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For me, it would be signs of a sensible structure and use of commits. It is extremely offputting to see some obvious code dump, with like 2 commits in total (o

For me, it would be signs of a sensible structure and use of commits. It is extremely offputting to see some obvious code dump, with like 2 commits in total (one of which is “fixd typo lol”), no real directory structure, etc. A repository is an opportunity to show off how good you are at organizing a project, breaking down your commits, etc. Only after any of that looks promising, will I bother to read any code (after all, it takes time to understand something and the harder it is to grok the less likely I’ll spend the time).

sowhat99 9y ago
So what? I use Github for any code that I want to share. I’m sorry my weekend project only has two commits. I didn’t realize I was being scrutinized for every tiny detail. Would you like every social media post as well to make sure I’m perfect 100% of the time, even in informal situations where perfection is not expected? I would not want to work with/for you.
- thsowers 9y ago
  The difference being that you don't submit your social media profile as part of applying for a job. I agree with grandparent though, looking for structure of commits showing organization is important. No one is a perfect coder, but it is discouraging to look at a candidates GitHub and see that the majority of it is a mess since they included the url on their application, which generally indicates it's something that they want to show off. Not every repository or commit has to be perfect, but if you submit a public GitHub profile, expect it to be scrutinized in detail.
  - Sir_Substance 9y ago
    >The difference being that you don't submit your social media profile as part of applying for a job. Github is a social media platform. Last time I applied for a job, I gave the company an account and URL to access my self-hosted kallithea instance instead. There are a world of benefits to this. I only gave them view access to the projects I considered to be portfolio pieces, and locked them away from the scratch projects. It also allowed me to see how many times they logged in, which is how I know that they never actually looked at any of my hobby code before offering me the job. Lets be real here, companies want your github profile for the same reason they look you up on facebook: everyones at least a little bit into voyeurism. Give 'em something that they know will be logged and scrutinized back, and you'll see what a chilling effect looks like.
- bjourne 9y ago
  It should be like this: well-organized github > chaotic github >> no github instead, when employers evaluate github profiles, they reason like this: well-organized github > no github >> chaotic github
  - gruez 9y ago
    >It should be like this: >well-organized github > chaotic github >> no github I don't like to share my random projects on github, just like I don't like to share my life on facebook, fuck me right?
    - mwfunk 9y ago
      Anecdotal of course, but in my experience, when hiring professional engineers, neither I nor anyone I know would judge someone for not having a Github page to look at. If they have one, great, I'll take a look, but if not, no big deal. It's not an expectation at non-startup tech companies. I've heard some people here on HN occasionally say that if an applicant doesn't have a Github page to look at, they will think less of them and maybe not even give them an interview. I always imagine the people who say this as being guys in their early-to-mid-20s who are fresh out of school, never worked anywhere outside their comfort zone, are still within a comfy bubble of friends and family, and went directly to the startup path where they are learning about stuff like recruiting and management in real time (if not outright making it up as they go along). I don't know if that's a fair characterization- it probably is unfair and inaccurate. But that's the stereotypical person my subconscious imagines those posts come from. The silver lining is, if someone doesn't give you an interview because you lack a Github page, you probably don't want to work for them anyway.
      - Sir_Substance 9y ago
