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> the UK retains some control of immigration w.r.t EU citizens (some of which they chose not to enforce and it also allows UK citizens to avail of freedom of mo

by kypro 9y ago

> the UK retains some control of immigration w.r.t EU citizens (some of which they chose not to enforce and it also allows UK citizens to avail of freedom of movement as well) and full control of the immigration of non-EU citizens, so your assertion is false As you probably know the control the UK does have over EU citizens is extremely extremely limit. They don't call it "open borders" for no reason believe it or not. > Brain drain is debatable, there was never a position for a lot of them in the 1st place (and they might just go somewhere else) Yeah, well who cares about developing countries as long as the west benefits right? Perhaps we should be focusing on giving them positions in their own countries rather than requiring them to move from their families, friends and culture just for a better life? But morals never play a role in this. It's all about the nations gross-GDP isn't it?

ben_w 9y ago
Schengen area is an open border (+), UK-France is not. UK has the right to eject EU citizens who can’t support themselves, but lacks the beurocracy to identify such people. + and even that has exceptions, I was passport-checked going from Italy into France but not France to Italy, I assume because of the state of emergency from the attack a few years ago.
- kypro 9y ago
  > Schengen area is an open border (+), UK-France is not. UK has the right to eject EU citizens who can’t support themselves, but lacks the beurocracy to identify such people. I understand this, but then the assumption is that this is a good immigration system. A nation shouldn't let anyone in who can get a job and support themselves. It's an awful immigration system which we have no control over and the majority of the public disagree with. I simply can't understand why some people fail to understand what a disgrace that is. I'll also add that it undermines the UK democracy entirely. People who immigrate to the UK from the EU, or have family who did, vote very differently from native Brits. What's happening is people are coming into the UK, against the the public's wishes (and also without them having any political capacity to stop it) then voting against the UK public's wishes in their elections. > + and even that has exceptions, I was passport-checked going from Italy into France but not France to Italy, I assume because of the state of emergency from the attack a few years ago. It's almost like open borders isn't good for national security. Who'd of thought.
  - ben_w 9y ago
    > which we have no control over The UK has the authority, just not the competence to use that authority. This is Westminster’s fault, not the EU’s. > People who immigrate to the UK from the EU, or have family who did, vote very differently from native Brits They’re not allowed to vote in general elections (or the Referendum) unless they’re Irish (or have multiple nationalities and the other is British, Irish, or Commonwealth): http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registration/who-is-eligible-to-vote-at-a-uk-general-election http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registr... > It's almost like open borders isn't good for national security. Who'd of thought. Poor argument. In feudal times, you needed your Lord’s permission to leave your village — if that was still true, virtually every terrorist attack from the time of the IRA (the original) onwards would have been impossible.

by kypro 9y ago

ben_w 9y ago

Schengen area is an open border (+), UK-France is not. UK has the right to eject EU citizens who can’t support themselves, but lacks the beurocracy to identify such people. + and even that has exceptions, I was passport-checked going from Italy into France but not France to Italy, I assume because of the state of emergency from the attack a few years ago.

kypro 9y ago
> Schengen area is an open border (+), UK-France is not. UK has the right to eject EU citizens who can’t support themselves, but lacks the beurocracy to identify such people. I understand this, but then the assumption is that this is a good immigration system. A nation shouldn't let anyone in who can get a job and support themselves. It's an awful immigration system which we have no control over and the majority of the public disagree with. I simply can't understand why some people fail to understand what a disgrace that is. I'll also add that it undermines the UK democracy entirely. People who immigrate to the UK from the EU, or have family who did, vote very differently from native Brits. What's happening is people are coming into the UK, against the the public's wishes (and also without them having any political capacity to stop it) then voting against the UK public's wishes in their elections. > + and even that has exceptions, I was passport-checked going from Italy into France but not France to Italy, I assume because of the state of emergency from the attack a few years ago. It's almost like open borders isn't good for national security. Who'd of thought.
- ben_w 9y ago
  > which we have no control over The UK has the authority, just not the competence to use that authority. This is Westminster’s fault, not the EU’s. > People who immigrate to the UK from the EU, or have family who did, vote very differently from native Brits They’re not allowed to vote in general elections (or the Referendum) unless they’re Irish (or have multiple nationalities and the other is British, Irish, or Commonwealth): http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registration/who-is-eligible-to-vote-at-a-uk-general-election http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registr... > It's almost like open borders isn't good for national security. Who'd of thought. Poor argument. In feudal times, you needed your Lord’s permission to leave your village — if that was still true, virtually every terrorist attack from the time of the IRA (the original) onwards would have been impossible.