5 ms·

Can someone help me understand how this site is not sexist and discriminatory against men?

rev_bird 9y ago
You know how right now you're offended, and feeling left out just because of your gender? That's how some women in tech feel all the time. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16160940 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16160940
- spodek 9y ago
  That poster didn't seem offended to me. More curious. It's not obvious if the person is male or female or feeling left out. If some women feel that way anyway, are you suggesting that making more people feel that way helps or makes it not sexist? Tech pushes many people out, male and female. Even if the men in tech are the same, what about the men who would like to be in tech but were pushed out? Or are all men the same?
  - rev_bird 9y ago
    >Tech pushes many people out, male and female. Even if the men in tech are the same, what about the men who would like to be in tech but were pushed out? Or are all men the same? I'd wager most men "pushed out" of tech weren't fleeing sexism and gender-based isolation. This whole thing seems like looking at a team of 10 -- nine men and one woman -- and, when the woman says, "Gee, it'd be nice to have another woman to talk to," responding by saying "Well how about you just talk to us nine guys instead? Wouldn't that be just as good?"
- oh_sigh 9y ago
  ...therefore the answer is to increase gender division? Should we also end racial violence by increasing racial violence?
  - rev_bird 9y ago
    This is nonsense, you're comparing "let's chat with each other" with lynchings. Problem: Women feel they don't have anyone to talk to about their experiences as a woman in tech. Solution: Increase their access to people they can talk to about their experiences as a woman in tech. Like, say, an online community.
jjeaff 9y ago
Do you also consider separate men and women's bathrooms prejudicial and sexist?
- mrtron 9y ago
  Yes, if either option was exclusively provided.
- chrislynch42 9y ago
  As defined by merriam-webster.com I certainly do. Why do we consider all sexism bad?
  - rev_bird 9y ago
    That's not the real question, you're pretending context doesn't matter. What's your argument? Women say "I enjoy having a place to communicate with other women in a place that feels safe from male interference," and your response is "Let me into the women's bathroom"?
    - chrislynch42 9y ago
      No. Having separate bathrooms for men and women is sexist, by definition. What I hoped for was discussion on whether all sexism is bad.
      - jjeaff 9y ago
        No, having separate bathrooms is not sexist. Because the term sexism refers to negative issues only. Webster's uses the word "discrimination". Which I assume you are being pedantic and interpreting in a broader context like "discriminating between the colors blue and teal". But lookup discriminate and it has a few meanings. One of which refers to prejudicial or unfair treatment. That is the definition implied when referring sexist discrimination.
        chrislynch42 9y ago
DoreenMichele 9y ago
There is reason to believe that letting oppressed minorities connect in the absence of the majority group is a peaceful, effective path forward that makes them more able to put their baggage down, turn the other cheek and participate constructively in the main group. If you are interested in assessing this through some idealized, absolutist lens, it is totally sexist and discriminatory against men. If you are interested in pragmatic solutions that help genuinely reduce the sexist drama in the world, this model has a track record of success. So you need to pick one. Do you want to double down on abstract ideals? Or are you interested in what works? Women who are interested in the latter can potentially find benefit in seeking out a sisterhood and turning a deaf ear to the accusations of "reverse sexism" that inevitably get leveled, typically by people who have no constructive alternative to offer and who aren't actually interested in being supportive and inclusive of women.

You know how right now you're offended, and feeling left out just because of your gender? That's how some women in tech feel all the time. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16160940 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16160940

spodek 9y ago
That poster didn't seem offended to me. More curious. It's not obvious if the person is male or female or feeling left out. If some women feel that way anyway, are you suggesting that making more people feel that way helps or makes it not sexist? Tech pushes many people out, male and female. Even if the men in tech are the same, what about the men who would like to be in tech but were pushed out? Or are all men the same?
- rev_bird 9y ago
  >Tech pushes many people out, male and female. Even if the men in tech are the same, what about the men who would like to be in tech but were pushed out? Or are all men the same? I'd wager most men "pushed out" of tech weren't fleeing sexism and gender-based isolation. This whole thing seems like looking at a team of 10 -- nine men and one woman -- and, when the woman says, "Gee, it'd be nice to have another woman to talk to," responding by saying "Well how about you just talk to us nine guys instead? Wouldn't that be just as good?"
oh_sigh 9y ago
...therefore the answer is to increase gender division? Should we also end racial violence by increasing racial violence?
- rev_bird 9y ago
  This is nonsense, you're comparing "let's chat with each other" with lynchings. Problem: Women feel they don't have anyone to talk to about their experiences as a woman in tech. Solution: Increase their access to people they can talk to about their experiences as a woman in tech. Like, say, an online community.

jjeaff 9y ago

Do you also consider separate men and women's bathrooms prejudicial and sexist?

mrtron 9y ago
Yes, if either option was exclusively provided.
chrislynch42 9y ago
As defined by merriam-webster.com I certainly do. Why do we consider all sexism bad?
- rev_bird 9y ago
  That's not the real question, you're pretending context doesn't matter. What's your argument? Women say "I enjoy having a place to communicate with other women in a place that feels safe from male interference," and your response is "Let me into the women's bathroom"?
  - chrislynch42 9y ago
    No. Having separate bathrooms for men and women is sexist, by definition. What I hoped for was discussion on whether all sexism is bad.
    - jjeaff 9y ago
      No, having separate bathrooms is not sexist. Because the term sexism refers to negative issues only. Webster's uses the word "discrimination". Which I assume you are being pedantic and interpreting in a broader context like "discriminating between the colors blue and teal". But lookup discriminate and it has a few meanings. One of which refers to prejudicial or unfair treatment. That is the definition implied when referring sexist discrimination.
      - chrislynch42 9y ago

DoreenMichele 9y ago

There is reason to believe that letting oppressed minorities connect in the absence of the majority group is a peaceful, effective path forward that makes them more able to put their baggage down, turn the other cheek and participate constructively in the main group. If you are interested in assessing this through some idealized, absolutist lens, it is totally sexist and discriminatory against men. If you are interested in pragmatic solutions that help genuinely reduce the sexist drama in the world, this model has a track record of success. So you need to pick one. Do you want to double down on abstract ideals? Or are you interested in what works? Women who are interested in the latter can potentially find benefit in seeking out a sisterhood and turning a deaf ear to the accusations of "reverse sexism" that inevitably get leveled, typically by people who have no constructive alternative to offer and who aren't actually interested in being supportive and inclusive of women.