        >It's not an expectation at non-startup tech companies. Not true in the slightest. Before you get to talk to the engineers like this, you must first pass the HR filter. HR are not engineers, but they think they see a parallel to their own work. In HR, all HR applicants are expected to have a linkedin page, because linkedin makes HR's life a lot easier. I have Strong Opinions about this state of affairs, but none the less, there is a hovering perception in most HR offices of "if you don't have a linkedin page, how good at your job can you really be?". So then HR hears the engineers talking about github and profiles and sharing code and they dig a bit, and they often decide that github is basically linkedin for engineers. Lets be real, they're kinda right in some ways. But they're dead wrong in others. Lets not get sidetracked, but just say there are valid reasons some people don't use it. Engineers have the full picture and know this. Like you say, most professional engineers won't judge you for not having github. However, HR lacks the context to understand this, and so they increasingly throw out engineering CV's that don't include a github link. It's a growing problem.
- pjungwir 9y ago
  I agree with this, but if you have some projects you're proud of, Github lets you include/arrange six "pinned repositories" on your profile page, so that prospective employers/clients see those rather than your messy weekend hacking. There's no reason you can't have both clean and messy!
- hartator 9y ago
  You can use GitHub for code dumps sure, but I guess grandparent was assuming we were talking about legit open source repositories, not another hello world.
- pkamb 9y ago
  You view "commit hygiene" as something that does not matter. I view it as one of the most important aspects of a software developer's workflow. If you don't see the value of atomic commits in any software you're creating, I doubt you would properly apply it to our teams' repos.
- brandonmenc 9y ago
  > I’m sorry my weekend project only has two commits. This is like being a graphic designer and saying, "I disable the undo feature in Photoshop for all my personal projects." It makes no sense to people for whom source control is second nature, and I'd be reluctant to hire someone for whom source control is not second nature.
- mwfunk 9y ago
  If you're presenting what you have on Github to a potential employer as a shining example of what you're capable of, then yeah, it should be polished as hell, because you are literally presenting it to someone as an example of the heights that you're capable of and why they should hire you. If instead it's just a casual place where you mostly just plop random stuff to share with friends, that's fine too, but don't show it to a potential employer, any more than you would send them links to all those social media posts that you don't want them to judge you by. It's pretty simple. If you're going through some company's hiring process and slip in a, "hey, by the way, check me out on Github", they will naturally interpret its contents as an example of you at your best, because otherwise why would you want them to check it out? Job seekers don't go out of their way to publicize their Github output on their resume if it's just a place for brain dumps and code snippets. Nothing wrong with using it that way of course, but it's not a useful thing to show to hiring managers, in the same way that I wouldn't go out of my way to show them my class notes or old tests from college. It's not relevant, and may even give them the wrong impressions.
spookyuser 9y ago
That scary because in all the repositories I've made public so far, I always have a private version with the full commit history and start a new public repository when I'm comfortable publishing it. I don't even know if I could do it another way because at the early stages of a project I tend to leave a lot of junk in the commits that I wouldn't want to be public :/
seba_dos1 9y ago
I'm a frequent game jam participant, that's my little weird hobby. My GitHub now is an ugly mix of my well-done free software projects, forks of thinks that I contribute to, small little utilities/hacks/old student projects I upload just in case it's useful for someone someday, and tens of ugly code dumps of things I made from scratch in 48 hours with varying output quality and constantly bad code quality. And I don't feel bad about it at all :P

