4 ms·

Don't bring liberals into this. Just because the NRA tells you that we want to take your guns away doesn't make it true. The NRA endorsed Senator Jim Webb's o

by jbooth 16y ago

Don't bring liberals into this. Just because the NRA tells you that we want to take your guns away doesn't make it true. The NRA endorsed Senator Jim Webb's opponent. Webb subsequently got in trouble for accidentally taking a pistol into the capitol building. This guy is not anti-gun. The NRA is just running a donation scam. "Won't someone think of the children!" is non-partisan, and if it has a label, it's most closely associated with NIMBY.

CWuestefeld 16y ago
Well, of course the NRA are GOP stooges. I don't take them seriously, I think they really want to preserve the status quo. Heck, they didn't want to pursue the Heller case. Gun Owners of America are much better defenders of shooting and self-defense rights. Now, victim disarmament (aka "gun control") is most certainly a Democrat talking point. For example, they were the ones that got the ridiculous assault weapon ban passed, and thought that its repeal was the end of the world. I know that Liberal and Democrat are only slightly closer to synonyms than Conservative and Republican. As far as NIMBY goes, well, Chuck Schumer and Dianne Feinstein both carry concealed (see http://americandaily.com/article/9405 http://americandaily.com/article/9405 ), and they're very loud supporters of victim disarmament. Hypocrisy is par for the course in politics. Witness John Kerry's yacht. Politics should not be confused with ideology. They dress it up and put ideological lipstick on it, but the vast majority of today's politicians are not fighting for any ideology, they're fighting to extend their careers and their power. Of course the GOP is full of hypocrites as well. GWB talked about smaller government, but the government grew more under his watch than at any time in the history of the country.
- jbooth 16y ago
  It's "democratic". Every time someone uses the word "democrat" as an adjective, they reveal themselves to be more concerned with focus-group phrase mongering and tribal loyalty than attempting to understand the truth of the situation. Ditto for "victim disarmament". This isn't 1984, and changing the phrasing doesn't change the facts or your argument. You're not a victim, and there have not been serious efforts at disarming anyone since the assault weapons bill was allowed to expire.
  - CWuestefeld 16y ago
    Every time someone uses the word "democrat" as an adjective, they reveal themselves... I disagree, although I acknowledge some "prior art" for your claim. "Democratic" is the adjective form of the noun "democracy", which denotes a political system characterized by voting. In my mind, recycling that term to refer to one political party would imply that the other (i.e, GOP) is not related to our democracy -- and that's false. they reveal themselves to be more concerned with focus-group phrase mongering and tribal loyalty I think if you look back at my politics-related comments here, you'll see that I'm an equal-opportuntiy complainer. My ideology certainly does not coincide with either the GOP or the Conservative movement. I'm simply looking for terminology that conveys my meaning better.
    - jbooth 16y ago
      The reason that Fox News and Republicans (and nobody else, you'll notice) says things like "the Democrat party" is that they did research and found that people have a more negative reaction to that than the democratic party. It started a few years ago, after almost 200 years of everyone saying "Democratic party". I have a huge problem with this line of thinking, not because I'm offended by the phrasing (I'm not), but because it shows a 1984-ish approach to politics and governing. As far as your claimed independence and moderation -- what does John Kerry's yacht have to do with anything? That sounded awfully partisan to me. I'm a partisan. I own it. You should do the same.
      - CWuestefeld 16y ago
        We're largely debating about angels on the head of a pin, but what the heck... If you scan my comments, you'll see that I never uttered the phrase "the Democrat party". My phrase was "a Democrat talking point", and I think this is quite consonant liguistically with a statement like "I am a Democrat". Nobody says "I'm a Democratic". Specifically, had I said that "gun control is a Democratic talking point", that would indicate that the talking point of gun control is somehow characterized by democracy (but for the capital "D", which may help resolve it, I admit). That is nothing like what I meant. "John Kerry's yacht" refers to a person who claims that we should all be paying our fair share to provide such democratic (note the lower-case D: I do mean that it's characteristic of democracy) funding for our government. Specifically, it refers to the recent discovery that he had moored his boat out-of-state in order to avoid sales tax, painting him as hypocritical. Kerry was the first to come to mind because of its recency. One might also reference anti-immigration Republicans and their cleaning ladies, for example. I'm a partisan. I own it. You should do the same. I'm not partisan, at least not in the way that's typically used, in the polarization of American politics between left and right. I am a member of the Libertarian Party, so in a proper sense I am a partisan, but I'm not of the sort that mindlessly bashes the {GOP,DEM} while ignoring the faults of the {DEM,GOP}. For example, you'll see that just up-thread, I called the NRA "GOP stooges". And there are precious few Libertarians in office for me to criticize.

