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Is there any real use for high quality wooden pencils beyond nostalgia? A leadholder (a.k.a. clutch pencil) gives you the same flexibility and control with more

by mrob 9y ago

Is there any real use for high quality wooden pencils beyond nostalgia? A leadholder (a.k.a. clutch pencil) gives you the same flexibility and control with more consistent balance as you sharpen it. Cheap wooden pencils still have some use because they're the cheapest erasable writing implement, but the cost is unlikely to be competitive if they're made in America.

pubby 9y ago
I don't think artists will ever give them up.
- icantdrive55 9y ago
  Yea, I don't know how to shade with a mechanical pencil.
microcolonel 9y ago
> but the cost is unlikely to be competitive if they're made in America. There are competitors which sell twelve-packs of № 2 of similar quality for about the same price, if Amazon is anything to go by. Pencils are also still basically indispensable in schools.
yeukhon 9y ago
Not really. I don't know anyone who use clutch pencil so I am not sure how it compared to wooden /mechanical pencils. Regardless, pen seems more dominant now in school. I was born in the early 90s, so both wooden pencils and mechanical pencils meant a lot to me. I still have two pencil lead left in my right palm because I accidentally stabbed my hands when I was a kid - pretty sure most of us who have used pencils regularly back then had experienced this. Eraser was also a big deal to me and my classmates. I owned regular plain erasers, fruit-flavor erasers, and animal-shape erasers before. But I preferred the slightly expensive Japanese brand called "Sakurafoam eraser" [1]. I am not sure when our future generations will stop writing by hand completely, but eventually pen and pencil will see the fate as scribe and Chinese brush pen which are uncommon now. [1]: https://imgur.com/a/g30c9 https://imgur.com/a/g30c9
- cultofmetatron 9y ago
  ... did you say fruit flavoured eraser???
  - Stratoscope 9y ago
    Fruit scented anyway. You weren't really supposed to eat them, although I can't speak for GP. (I used to eat match heads when I was a kid, so I can hardly criticize anyone's eating habits.) You can still get them, for example the Lil Juicies: https://www.ooly.com/lil-juicies-fruit-scented-erasers-set-of-6/ https://www.ooly.com/lil-juicies-fruit-scented-erasers-set-o...
  - davchana 9y ago
    In india we call eraser as rubber too :) Fruit Flavoured Rubber will sound too NSFW in America :)
- Hextinium 9y ago
  I started using a lead holder/clutch pencil for schoolwork and I can't go back to anything else because of the knurled grip. Pencils slowly slip out of my hand after just 2 minutes of writing while my lead holder will write for hours with no repositioning.
  - ghaff 9y ago
    They at least used to be very common for drafting. I probably still have one or two somewhere. As you point out, you get a better grip and they're probably also easier to keep very sharp.
mc32 9y ago
Japanese labor is also expensive, also German, yet they both manage to have pencil factories. You can get your favorite brands here: https://cwpencils.com/collections/2-pencils https://cwpencils.com/collections/2-pencils Quality, specialization and marketing.
- forinti 9y ago
  This made we wonder why there aren't more regional or local pencil factories or factories of other low tech products where a few people and the right machinery can be quite productive.
  - jhoechtl 9y ago
    Because shipping products from overseas where they are mass-made is cheaper than producing them next corner. An effect of globalization.
  - wbl 9y ago
    Scale matters as does brand. If you are just the regional pencil factory, and only distribute in a small area, you will have difficulty keeping the factory working all the time.
hellofunk 9y ago
Wooden pencils are far superior and more versatile for drawing.
- mrob 9y ago
  What artistic technique is possible with a wooden pencil but not a leadholder? Leadholders let you draw with the side of the lead, and sharpen it to any shape you like. They're practically the same as wooden pencils except you don't need to cut the case to sharpen them.
  - Broken_Hippo 9y ago
    A cheap paintbrush is practically the same as an expensive one, but I'd not trade my $70 watercolor brush for a cheap one. In art, practically the same can get weirdly different results. Simply changing a brand in the same category (paint, for example) can mean color differences and some mixing issues if mixed with some other brands. With this, it is more issue of price, availability, personal preference and practicality. Some folks will seek out such a thing, but most wont. I found one from Faber-Castell (generally available brand of art pens/pencils). [1] The hardness isn't marked on the outside of the pencil (good for looks, bad for pencil changes) Though it comes with 14 different hardnesses of lead, refills only come in 11 (You don't need such a wide variety most times though). Oh, and they are $11.50 each. I'd use at least 3-4 different graphite hardnesses in one picture, usually a few more. $45-$60 with hard to find replacement leads for a small benefit that doesn't seem to improve things the way a good paintbrush does. After all, you can just buy Faber-Castell wood pencils (a set for around the price of one) and get the same quality lead. Now, more to the point, the concerns I would have switching as an artist: some mechanical pencil lead isn't quite the same substance as the pencils, and it is obvious when one erases and blends. Not only that, but I'm pretty sure that even though you can use the side of lead, the shape of the tip is different sort of support than the wood against the pencil. I can see how folks would prefer one sort over an other, so it might not work out. [1] http://www.fabercastell.com/products/more-products/mechanical-pencil/ClutchpencilTK94002mm0H/139420 http://www.fabercastell.com/products/more-products/mechanica...
    - 9y ago
totalZero 9y ago
Some standardized tests don't allow mechanical pencils.
bitofhope 9y ago
Pencils are cheap, good leadholders are not. A decent pencil costs 0,50€, an amazing one 2€. Good 2mm leads alone are in the premium woodcase pencil price range. Pencils can be quickly swapped for different hardness. Swapping the lead grade in a holder is much more involved. Some artists may even find subtle differences between brands of pencils and may prefer to quickly swap. Leadholders are almost invariably quite thick. The feel in hand is very different from the slim woodcase pencil. Whenever I write by hand, I tend to prefer a fountain pen, a mechanical or a woodcase pencil. Writing with a Mitsubishi Hi-Uni or Tombow Mono 100 pencil, for those who can appreciate it, is a cheap luxury. Pencils are higly versatile writing instruments. I'm left handed and heavy handed and prefer H or 2H pencils to prevent smudging. Writers like Vladimir Nabokov praised the Eberhard Faber Blackwing (about 2B on a typical modern pencil scale, although these aren't standardized) for its smooth, almost pen-like glide. American manufacturers can't compete in lowest price, but they might in best quality. The Germans and Japanese already do.
- aninhumer 9y ago
  >Pencils can be quickly swapped for different hardness. Swapping the lead grade in a holder is much more involved. But surely you could just between multiple holders with different leads in them, which would be equivalent to swapping pencils?
  - bitofhope 9y ago
    Yes, but at a price and space disadvantage. A set of leadholders to match the gradient of a good art pencil set will cost at least tens, more likely hundreds of dollars. They will also take more space. Clutch pencil leads are not as readily available everywhere, especially in different hardnesses.
- mrob 9y ago
  >smooth, almost pen-like glide I have a Mitsubishi Hi-Uni 10B woodcase pencil, which is the only 10B rated pencil I could find. As you said, pencil hardness isn't standardized, but it's a very soft pencil, and it does feel smooth compared to other woodcase pencils. But it does not feel as smooth as a 0.5mm mechanical pencil with Pilot Neox 4B lead, which is the smoothest mechanical pencil lead I could find. The Mitsubishi does however write a little darker.

