt his peers and folks of his time would have very, very different.
    - scandox 9y ago
      I make my argument from his work, not from history. And I am responding specifically to the word Xenophobe. I think Houellebecq's analysis[1] is correct - the force of his work derives from the very extreme nature of his Xenophobia, which is personal and psychological in nature rather than ideological. Certainly he garlanded it with all the ideological backup he could find, but I don't think that's where it came from. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20060507063256/http://blog.urbanomic.com/dread/archives/houellebecq-lovecraft.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20060507063256/http://blog.urban...
chc 9y ago
"Lovecraftian" is still used as a general term for an entire genre of fiction. He was a xenophobe, but that is not what he's best known for. Similarly, Aristotle was a misogynist, but it would not be accurate to say that Aristotle is best known as a navel-gazing misogynist.
- scarmig 9y ago
  I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Lovecraft is fundamentally about confronting modernism and the inevitable decay of humanity in the faces of forces beyond our control. Central to that is the decay of the Anglo-Saxon genetic stock. Xenophobic isn't quite the right word. Racist is closer, but even that misses the mark. Every story he writes is terrified of black voodoo savages, or toothless white hill people, or inbred decadent Boston brahmin families, or fishermen that are half-white-half-Chinese-half-fish. Aristotle, by contrast, isn't that concerned with gender. He is happy to treat it as a topic, but he has nowhere near the same level of preoccupation.
  - Apocryphon 9y ago
    Ur-tribalist, perhaps.
    - sooheon 9y ago
      Wow, I just learned that I despise the prefix "ur-" far more than is reasonable. Seriously though, why not call it "tribalist"?
      - Apocryphon 9y ago
        Not ultra- enough, in Lovecraft's case.
        Cthulhu_ 9y ago
        Lovecraft would've added at least three more adjectives.
scandox 9y ago
He had an imaginative genius and a capability to create worlds but he was a bad writer plain and simple. He writes poorly but he has massive emotional and psychological force.

ekianjo 9y ago

> xenophobe More than the people of his time?

scandox 9y ago
Yes extremely more. And I like his stories.
- ekianjo 9y ago
  Someone born in 1890 like Lovecraft would have been educated in the early 1900s where it was all about the White Race superiority to all other ones (check school books of the time) on top of hundreds of years of such thinking, so my guess is that you'd find people thinking like Lovecraft pretty much everywhere in his time. And regarding antisemitism, it's not like Lovecraft was an exception, antisemitism was rampant in early 20th century. So while Lovecraft was vocal about it in his letters, I doubt his peers and folks of his time would have very, very different.
  - scandox 9y ago
    I make my argument from his work, not from history. And I am responding specifically to the word Xenophobe. I think Houellebecq's analysis[1] is correct - the force of his work derives from the very extreme nature of his Xenophobia, which is personal and psychological in nature rather than ideological. Certainly he garlanded it with all the ideological backup he could find, but I don't think that's where it came from. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20060507063256/http://blog.urbanomic.com/dread/archives/houellebecq-lovecraft.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20060507063256/http://blog.urban...

chc 9y ago

"Lovecraftian" is still used as a general term for an entire genre of fiction. He was a xenophobe, but that is not what he's best known for. Similarly, Aristotle was a misogynist, but it would not be accurate to say that Aristotle is best known as a navel-gazing misogynist.

scarmig 9y ago
I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Lovecraft is fundamentally about confronting modernism and the inevitable decay of humanity in the faces of forces beyond our control. Central to that is the decay of the Anglo-Saxon genetic stock. Xenophobic isn't quite the right word. Racist is closer, but even that misses the mark. Every story he writes is terrified of black voodoo savages, or toothless white hill people, or inbred decadent Boston brahmin families, or fishermen that are half-white-half-Chinese-half-fish. Aristotle, by contrast, isn't that concerned with gender. He is happy to treat it as a topic, but he has nowhere near the same level of preoccupation.
- Apocryphon 9y ago
  Ur-tribalist, perhaps.
  - sooheon 9y ago
    Wow, I just learned that I despise the prefix "ur-" far more than is reasonable. Seriously though, why not call it "tribalist"?
    - Apocryphon 9y ago
      Not ultra- enough, in Lovecraft's case.
      - Cthulhu_ 9y ago
        Lovecraft would've added at least three more adjectives.

scandox 9y ago

He had an imaginative genius and a capability to create worlds but he was a bad writer plain and simple. He writes poorly but he has massive emotional and psychological force.