3 ms·

Has it ever happened before that a consumer of chips is among the largest customers of what appears to be the biggest foundry in the world? (defining "consumer"

Has it ever happened before that a consumer of chips is among the largest customers of what appears to be the biggest foundry in the world? (defining "consumer" as "we actually use & run that chip, we don't embed it or sell it"?)

monocasa 9y ago
I've heard that Google has a decent amount of custom silicon too.
- mehrdada 9y ago
  [I don't know about Google but] lots of people do relatively specialized silicon. However, rarely that happens at the most advanced processes (i.e. low nm).
  - monocasa 9y ago
    That's totally fair. Google's parts that I know about are security coprocessors (like a TPM) that wouldn't really need the newest process. They probably have NICs too that might make sense at that node though.
    - Cyph0n 9y ago
      Their NICs probably use off the shelf ICs from Broadcom or similar. In other words, Google would only handle PCB layout and up. Besides, modern analog ICs are usually fabbed using custom processes and in-house lower node fabs. Designing high-speed RF ICs is a huge effort, and as far as I know, Google does not have such capability.
      - monocasa 9y ago
        IDK, they're still actively supporting the LLVM backend for Myricom's LANai chips, despite Myricom being sold off a few years ago. And the NICs don't really need custom high speed RF, the foundry has a SERDES block that'll work just fine for connecting to a phy.
        Cyph0n 9y ago
        Yes, but what I was saying is that Google likely does not design the PHY and/or other such low-level components. I am trying to point out that designing a NIC is not equivalent to designing custom ICs, unless you are also designing the ICs used in the NIC.
        monocasa 9y ago
        The PHYs aren't even on the same board for them; it's just SERDES going to a connector. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_form-factor_pluggable_transceiver https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_form-factor_pluggable_tr...
      - wmf 9y ago
        Google has a custom NIC ASIC derived from the Myri-10G family. Google has also designed the TPUv1, TPUv2, Visual Core, and Titan chips (that we know of).
        Cyph0n 9y ago
        TPUs are digital ICs. I was talking about analog ICs. That Myri IC seems interesting though.
jdblair 9y ago
Yes. In the 60s the United States Department of Defense bought most of the output of all semiconductor manufacture. I found a reference [1] that claims the DoD purchased 70% of the industry output in 1965. [1] https://books.google.com/books?id=7o0rAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA6&ots=ZQbVUvUiCt&dq=dod%20share%20of%20integrated%20circuit%20market%201970s&pg=PA6#v=onepage&q=dod%20share%20of%20integrated%20circuit%20market%201970s&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=7o0rAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA6&ots=Z... [edited to clarify that this is the United States DoD]

monocasa 9y ago

I've heard that Google has a decent amount of custom silicon too.

mehrdada 9y ago
[I don't know about Google but] lots of people do relatively specialized silicon. However, rarely that happens at the most advanced processes (i.e. low nm).
- monocasa 9y ago
  That's totally fair. Google's parts that I know about are security coprocessors (like a TPM) that wouldn't really need the newest process. They probably have NICs too that might make sense at that node though.
  - Cyph0n 9y ago
    Their NICs probably use off the shelf ICs from Broadcom or similar. In other words, Google would only handle PCB layout and up. Besides, modern analog ICs are usually fabbed using custom processes and in-house lower node fabs. Designing high-speed RF ICs is a huge effort, and as far as I know, Google does not have such capability.
    - monocasa 9y ago
      IDK, they're still actively supporting the LLVM backend for Myricom's LANai chips, despite Myricom being sold off a few years ago. And the NICs don't really need custom high speed RF, the foundry has a SERDES block that'll work just fine for connecting to a phy.
      - Cyph0n 9y ago
        Yes, but what I was saying is that Google likely does not design the PHY and/or other such low-level components. I am trying to point out that designing a NIC is not equivalent to designing custom ICs, unless you are also designing the ICs used in the NIC.
        monocasa 9y ago
        The PHYs aren't even on the same board for them; it's just SERDES going to a connector. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_form-factor_pluggable_transceiver https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_form-factor_pluggable_tr...
    - wmf 9y ago
      Google has a custom NIC ASIC derived from the Myri-10G family. Google has also designed the TPUv1, TPUv2, Visual Core, and Titan chips (that we know of).
      - Cyph0n 9y ago
        TPUs are digital ICs. I was talking about analog ICs. That Myri IC seems interesting though.

jdblair 9y ago

Yes. In the 60s the United States Department of Defense bought most of the output of all semiconductor manufacture. I found a reference [1] that claims the DoD purchased 70% of the industry output in 1965. [1] https://books.google.com/books?id=7o0rAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA6&ots=ZQbVUvUiCt&dq=dod%20share%20of%20integrated%20circuit%20market%201970s&pg=PA6#v=onepage&q=dod%20share%20of%20integrated%20circuit%20market%201970s&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=7o0rAAAAYAAJ&lpg=PA6&ots=Z... [edited to clarify that this is the United States DoD]