7 ms·

I'm a woman that's worked in tech since 2011... at times the discrimination and treatment I've faced has made me want to quit the industry all together. But eve

I'm a woman that's worked in tech since 2011... at times the discrimination and treatment I've faced has made me want to quit the industry all together. But every time I reached that point I thought - no, I'm not the one who should have to leave, it's the people -- usually men -- who have not shown empathy, kindness or compassion. The ones who have bullied me and harassed me and made inappropriate comments or advances. So many of these experiences I just buried inside until I was in the company of other people I trusted and felt safe to share. There hasn't really been an online forum where I felt safe to have these conversations until now. Now that Leap is here I have other people who get me who I can talk to about the stuff that is bugging me. With their help I can treat each day as new and keep moving forward with my career. If you don't understand why this community is important perhaps it's because you have had the privilege of never feeling like a second class citizen in the industry you work in.

RangerScience 9y ago
Please correct me if this is off-base, but... What you're describing has always seemed to me as an excellent example why women-only spaces are not necessarily about people-who-identify-as-women, but about people-who-others-identify-as-women. Other people treat you a certain way because of how they perceive you, and you want to have a place to talk about that with other people treated the same way. Does that sound at all correct?
fruzz 9y ago
I really wish your experience was unique. A colleague was groped. She didn't report it. It would have likely diminished her future prospects. A friend was asked out on dates, unsolicited, multiple times by coworkers. She just had to laugh it off. Women at a previous employment reported not being taken as seriously as men in meetings, and being passed over for promotions in favour of less qualified men. A friend reported sexualized posters of women up in the office. In the chat of my company, a sexualized video of women was passed around. I'm trans, so my challenges are a bit different. I try to hide the fact that I'm trans during interviews. A lot of people are uncomfortable with trans people (26% of Canadian men are uncomfortable moving next to one), and with interviews to see if I'm socially a good fit, that can end it. I actually changed my name to an androgynous one as to not out myself. I get misgendered at work by people who do it on purpose. I also get touched inappropriately by a coworker. In all cases, what can you do to challenge these things without being seen as "the crazy one", "too sensitive", "party pooper", or whatever? Without hurting my finances? It's shit.
- turinapple 9y ago
  Thanks for sharing. Everytime I've tried to challenge others' behavior towards me, I've ended up the villain...
  - fruzz 9y ago
    Yah. One thing I learned works are men who aren't recipient to the behaviour standing up. There was an employee like that at my last job who would speak up. Not forcefully. I was really appreciative of what he was doing. He was treated pretty awfully, and ended up quitting.
- booleandilemma 9y ago
  A friend was asked out on dates, unsolicited, multiple times by coworkers. I’m a geek and don’t know the first thing about dating, but doesn’t at least one of the parties involved need to receive an unsolicited request? Isn’t that how it works?
  - fruzz 9y ago
    Work isn't the place to proposition people for a romantic relationship. At all times, but especially when there's a power dynamic. When that happens, along with a gazillion other little things women are disproportionately on the receiving end of, it has the effect of dissuading women from pursuing their career in the industry.
    - cheez 9y ago
      This is wrongheaded. Work is a fine place to find partners because you are likely to be educated similarly and have similar life goals. You have to be mature in how you handle it though. One of the women I probably loved most in my life I met at work.
      - harlanji 9y ago
        Marriage creates a legal protection between partners which as far as I know is stronger than the employer/employee relationship, so the company is rational to be uncomfortable with such situations in competitive situations where court is plausible. Part of the big money game is playing by more restricted rules.
ashelmire 9y ago
Do you work for them? There are many women-only forums and groups, including groups specifically for women in tech, on Facebook, Meetup, etc. By all means, create as many as you'd like, but this post of yours reads like an ad. Edit: Sorry, didn't mean this as an accusation of shilling. I was just somewhat taken aback by the idea that there aren't any other safe spaces on the internet.
- Anticapitalist 9y ago
  It doesn't read like an ad. It reads like the often repeated (and ignored) experience of women in tech.
  - ashelmire 9y ago
    "There hasn't really been an online forum where I felt safe to have these conversations until now. Now that Leap is here I have other people who get me who I can talk to about the stuff that is bugging me." If this wasn't written by a copywriter I'll eat my hat.
    - dang 9y ago
      Would you please stop? She already said she didn't work for them. Your question was a borderline personal attack in the first place, but I didn't chide you for it, even though this topic makes the downside of such an attack much worse than in a typical thread. Actually I did chide you for it, but then deleted the post because I remembered how sensitive HN users often are to booster comments posted by new accounts. I'm sure you're posting in good faith but this is a particularly poor situation in which to aggressively challenge a new user.
      - studio_monolith 9y ago
        It's actually the perfect situation to challenge a new user; their post reads as an ad.
- turinapple 9y ago
throwaway06509 9y ago
I'm not sure how this comment will go down (hence throwaway). But as a man I'm now a little envious of Leap. I've never suffered the sexual harassment or gender based discrimination but I have suffered the bullying, and witnessed it against others, and I've been punished and had my reputation/career badly damaged by those I tried to stand up to. I would love a positive place where people can be open about what they're experiencing like this without fear of retaliation.
horsecaptin 9y ago
Lets say that you'd like to leave tech. Which industry would you go that is better to women than tech? If there are no alternatives, then what incentives do tech companies have to create an even more acceptable space? At whose expense? I work in a company with more than 50% women. Many of them worked in teams and companies where it was more than 80% women. They hated it. "Constant politics, catty behavior and backstabbing" is how they describe it.
badwulf 9y ago
I'm a guy in tech(not that it matters), do you think that harassment and bullying is a problem unique to women? Do you think that men don't have issues? Do you think that women don't treat each other like crap sometimes?