sowhat99 9y ago

So what? I use Github for any code that I want to share. I’m sorry my weekend project only has two commits. I didn’t realize I was being scrutinized for every tiny detail. Would you like every social media post as well to make sure I’m perfect 100% of the time, even in informal situations where perfection is not expected? I would not want to work with/for you.

thsowers 9y ago
The difference being that you don't submit your social media profile as part of applying for a job. I agree with grandparent though, looking for structure of commits showing organization is important. No one is a perfect coder, but it is discouraging to look at a candidates GitHub and see that the majority of it is a mess since they included the url on their application, which generally indicates it's something that they want to show off. Not every repository or commit has to be perfect, but if you submit a public GitHub profile, expect it to be scrutinized in detail.
- Sir_Substance 9y ago
  >The difference being that you don't submit your social media profile as part of applying for a job. Github is a social media platform. Last time I applied for a job, I gave the company an account and URL to access my self-hosted kallithea instance instead. There are a world of benefits to this. I only gave them view access to the projects I considered to be portfolio pieces, and locked them away from the scratch projects. It also allowed me to see how many times they logged in, which is how I know that they never actually looked at any of my hobby code before offering me the job. Lets be real here, companies want your github profile for the same reason they look you up on facebook: everyones at least a little bit into voyeurism. Give 'em something that they know will be logged and scrutinized back, and you'll see what a chilling effect looks like.
bjourne 9y ago
It should be like this: well-organized github > chaotic github >> no github instead, when employers evaluate github profiles, they reason like this: well-organized github > no github >> chaotic github
- gruez 9y ago
  >It should be like this: >well-organized github > chaotic github >> no github I don't like to share my random projects on github, just like I don't like to share my life on facebook, fuck me right?
  - mwfunk 9y ago
    Anecdotal of course, but in my experience, when hiring professional engineers, neither I nor anyone I know would judge someone for not having a Github page to look at. If they have one, great, I'll take a look, but if not, no big deal. It's not an expectation at non-startup tech companies. I've heard some people here on HN occasionally say that if an applicant doesn't have a Github page to look at, they will think less of them and maybe not even give them an interview. I always imagine the people who say this as being guys in their early-to-mid-20s who are fresh out of school, never worked anywhere outside their comfort zone, are still within a comfy bubble of friends and family, and went directly to the startup path where they are learning about stuff like recruiting and management in real time (if not outright making it up as they go along). I don't know if that's a fair characterization- it probably is unfair and inaccurate. But that's the stereotypical person my subconscious imagines those posts come from. The silver lining is, if someone doesn't give you an interview because you lack a Github page, you probably don't want to work for them anyway.
    - Sir_Substance 9y ago
      >It's not an expectation at non-startup tech companies. Not true in the slightest. Before you get to talk to the engineers like this, you must first pass the HR filter. HR are not engineers, but they think they see a parallel to their own work. In HR, all HR applicants are expected to have a linkedin page, because linkedin makes HR's life a lot easier. I have Strong Opinions about this state of affairs, but none the less, there is a hovering perception in most HR offices of "if you don't have a linkedin page, how good at your job can you really be?". So then HR hears the engineers talking about github and profiles and sharing code and they dig a bit, and they often decide that github is basically linkedin for engineers. Lets be real, they're kinda right in some ways. But they're dead wrong in others. Lets not get sidetracked, but just say there are valid reasons some people don't use it. Engineers have the full picture and know this. Like you say, most professional engineers won't judge you for not having github. However, HR lacks the context to understand this, and so they increasingly throw out engineering CV's that don't include a github link. It's a growing problem.
pjungwir 9y ago
I agree with this, but if you have some projects you're proud of, Github lets you include/arrange six "pinned repositories" on your profile page, so that prospective employers/clients see those rather than your messy weekend hacking. There's no reason you can't have both clean and messy!
hartator 9y ago
You can use GitHub for code dumps sure, but I guess grandparent was assuming we were talking about legit open source repositories, not another hello world.
pkamb 9y ago
You view "commit hygiene" as something that does not matter. I view it as one of the most important aspects of a software developer's workflow. If you don't see the value of atomic commits in any software you're creating, I doubt you would properly apply it to our teams' repos.
brandonmenc 9y ago
> I’m sorry my weekend project only has two commits. This is like being a graphic designer and saying, "I disable the undo feature in Photoshop for all my personal projects." It makes no sense to people for whom source control is second nature, and I'd be reluctant to hire someone for whom source control is not second nature.
mwfunk 9y ago
If you're presenting what you have on Github to a potential employer as a shining example of what you're capable of, then yeah, it should be polished as hell, because you are literally presenting it to someone as an example of the heights that you're capable of and why they should hire you. If instead it's just a casual place where you mostly just plop random stuff to share with friends, that's fine too, but don't show it to a potential employer, any more than you would send them links to all those social media posts that you don't want them to judge you by. It's pretty simple. If you're going through some company's hiring process and slip in a, "hey, by the way, check me out on Github", they will naturally interpret its contents as an example of you at your best, because otherwise why would you want them to check it out? Job seekers don't go out of their way to publicize their Github output on their resume if it's just a place for brain dumps and code snippets. Nothing wrong with using it that way of course, but it's not a useful thing to show to hiring managers, in the same way that I wouldn't go out of my way to show them my class notes or old tests from college. It's not relevant, and may even give them the wrong impressions.

spookyuser 9y ago

That scary because in all the repositories I've made public so far, I always have a private version with the full commit history and start a new public repository when I'm comfortable publishing it. I don't even know if I could do it another way because at the early stages of a project I tend to leave a lot of junk in the commits that I wouldn't want to be public :/

seba_dos1 9y ago

I'm a frequent game jam participant, that's my little weird hobby. My GitHub now is an ugly mix of my well-done free software projects, forks of thinks that I contribute to, small little utilities/hacks/old student projects I upload just in case it's useful for someone someday, and tens of ugly code dumps of things I made from scratch in 48 hours with varying output quality and constantly bad code quality. And I don't feel bad about it at all :P