4 ms·

This is an interesting move strategically. By making US-based solar panel manufacturers artificially more competitive, this tariff will allow them to develop in

This is an interesting move strategically. By making US-based solar panel manufacturers artificially more competitive, this tariff will allow them to develop in-house expertise and reduce dependency on China for the manufacturing stage of the supply chain. If solar eventually becomes an important source of power, the US would not want to be wholly reliant on a geopolitical rival for manufacturing expertise. This could thus be construed as a vote for the long-term dominance of solar as an energy source.

dv_dt 9y ago
While this is possibly true, this is also the most wishful of interpretations for the Trump administrations actions. It's much simpler and more likely to interpret the action as anti-solar & renewable, and pro fossil fuel. Unless it's also backed up with added incentives to manufacture solar in country. I predict that won't happen, and even if it did new plants of any significance would be 5-10 years out and in the meantime all we've done is shot ourselves in the foot.
- kyrra 9y ago
  If he wanted to be true anti-solar, he'd work on killing the ITC (tax credit) that people are using to offset the cost of solar today (though it will fully disappear in ~4 years at the current schedule).
  - sandworm101 9y ago
    >>> killing the ITC (tax credit) Raising taxes isn't a big priority for him atm. Those pro-solar deductions are used by a great may companies.
  - Fnoord 9y ago
    > If he wanted to be true anti-solar [...] No true Scotsman. One doesn't exclude the other. Perhaps this is even next on his list, who knows (lets not give him ideas wink)
    - nielsbot 9y ago
      Trump read Hacker News? I wouldn't worry...
  - dv_dt 9y ago
    Before the final turns of the tax bill, I think the PTC solar credit was on the chopping block in the senate version. I suspect the ITC is temporarily protected by needing some extended regulatory process timeline to kill as early. I'm no tax expert but I recall reading that the PTC is more oriented to commercial solar producers and ITC residential. I suspect the only real hold back of the administration is that it is understaffed to fully attack all of the solar programs effectively.
civilitty 9y ago
Chinese solar panels are already artificially more competitive because of the Chinese government's policies, this is just evening the playing field. It's already clear that solar is only getting cheaper and more viable globally, this is a long term vote for maintaining our national security by guaranteeing that an entire industry can compete with foreign companies that are subsidized by their governments.
- _jal 9y ago
  Fascinating, to see how 70s union arguments are recycled.
  - civilitty 9y ago
    Fascinating to see how people with access to the internet fail to grasp basic concepts of sovereignty that were obvious to leaders that lived thousands of years ago.
    - thephyber 9y ago
      Ah the good old "appeal to tradition" fallacy. Just because it happened for a long time doesn't mean it is necessarily right, moral, or just. This fallacious argument was used to retain slavery in the US for 50+ years after it was abolished in Britain/UK. It was used to justify restricting voting to white, landholding men and banning interracial marriage for centuries. And if I were to use one of the president's favorite fallacies against himself[2], "what about" all of the places in the world where we reject local sovereignty for the supposed "national security" of the USA? I would argue that all of the problems the US has had with Iran since the late 1960s have to do with the USA's lack of respect for Iranian sovereignty in the 1950s. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism
      - civilitty 9y ago
        Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't know that you could fight a war without weaponry, food, logistics, manpower, or any of the resources needed to support those aforementioned things - like, you know, electricity or electrical generation equipment. I also didn't know that you could move all your manufacturing from a foreign country to your own shores at the blink of an eye when a war breaks out, nor that violent conflict stopped being a thing within human civilization. It's not an appeal to tradition to tell someone to predict the motion of a slow moving football with Newtonian mechanics.

dv_dt 9y ago

While this is possibly true, this is also the most wishful of interpretations for the Trump administrations actions. It's much simpler and more likely to interpret the action as anti-solar & renewable, and pro fossil fuel. Unless it's also backed up with added incentives to manufacture solar in country. I predict that won't happen, and even if it did new plants of any significance would be 5-10 years out and in the meantime all we've done is shot ourselves in the foot.

kyrra 9y ago
If he wanted to be true anti-solar, he'd work on killing the ITC (tax credit) that people are using to offset the cost of solar today (though it will fully disappear in ~4 years at the current schedule).
- sandworm101 9y ago
  >>> killing the ITC (tax credit) Raising taxes isn't a big priority for him atm. Those pro-solar deductions are used by a great may companies.
- Fnoord 9y ago
  > If he wanted to be true anti-solar [...] No true Scotsman. One doesn't exclude the other. Perhaps this is even next on his list, who knows (lets not give him ideas wink)
  - nielsbot 9y ago
    Trump read Hacker News? I wouldn't worry...
- dv_dt 9y ago
  Before the final turns of the tax bill, I think the PTC solar credit was on the chopping block in the senate version. I suspect the ITC is temporarily protected by needing some extended regulatory process timeline to kill as early. I'm no tax expert but I recall reading that the PTC is more oriented to commercial solar producers and ITC residential. I suspect the only real hold back of the administration is that it is understaffed to fully attack all of the solar programs effectively.

civilitty 9y ago

Chinese solar panels are already artificially more competitive because of the Chinese government's policies, this is just evening the playing field. It's already clear that solar is only getting cheaper and more viable globally, this is a long term vote for maintaining our national security by guaranteeing that an entire industry can compete with foreign companies that are subsidized by their governments.

_jal 9y ago
Fascinating, to see how 70s union arguments are recycled.
- civilitty 9y ago
  Fascinating to see how people with access to the internet fail to grasp basic concepts of sovereignty that were obvious to leaders that lived thousands of years ago.
  - thephyber 9y ago
    Ah the good old "appeal to tradition" fallacy. Just because it happened for a long time doesn't mean it is necessarily right, moral, or just. This fallacious argument was used to retain slavery in the US for 50+ years after it was abolished in Britain/UK. It was used to justify restricting voting to white, landholding men and banning interracial marriage for centuries. And if I were to use one of the president's favorite fallacies against himself[2], "what about" all of the places in the world where we reject local sovereignty for the supposed "national security" of the USA? I would argue that all of the problems the US has had with Iran since the late 1960s have to do with the USA's lack of respect for Iranian sovereignty in the 1950s. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism
    - civilitty 9y ago
      Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't know that you could fight a war without weaponry, food, logistics, manpower, or any of the resources needed to support those aforementioned things - like, you know, electricity or electrical generation equipment. I also didn't know that you could move all your manufacturing from a foreign country to your own shores at the blink of an eye when a war breaks out, nor that violent conflict stopped being a thing within human civilization. It's not an appeal to tradition to tell someone to predict the motion of a slow moving football with Newtonian mechanics.