4 ms·

XCPng: libre XenServer

69 points by based2 9y ago

tjoff 9y ago
I really hope this takes off. I even run XenServer on my workstation with GPU passthrough etc. and the changes in 7.3 will cost me two Windows 10 licenses and having to start my workstation all over. It felt utterly hopeless but this might reignite my hope for continuing running on ~xenserver.
- jitl 9y ago
  +1. I’ve always wanted to do one of the GPU passthru Linux workstation/gaming machine builds, but it seems like doing so with the official XenServer is now impossible for hobbyists.
  - kipari 9y ago
    It can be done with a bit of work using QEMU/libvirt. The Arch Linux wiki has a good guide for doing it. Not that it’s a pretty solution always…
    - blibble 9y ago
      these days it works out of the box on debian stable run virt-manager, create vm, select your graphics card, and it boots
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
      - stryk 9y ago
        which gpus are easier to work with in this scenario, amd or nvidia?
        ymse 9y ago
        The two parent posters are probably talking about PCI passthrough, in which case it does not really matter. The virtual machine gets the entire GPU and runs the driver. It also needs a dedicated monitor, keyboard and mouse. However Xenserver (and VMware) supports GPU sharing between multiple virtual machines, essentially GPU virtualization. Both Nvidia and AMD have custom solutions for this. I believe this is what the ancestor comment is using on Xenserver. There is work-in-progress support for GPU sharing in Linux KVM as well, although currently I think it's restricted to Intel. If you're interested in that, I would recommend going with AMD, since they maintain a high-quality driver in Linux itself (unlike Nvidia who only maintains a proprietary out-of-tree driver), and thus is much more likely to be supported by KVM.
        tjoff 9y ago
        I might be outdated, but GPU virtualization does not allow you to use your display outputs on your graphic card. So for a workstation it isn't going to work as you would have to use another machine (sure, it could be a thin client) to remote desktop (introducing lag I wouldn't want on a worksation) to be able to get any video output. I also believe this requires AMDs or nVidias pro-line graphics cards. So I also used PCI passthrough. I have two GPUs that I pass through meaning that I can run two virtual machines with proper graphic cards (and then regular VMs as I please). The idea was that instead of dual-booting between two machines I run them both at the same time. To switch between them I just select another input on my monitors. Unfortunately though, it is not that simple. This gets easier for every year and it was about 2 years since I last played with this and setup my workstation so things could have changed a bit. But even for PCI passthrough you have to be very careful selecting your GPU, motherboard and CPU. The drivers need to play along and the CPU with motherboard need to be able to isolate everything adequately. Whether AMD or nVidia is best is/was up to debate, each GPU generation has its own quirks. For CPU you ideally you wanted a i7 or a non-entry-level Xeon to be as safe as possible, this is not a requirement but it is very possible that with a "regular" CPU you might not be able to pass through the devices you need to get it to work. More here: http://vfio.blogspot.se/2015/10/intel-processors-with-acs-support.html http://vfio.blogspot.se/2015/10/intel-processors-with-acs-su... Bottom line, it can work great but it is a lot to setup and even if you do your research you might end up in a situation where it just doesn't work. Oh, and the hypervisor you use might screw you, removing the very features you depend on.
merb 9y ago
* better backups would be great. the backup situation on xenserver compared to vmware/hyper-v sucks. or to say it differently veeam gui is kinda strange, but it's a really good backup tool.
- nraynaud 9y ago
  Have you tried xen orchestra? They are my client, and I see a lot of code around backups in github.
snvzz 9y ago
I used and really liked ganeti[1]. I wish they'd make a release once in a while. I love the way it works, its overall architecture. Very clean and reliable feeling. A bit like a kubernetes for VMs. Install in your favourite distro, assign it a network bridge (eg: br0) and a lvm volume group, and done. All nodes in a cluster do replicate the configurations, and can become the master node at a moment's notice. [1] http://www.ganeti.org/ http://www.ganeti.org/
- voxadam 9y ago
  http://minimega.org/ http://minimega.org/
  - snvzz 9y ago
    Like most such tools, it isn't comparable to ganeti.