RangerScience 9y ago

Please correct me if this is off-base, but... What you're describing has always seemed to me as an excellent example why women-only spaces are not necessarily about people-who-identify-as-women, but about people-who-others-identify-as-women. Other people treat you a certain way because of how they perceive you, and you want to have a place to talk about that with other people treated the same way. Does that sound at all correct?

fruzz 9y ago

I really wish your experience was unique. A colleague was groped. She didn't report it. It would have likely diminished her future prospects. A friend was asked out on dates, unsolicited, multiple times by coworkers. She just had to laugh it off. Women at a previous employment reported not being taken as seriously as men in meetings, and being passed over for promotions in favour of less qualified men. A friend reported sexualized posters of women up in the office. In the chat of my company, a sexualized video of women was passed around. I'm trans, so my challenges are a bit different. I try to hide the fact that I'm trans during interviews. A lot of people are uncomfortable with trans people (26% of Canadian men are uncomfortable moving next to one), and with interviews to see if I'm socially a good fit, that can end it. I actually changed my name to an androgynous one as to not out myself. I get misgendered at work by people who do it on purpose. I also get touched inappropriately by a coworker. In all cases, what can you do to challenge these things without being seen as "the crazy one", "too sensitive", "party pooper", or whatever? Without hurting my finances? It's shit.

turinapple 9y ago
Thanks for sharing. Everytime I've tried to challenge others' behavior towards me, I've ended up the villain...
- fruzz 9y ago
  Yah. One thing I learned works are men who aren't recipient to the behaviour standing up. There was an employee like that at my last job who would speak up. Not forcefully. I was really appreciative of what he was doing. He was treated pretty awfully, and ended up quitting.
booleandilemma 9y ago
A friend was asked out on dates, unsolicited, multiple times by coworkers. I’m a geek and don’t know the first thing about dating, but doesn’t at least one of the parties involved need to receive an unsolicited request? Isn’t that how it works?
- fruzz 9y ago
  Work isn't the place to proposition people for a romantic relationship. At all times, but especially when there's a power dynamic. When that happens, along with a gazillion other little things women are disproportionately on the receiving end of, it has the effect of dissuading women from pursuing their career in the industry.
  - cheez 9y ago
    This is wrongheaded. Work is a fine place to find partners because you are likely to be educated similarly and have similar life goals. You have to be mature in how you handle it though. One of the women I probably loved most in my life I met at work.
    - harlanji 9y ago
      Marriage creates a legal protection between partners which as far as I know is stronger than the employer/employee relationship, so the company is rational to be uncomfortable with such situations in competitive situations where court is plausible. Part of the big money game is playing by more restricted rules.

ashelmire 9y ago

Do you work for them? There are many women-only forums and groups, including groups specifically for women in tech, on Facebook, Meetup, etc. By all means, create as many as you'd like, but this post of yours reads like an ad. Edit: Sorry, didn't mean this as an accusation of shilling. I was just somewhat taken aback by the idea that there aren't any other safe spaces on the internet.

Anticapitalist 9y ago
It doesn't read like an ad. It reads like the often repeated (and ignored) experience of women in tech.
- ashelmire 9y ago
  "There hasn't really been an online forum where I felt safe to have these conversations until now. Now that Leap is here I have other people who get me who I can talk to about the stuff that is bugging me." If this wasn't written by a copywriter I'll eat my hat.
  - dang 9y ago
    Would you please stop? She already said she didn't work for them. Your question was a borderline personal attack in the first place, but I didn't chide you for it, even though this topic makes the downside of such an attack much worse than in a typical thread. Actually I did chide you for it, but then deleted the post because I remembered how sensitive HN users often are to booster comments posted by new accounts. I'm sure you're posting in good faith but this is a particularly poor situation in which to aggressively challenge a new user.
    - studio_monolith 9y ago
      It's actually the perfect situation to challenge a new user; their post reads as an ad.
turinapple 9y ago

throwaway06509 9y ago

I'm not sure how this comment will go down (hence throwaway). But as a man I'm now a little envious of Leap. I've never suffered the sexual harassment or gender based discrimination but I have suffered the bullying, and witnessed it against others, and I've been punished and had my reputation/career badly damaged by those I tried to stand up to. I would love a positive place where people can be open about what they're experiencing like this without fear of retaliation.

horsecaptin 9y ago

Lets say that you'd like to leave tech. Which industry would you go that is better to women than tech? If there are no alternatives, then what incentives do tech companies have to create an even more acceptable space? At whose expense? I work in a company with more than 50% women. Many of them worked in teams and companies where it was more than 80% women. They hated it. "Constant politics, catty behavior and backstabbing" is how they describe it.

badwulf 9y ago

I'm a guy in tech(not that it matters), do you think that harassment and bullying is a problem unique to women? Do you think that men don't have issues? Do you think that women don't treat each other like crap sometimes?