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The number of seemingly throwaway accounts (created in the last few days) commenting on this thread is interesting too: - https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?

The number of seemingly throwaway accounts (created in the last few days) commenting on this thread is interesting too: - https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=astund https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=astund - https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=simplemath__ https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=simplemath__ - https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=zhjansbnas https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=zhjansbnas - https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=barbegal https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=barbegal

g09980 9y ago
Just people are very cautious online with signaling that they have any crypto.
- bduerst 9y ago
  I don't buy that. What's the threat vector? Are you not able to be anonymous with an HN account if you choose? So much so that creating multiple accounts doesn't matter?
  - TomMarius 9y ago
    Yes, you can be anonymous on HN - that assumes you've stayed anonymous. Obviously these people didn't and so they need a new account. The motivation is huge.
  - cjbprime 9y ago
    The threat vector boils down to using a phone number porting attack to gain access to Coinbase, and maybe also email. It has happened to many public owners of crypto.
    - g09980 9y ago
      Or even the five dollar wrench attack.
  - cantrip 9y ago
    You are able to be anonymous on HN by creating a new account which is not tied to your regular account history. If you had millions of dollars in crypto you would too. It's not nearly the same as having it in a bank or mutual funds which cannot easily be taken from you in a flash. People can simply hack your laptop or bludgeon you with a hammer until you give them up instantly.
    - CameronBanga 9y ago
      I mean, if bludgeon you with a hammer is part of your threat model, I think there's still some concern that people will bludgeon until you agree to make a bank transfer.
      - cantrip 9y ago
        Banks have transfer limits, so no you can't generally make a million dollar bank transfer.
        sluggg 9y ago
        sounds like crypto needs a bank lol
- losteric 9y ago
  That feels unlikely to me. Why would there be so many people who 1.) have enough crypto to be worried, and 2.) want to talk about crypto but didn't create a separate account prior to this negative article?
  - mschuster91 9y ago
    > Why would there be so many people who 1.) have enough crypto to be worried Because it's easy to have enough crypto to be worried. For example, if I had bought 10 BTC @ 100€/BTC = 1.000€ (which, at the time, was a reasonable investment size for a crypto starter, and a droplet of water for a seasoned person with a bit of money to throw around) and held them until now, I'd have 100k€ worth of BTC. That's more than enough motivation for a criminal for example to fleece your home while you're away (e.g. if you posted on your HN-relatable Twitter account that you're off to a conference) and look for a paper wallet. I have seen people literally stab each other over 100€ worth of marijuana, to put things into perspective...
    - losteric 9y ago
      You answered a different question by cutting mine in half... my bitcoin holdings are stab-worthy, I understand why someone would hide their identity. My question reflects my suspicion of astroturfing. What would explain an anomalously high number of new accounts fighting the claims of price manipulation in bitcoin? It's unlikely to be people just hiding themselves - they would already have accounts.
      - mschuster91 9y ago
        > You answered a different question by cutting mine in half... I apologize - I messed up the indentation and thought you were replying to another comment. Sometimes I feel HN could use some Reddit features... > It's unlikely to be people just hiding themselves - they would already have accounts. Yeah but for example my RL identity can be inferred from my username, my post history and probably my Twitter feed. So if I were someone who had a stake in high BTC rates - no matter if as a plain wallet holder or as operator/stakeholder in a BTC/coin-related enterprise - I would certainly make a new account, and probably even a new one for every comment, to hide the association.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
Balgair 9y ago
Thanks for the info. To me, just about any HN post about XYZcoin is a minefield these days. The sentiments seem to all be unrealistically positive and the derision of the glaringly insane XYZcoins are just swamped in whataboutism and thread-derailing. I know it's a hot market and there is a lot of stuff going on, so these threads themselves are warranted, yet the comments in them are just clownshoes.
- mike10010100 9y ago
  Reminds me a bit of how the Russian bots operate. Any indication whether or not this is in any way related? The more I think about it, the more it seems like the entire proliferation of cryptocurrency is an attempt to sponge money out of the hyper-capitalistic West. Too many bots/fraudulent trades, and too much hyper-positivity online. It feels incredibly skeezy, even coming from the usual online trader bros.
  - astund 9y ago
    Dont think too much about it. Some of us linked in the parent comment dont post here a lot...and my comment wasnt pro-cryptocurrency.
- dang 9y ago
  There have been a lot of low-quality comments posted on both sides of this hot topic. That's because hot topics attract low-quality comments. It's certainly not true that "the sentiments" are all positive, and I guarantee you that people who hold the opposite views to yours see "the sentiments" here as all the other way. We really need a name for this cognitive bias. Also, "whataboutism" has become the worst internet cliché in recent memory and I'm starting to feel like we should add software to just autokill comments that use this word, since it's such a strong signal of unsubstantive bickering.
  - Balgair 9y ago
    Thanks for the reply dang. Upon further reflection, maybe it is just the 'top' comments in a thread that have the unrealistically positive sentiment. Yes, down-threads do tend to be more nuanced, but those also tend to have less comments and sub comments. I don't have the data, and I do have my own biases of course, but I feel that I see large comment blocks of thread derailing and bickering at the top. The more 'reasonable' comments then get shoved to the bottom (in XYZcoin threads). The bias is the Semmelweis reflex (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis_reflex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis_reflex)
dang 9y ago
Please don't post like this. It just leads to useless off-topic digression, all based on bad information or no information. There's no apparent relationship between those accounts, they're not arguing the same things at all, and it's so unfair to call out specific users that way. Imagine what a message you're sending to new HNers to put them on a list like that! It's true that we banned one of those accounts for serial abuse of the site, but that's all the more reason to be careful about how you treat the others. Guilt by association is not legit.