69 points by based2 9y ago

I really hope this takes off. I even run XenServer on my workstation with GPU passthrough etc. and the changes in 7.3 will cost me two Windows 10 licenses and having to start my workstation all over. It felt utterly hopeless but this might reignite my hope for continuing running on ~xenserver.

jitl 9y ago
+1. I’ve always wanted to do one of the GPU passthru Linux workstation/gaming machine builds, but it seems like doing so with the official XenServer is now impossible for hobbyists.
- kipari 9y ago
  It can be done with a bit of work using QEMU/libvirt. The Arch Linux wiki has a good guide for doing it. Not that it’s a pretty solution always…
  - blibble 9y ago
    these days it works out of the box on debian stable run virt-manager, create vm, select your graphics card, and it boots
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - stryk 9y ago
      which gpus are easier to work with in this scenario, amd or nvidia?
      - ymse 9y ago
        The two parent posters are probably talking about PCI passthrough, in which case it does not really matter. The virtual machine gets the entire GPU and runs the driver. It also needs a dedicated monitor, keyboard and mouse. However Xenserver (and VMware) supports GPU sharing between multiple virtual machines, essentially GPU virtualization. Both Nvidia and AMD have custom solutions for this. I believe this is what the ancestor comment is using on Xenserver. There is work-in-progress support for GPU sharing in Linux KVM as well, although currently I think it's restricted to Intel. If you're interested in that, I would recommend going with AMD, since they maintain a high-quality driver in Linux itself (unlike Nvidia who only maintains a proprietary out-of-tree driver), and thus is much more likely to be supported by KVM.
        tjoff 9y ago
        I might be outdated, but GPU virtualization does not allow you to use your display outputs on your graphic card. So for a workstation it isn't going to work as you would have to use another machine (sure, it could be a thin client) to remote desktop (introducing lag I wouldn't want on a worksation) to be able to get any video output. I also believe this requires AMDs or nVidias pro-line graphics cards. So I also used PCI passthrough. I have two GPUs that I pass through meaning that I can run two virtual machines with proper graphic cards (and then regular VMs as I please). The idea was that instead of dual-booting between two machines I run them both at the same time. To switch between them I just select another input on my monitors. Unfortunately though, it is not that simple. This gets easier for every year and it was about 2 years since I last played with this and setup my workstation so things could have changed a bit. But even for PCI passthrough you have to be very careful selecting your GPU, motherboard and CPU. The drivers need to play along and the CPU with motherboard need to be able to isolate everything adequately. Whether AMD or nVidia is best is/was up to debate, each GPU generation has its own quirks. For CPU you ideally you wanted a i7 or a non-entry-level Xeon to be as safe as possible, this is not a requirement but it is very possible that with a "regular" CPU you might not be able to pass through the devices you need to get it to work. More here: http://vfio.blogspot.se/2015/10/intel-processors-with-acs-support.html http://vfio.blogspot.se/2015/10/intel-processors-with-acs-su... Bottom line, it can work great but it is a lot to setup and even if you do your research you might end up in a situation where it just doesn't work. Oh, and the hypervisor you use might screw you, removing the very features you depend on.

merb 9y ago

* better backups would be great. the backup situation on xenserver compared to vmware/hyper-v sucks. or to say it differently veeam gui is kinda strange, but it's a really good backup tool.

nraynaud 9y ago
Have you tried xen orchestra? They are my client, and I see a lot of code around backups in github.

snvzz 9y ago

I used and really liked ganeti[1]. I wish they'd make a release once in a while. I love the way it works, its overall architecture. Very clean and reliable feeling. A bit like a kubernetes for VMs. Install in your favourite distro, assign it a network bridge (eg: br0) and a lvm volume group, and done. All nodes in a cluster do replicate the configurations, and can become the master node at a moment's notice. [1] http://www.ganeti.org/ http://www.ganeti.org/

voxadam 9y ago
http://minimega.org/ http://minimega.org/
- snvzz 9y ago
  Like most such tools, it isn't comparable to ganeti.