4 ms·

I see mandatory voting suggested a lot, and I'm not at all convinced that it's a good idea. I can see how it would look good (100% voter turnout!), but how woul

by untog 9y ago

I see mandatory voting suggested a lot, and I'm not at all convinced that it's a good idea. I can see how it would look good (100% voter turnout!), but how would you ever ensure that voters actually take time to consider their choice? They'd see voting as an utter chore and pick whatever means they get out of the door the quickest.

maxlybbert 9y ago
I don’t understand the excitement about mandatory voting either. It just seems like a way to increase the number of votes cast by uninformed people.
- panic 9y ago
  If combined with automatic registration, it helps fight the incentive for political candidates to suppress voting in districts or among demographics they know will hurt their chances of winning. It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences, instead of just the subset of people who are motivated to vote and able to get to a polling place.
  - iak8god 9y ago
    > It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences The main preference this may reveal is a preference to avoid being fined.
  - notatoad 9y ago
    Yes! automatic registration seems like an incredibly important step. Here in Canada i just show up to vote, and they let me. I don't have to jump through any hoops to be allowed to vote, and i can't understand why any country would have it any other way. (other than the obvious: malicious voter suppression)
  - brightball 9y ago
    But it doesn't make elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences. Some people's preference is literally "I don't care" Other people may have a preference on a specific issue that favors a single candidate while other issues better favor another candidate. It also reduces actually researching candidates to a waste of time. If I take the time to carefully research 5 candidates and their stance on all of the issues, weigh them carefully, maybe even attend a campaign event to get clarification...and then another guy walks up without having any idea what he's voting for that votes for the other guy...his vote counts exactly the same except that he's only there because he has to be.
    - panic 9y ago
      > It also reduces actually researching candidates to a waste of time. If I take the time to carefully research 5 candidates and their stance on all of the issues, weigh them carefully, maybe even attend a campaign event to get clarification...and then another guy walks up without having any idea what he's voting for that votes for the other guy...his vote counts exactly the same except that he's only there because he has to be. I mean, that's democracy. The point isn't a perfect system where everyone is making completely informed decisions. The goal is to keep public officials accountable to the people and their interests, however uninformed.
      - brightball 9y ago
        Is the point forcing people to participate in something against their will? Diluting the voter pool so much that the people paying enough attention to hold a candidate accountable can't actually have an impact?
  - maxlybbert 9y ago
    > It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences I happen to know that Brazil has mandatory voting for most people (it’s optional for 16 and 17 year olds, and for anyone older than 65). They allow people to vote for nobody, and to vote for “whoever wins.” Since Brazil requires an actual majority vote, voting for “the winner” amounts to “I want to avoid a run-off.”
Retric 9y ago
Preventing people from voting is one of the main ways elections are turned from 'the will of the people' into a rigged game. Force the vast majority of people to vote and candidates need to focus on the will of the people not playing a game. EX: Energizing my base while discouraging their base has nothing to do with how you actually change things.
crdoconnor 9y ago
It isn't the voters' incentives you need to worry about, it's the politicians. Trump ran some pretty effective campaign adverts just before election designed to drive down voter participation - targeting blacks and replaying that message about superpredators, for instance. Lack of voter participation also allows politicians to completely screw certain blocs of the population with relative impunity. It works well enough in Australia.

by untog 9y ago

maxlybbert 9y ago

I don’t understand the excitement about mandatory voting either. It just seems like a way to increase the number of votes cast by uninformed people.

panic 9y ago
If combined with automatic registration, it helps fight the incentive for political candidates to suppress voting in districts or among demographics they know will hurt their chances of winning. It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences, instead of just the subset of people who are motivated to vote and able to get to a polling place.
- iak8god 9y ago
  > It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences The main preference this may reveal is a preference to avoid being fined.
- notatoad 9y ago
  Yes! automatic registration seems like an incredibly important step. Here in Canada i just show up to vote, and they let me. I don't have to jump through any hoops to be allowed to vote, and i can't understand why any country would have it any other way. (other than the obvious: malicious voter suppression)
- brightball 9y ago
  But it doesn't make elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences. Some people's preference is literally "I don't care" Other people may have a preference on a specific issue that favors a single candidate while other issues better favor another candidate. It also reduces actually researching candidates to a waste of time. If I take the time to carefully research 5 candidates and their stance on all of the issues, weigh them carefully, maybe even attend a campaign event to get clarification...and then another guy walks up without having any idea what he's voting for that votes for the other guy...his vote counts exactly the same except that he's only there because he has to be.
  - panic 9y ago
    > It also reduces actually researching candidates to a waste of time. If I take the time to carefully research 5 candidates and their stance on all of the issues, weigh them carefully, maybe even attend a campaign event to get clarification...and then another guy walks up without having any idea what he's voting for that votes for the other guy...his vote counts exactly the same except that he's only there because he has to be. I mean, that's democracy. The point isn't a perfect system where everyone is making completely informed decisions. The goal is to keep public officials accountable to the people and their interests, however uninformed.
    - brightball 9y ago
      Is the point forcing people to participate in something against their will? Diluting the voter pool so much that the people paying enough attention to hold a candidate accountable can't actually have an impact?
- maxlybbert 9y ago
  > It also makes elections a more accurate reflection of everyone's preferences I happen to know that Brazil has mandatory voting for most people (it’s optional for 16 and 17 year olds, and for anyone older than 65). They allow people to vote for nobody, and to vote for “whoever wins.” Since Brazil requires an actual majority vote, voting for “the winner” amounts to “I want to avoid a run-off.”

Retric 9y ago

Preventing people from voting is one of the main ways elections are turned from 'the will of the people' into a rigged game. Force the vast majority of people to vote and candidates need to focus on the will of the people not playing a game. EX: Energizing my base while discouraging their base has nothing to do with how you actually change things.

crdoconnor 9y ago

It isn't the voters' incentives you need to worry about, it's the politicians. Trump ran some pretty effective campaign adverts just before election designed to drive down voter participation - targeting blacks and replaying that message about superpredators, for instance. Lack of voter participation also allows politicians to completely screw certain blocs of the population with relative impunity. It works well enough in Australia.