by jbooth 16y ago

CWuestefeld 16y ago

Well, of course the NRA are GOP stooges. I don't take them seriously, I think they really want to preserve the status quo. Heck, they didn't want to pursue the Heller case. Gun Owners of America are much better defenders of shooting and self-defense rights. Now, victim disarmament (aka "gun control") is most certainly a Democrat talking point. For example, they were the ones that got the ridiculous assault weapon ban passed, and thought that its repeal was the end of the world. I know that Liberal and Democrat are only slightly closer to synonyms than Conservative and Republican. As far as NIMBY goes, well, Chuck Schumer and Dianne Feinstein both carry concealed (see http://americandaily.com/article/9405 http://americandaily.com/article/9405 ), and they're very loud supporters of victim disarmament. Hypocrisy is par for the course in politics. Witness John Kerry's yacht. Politics should not be confused with ideology. They dress it up and put ideological lipstick on it, but the vast majority of today's politicians are not fighting for any ideology, they're fighting to extend their careers and their power. Of course the GOP is full of hypocrites as well. GWB talked about smaller government, but the government grew more under his watch than at any time in the history of the country.

jbooth 16y ago
It's "democratic". Every time someone uses the word "democrat" as an adjective, they reveal themselves to be more concerned with focus-group phrase mongering and tribal loyalty than attempting to understand the truth of the situation. Ditto for "victim disarmament". This isn't 1984, and changing the phrasing doesn't change the facts or your argument. You're not a victim, and there have not been serious efforts at disarming anyone since the assault weapons bill was allowed to expire.
- CWuestefeld 16y ago
  Every time someone uses the word "democrat" as an adjective, they reveal themselves... I disagree, although I acknowledge some "prior art" for your claim. "Democratic" is the adjective form of the noun "democracy", which denotes a political system characterized by voting. In my mind, recycling that term to refer to one political party would imply that the other (i.e, GOP) is not related to our democracy -- and that's false. they reveal themselves to be more concerned with focus-group phrase mongering and tribal loyalty I think if you look back at my politics-related comments here, you'll see that I'm an equal-opportuntiy complainer. My ideology certainly does not coincide with either the GOP or the Conservative movement. I'm simply looking for terminology that conveys my meaning better.
  - jbooth 16y ago
    The reason that Fox News and Republicans (and nobody else, you'll notice) says things like "the Democrat party" is that they did research and found that people have a more negative reaction to that than the democratic party. It started a few years ago, after almost 200 years of everyone saying "Democratic party". I have a huge problem with this line of thinking, not because I'm offended by the phrasing (I'm not), but because it shows a 1984-ish approach to politics and governing. As far as your claimed independence and moderation -- what does John Kerry's yacht have to do with anything? That sounded awfully partisan to me. I'm a partisan. I own it. You should do the same.
    - CWuestefeld 16y ago
      We're largely debating about angels on the head of a pin, but what the heck... If you scan my comments, you'll see that I never uttered the phrase "the Democrat party". My phrase was "a Democrat talking point", and I think this is quite consonant liguistically with a statement like "I am a Democrat". Nobody says "I'm a Democratic". Specifically, had I said that "gun control is a Democratic talking point", that would indicate that the talking point of gun control is somehow characterized by democracy (but for the capital "D", which may help resolve it, I admit). That is nothing like what I meant. "John Kerry's yacht" refers to a person who claims that we should all be paying our fair share to provide such democratic (note the lower-case D: I do mean that it's characteristic of democracy) funding for our government. Specifically, it refers to the recent discovery that he had moored his boat out-of-state in order to avoid sales tax, painting him as hypocritical. Kerry was the first to come to mind because of its recency. One might also reference anti-immigration Republicans and their cleaning ladies, for example. I'm a partisan. I own it. You should do the same. I'm not partisan, at least not in the way that's typically used, in the polarization of American politics between left and right. I am a member of the Libertarian Party, so in a proper sense I am a partisan, but I'm not of the sort that mindlessly bashes the {GOP,DEM} while ignoring the faults of the {DEM,GOP}. For example, you'll see that just up-thread, I called the NRA "GOP stooges". And there are precious few Libertarians in office for me to criticize.