by mrob 9y ago

pubby 9y ago

I don't think artists will ever give them up.

icantdrive55 9y ago
Yea, I don't know how to shade with a mechanical pencil.

microcolonel 9y ago

> but the cost is unlikely to be competitive if they're made in America. There are competitors which sell twelve-packs of № 2 of similar quality for about the same price, if Amazon is anything to go by. Pencils are also still basically indispensable in schools.

yeukhon 9y ago

Not really. I don't know anyone who use clutch pencil so I am not sure how it compared to wooden /mechanical pencils. Regardless, pen seems more dominant now in school. I was born in the early 90s, so both wooden pencils and mechanical pencils meant a lot to me. I still have two pencil lead left in my right palm because I accidentally stabbed my hands when I was a kid - pretty sure most of us who have used pencils regularly back then had experienced this. Eraser was also a big deal to me and my classmates. I owned regular plain erasers, fruit-flavor erasers, and animal-shape erasers before. But I preferred the slightly expensive Japanese brand called "Sakurafoam eraser" [1]. I am not sure when our future generations will stop writing by hand completely, but eventually pen and pencil will see the fate as scribe and Chinese brush pen which are uncommon now. [1]: https://imgur.com/a/g30c9 https://imgur.com/a/g30c9

cultofmetatron 9y ago
... did you say fruit flavoured eraser???
- Stratoscope 9y ago
  Fruit scented anyway. You weren't really supposed to eat them, although I can't speak for GP. (I used to eat match heads when I was a kid, so I can hardly criticize anyone's eating habits.) You can still get them, for example the Lil Juicies: https://www.ooly.com/lil-juicies-fruit-scented-erasers-set-of-6/ https://www.ooly.com/lil-juicies-fruit-scented-erasers-set-o...
- davchana 9y ago
  In india we call eraser as rubber too :) Fruit Flavoured Rubber will sound too NSFW in America :)
Hextinium 9y ago
I started using a lead holder/clutch pencil for schoolwork and I can't go back to anything else because of the knurled grip. Pencils slowly slip out of my hand after just 2 minutes of writing while my lead holder will write for hours with no repositioning.
- ghaff 9y ago
  They at least used to be very common for drafting. I probably still have one or two somewhere. As you point out, you get a better grip and they're probably also easier to keep very sharp.