g09980 9y ago

Just people are very cautious online with signaling that they have any crypto.

bduerst 9y ago
I don't buy that. What's the threat vector? Are you not able to be anonymous with an HN account if you choose? So much so that creating multiple accounts doesn't matter?
- TomMarius 9y ago
  Yes, you can be anonymous on HN - that assumes you've stayed anonymous. Obviously these people didn't and so they need a new account. The motivation is huge.
- cjbprime 9y ago
  The threat vector boils down to using a phone number porting attack to gain access to Coinbase, and maybe also email. It has happened to many public owners of crypto.
  - g09980 9y ago
    Or even the five dollar wrench attack.
- cantrip 9y ago
  You are able to be anonymous on HN by creating a new account which is not tied to your regular account history. If you had millions of dollars in crypto you would too. It's not nearly the same as having it in a bank or mutual funds which cannot easily be taken from you in a flash. People can simply hack your laptop or bludgeon you with a hammer until you give them up instantly.
  - CameronBanga 9y ago
    I mean, if bludgeon you with a hammer is part of your threat model, I think there's still some concern that people will bludgeon until you agree to make a bank transfer.
    - cantrip 9y ago
      Banks have transfer limits, so no you can't generally make a million dollar bank transfer.
      - sluggg 9y ago
        sounds like crypto needs a bank lol
losteric 9y ago
That feels unlikely to me. Why would there be so many people who 1.) have enough crypto to be worried, and 2.) want to talk about crypto but didn't create a separate account prior to this negative article?
- mschuster91 9y ago
  > Why would there be so many people who 1.) have enough crypto to be worried Because it's easy to have enough crypto to be worried. For example, if I had bought 10 BTC @ 100€/BTC = 1.000€ (which, at the time, was a reasonable investment size for a crypto starter, and a droplet of water for a seasoned person with a bit of money to throw around) and held them until now, I'd have 100k€ worth of BTC. That's more than enough motivation for a criminal for example to fleece your home while you're away (e.g. if you posted on your HN-relatable Twitter account that you're off to a conference) and look for a paper wallet. I have seen people literally stab each other over 100€ worth of marijuana, to put things into perspective...
  - losteric 9y ago
    You answered a different question by cutting mine in half... my bitcoin holdings are stab-worthy, I understand why someone would hide their identity. My question reflects my suspicion of astroturfing. What would explain an anomalously high number of new accounts fighting the claims of price manipulation in bitcoin? It's unlikely to be people just hiding themselves - they would already have accounts.
    - mschuster91 9y ago
      > You answered a different question by cutting mine in half... I apologize - I messed up the indentation and thought you were replying to another comment. Sometimes I feel HN could use some Reddit features... > It's unlikely to be people just hiding themselves - they would already have accounts. Yeah but for example my RL identity can be inferred from my username, my post history and probably my Twitter feed. So if I were someone who had a stake in high BTC rates - no matter if as a plain wallet holder or as operator/stakeholder in a BTC/coin-related enterprise - I would certainly make a new account, and probably even a new one for every comment, to hide the association.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

Balgair 9y ago

Thanks for the info. To me, just about any HN post about XYZcoin is a minefield these days. The sentiments seem to all be unrealistically positive and the derision of the glaringly insane XYZcoins are just swamped in whataboutism and thread-derailing. I know it's a hot market and there is a lot of stuff going on, so these threads themselves are warranted, yet the comments in them are just clownshoes.

mike10010100 9y ago
Reminds me a bit of how the Russian bots operate. Any indication whether or not this is in any way related? The more I think about it, the more it seems like the entire proliferation of cryptocurrency is an attempt to sponge money out of the hyper-capitalistic West. Too many bots/fraudulent trades, and too much hyper-positivity online. It feels incredibly skeezy, even coming from the usual online trader bros.
- astund 9y ago
  Dont think too much about it. Some of us linked in the parent comment dont post here a lot...and my comment wasnt pro-cryptocurrency.
dang 9y ago
There have been a lot of low-quality comments posted on both sides of this hot topic. That's because hot topics attract low-quality comments. It's certainly not true that "the sentiments" are all positive, and I guarantee you that people who hold the opposite views to yours see "the sentiments" here as all the other way. We really need a name for this cognitive bias. Also, "whataboutism" has become the worst internet cliché in recent memory and I'm starting to feel like we should add software to just autokill comments that use this word, since it's such a strong signal of unsubstantive bickering.
- Balgair 9y ago
  Thanks for the reply dang. Upon further reflection, maybe it is just the 'top' comments in a thread that have the unrealistically positive sentiment. Yes, down-threads do tend to be more nuanced, but those also tend to have less comments and sub comments. I don't have the data, and I do have my own biases of course, but I feel that I see large comment blocks of thread derailing and bickering at the top. The more 'reasonable' comments then get shoved to the bottom (in XYZcoin threads). The bias is the Semmelweis reflex (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis_reflex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semmelweis_reflex)

dang 9y ago

Please don't post like this. It just leads to useless off-topic digression, all based on bad information or no information. There's no apparent relationship between those accounts, they're not arguing the same things at all, and it's so unfair to call out specific users that way. Imagine what a message you're sending to new HNers to put them on a list like that! It's true that we banned one of those accounts for serial abuse of the site, but that's all the more reason to be careful about how you treat the others. Guilt by association is not legit.