mc32 9y ago

Japanese labor is also expensive, also German, yet they both manage to have pencil factories. You can get your favorite brands here: https://cwpencils.com/collections/2-pencils https://cwpencils.com/collections/2-pencils Quality, specialization and marketing.

forinti 9y ago
This made we wonder why there aren't more regional or local pencil factories or factories of other low tech products where a few people and the right machinery can be quite productive.
- jhoechtl 9y ago
  Because shipping products from overseas where they are mass-made is cheaper than producing them next corner. An effect of globalization.
- wbl 9y ago
  Scale matters as does brand. If you are just the regional pencil factory, and only distribute in a small area, you will have difficulty keeping the factory working all the time.

hellofunk 9y ago

Wooden pencils are far superior and more versatile for drawing.

mrob 9y ago
What artistic technique is possible with a wooden pencil but not a leadholder? Leadholders let you draw with the side of the lead, and sharpen it to any shape you like. They're practically the same as wooden pencils except you don't need to cut the case to sharpen them.
- Broken_Hippo 9y ago
  A cheap paintbrush is practically the same as an expensive one, but I'd not trade my $70 watercolor brush for a cheap one. In art, practically the same can get weirdly different results. Simply changing a brand in the same category (paint, for example) can mean color differences and some mixing issues if mixed with some other brands. With this, it is more issue of price, availability, personal preference and practicality. Some folks will seek out such a thing, but most wont. I found one from Faber-Castell (generally available brand of art pens/pencils). [1] The hardness isn't marked on the outside of the pencil (good for looks, bad for pencil changes) Though it comes with 14 different hardnesses of lead, refills only come in 11 (You don't need such a wide variety most times though). Oh, and they are $11.50 each. I'd use at least 3-4 different graphite hardnesses in one picture, usually a few more. $45-$60 with hard to find replacement leads for a small benefit that doesn't seem to improve things the way a good paintbrush does. After all, you can just buy Faber-Castell wood pencils (a set for around the price of one) and get the same quality lead. Now, more to the point, the concerns I would have switching as an artist: some mechanical pencil lead isn't quite the same substance as the pencils, and it is obvious when one erases and blends. Not only that, but I'm pretty sure that even though you can use the side of lead, the shape of the tip is different sort of support than the wood against the pencil. I can see how folks would prefer one sort over an other, so it might not work out. [1] http://www.fabercastell.com/products/more-products/mechanical-pencil/ClutchpencilTK94002mm0H/139420 http://www.fabercastell.com/products/more-products/mechanica...
  - 9y ago

totalZero 9y ago

Some standardized tests don't allow mechanical pencils.

bitofhope 9y ago

Pencils are cheap, good leadholders are not. A decent pencil costs 0,50€, an amazing one 2€. Good 2mm leads alone are in the premium woodcase pencil price range. Pencils can be quickly swapped for different hardness. Swapping the lead grade in a holder is much more involved. Some artists may even find subtle differences between brands of pencils and may prefer to quickly swap. Leadholders are almost invariably quite thick. The feel in hand is very different from the slim woodcase pencil. Whenever I write by hand, I tend to prefer a fountain pen, a mechanical or a woodcase pencil. Writing with a Mitsubishi Hi-Uni or Tombow Mono 100 pencil, for those who can appreciate it, is a cheap luxury. Pencils are higly versatile writing instruments. I'm left handed and heavy handed and prefer H or 2H pencils to prevent smudging. Writers like Vladimir Nabokov praised the Eberhard Faber Blackwing (about 2B on a typical modern pencil scale, although these aren't standardized) for its smooth, almost pen-like glide. American manufacturers can't compete in lowest price, but they might in best quality. The Germans and Japanese already do.

aninhumer 9y ago
>Pencils can be quickly swapped for different hardness. Swapping the lead grade in a holder is much more involved. But surely you could just between multiple holders with different leads in them, which would be equivalent to swapping pencils?
- bitofhope 9y ago
  Yes, but at a price and space disadvantage. A set of leadholders to match the gradient of a good art pencil set will cost at least tens, more likely hundreds of dollars. They will also take more space. Clutch pencil leads are not as readily available everywhere, especially in different hardnesses.
mrob 9y ago
>smooth, almost pen-like glide I have a Mitsubishi Hi-Uni 10B woodcase pencil, which is the only 10B rated pencil I could find. As you said, pencil hardness isn't standardized, but it's a very soft pencil, and it does feel smooth compared to other woodcase pencils. But it does not feel as smooth as a 0.5mm mechanical pencil with Pilot Neox 4B lead, which is the smoothest mechanical pencil lead I could find. The Mitsubishi does however write a little darker.