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> 1. We see no problem in dongle jokes Who is 'we' here? You think most Americans have a problem with dongle jokes? Or you mean to say that most or all Europe

> 1. We see no problem in dongle jokes Who is 'we' here? You think most Americans have a problem with dongle jokes? Or you mean to say that most or all Europeans don't have a problem with dongle jokes. > 2. If someone would see a problem with it and complain, those complains would be ignored (because we see no problem) This is when you end up with Uber, where these complaints were ignored and they eventually ended up with Susan Fowler incident. The company fired the woman who complained because their servers were getting DDoSed. Look I know what you're saying, it isn't that a day passes by when someone on the Internet, Europeans don't remind Americans (And many Americans remind themselves) that Americans are very prude compared to Europe. But what you're not doing is understanding the problem here. The problem isn't the 'prude American culture', rather, there is a civil life culture, and then there is a work culture. The complaint feminists have made is that work culture needs to be more welcoming to women. So the question is 'What constitutes as welcoming work culture?'. Saying "Hurr hurr, we are Europeans, we don't have problems like that" is just sidestepping the issue. Are European workplaces completely welcoming to women, as European feminists would like it to be? If not, then how are you dealing with it?

koonsolo 9y ago
> This is when you end up with Uber, where these complaints were ignored and they eventually ended up with Susan Fowler incident. Sorry, but Susan Fowler did not complain about 'dongle' jokes, this was a serious case of sexual harassment. Not seeing the distinction between the two is a serious problem. > Are European workplaces completely welcoming to women, as European feminists would like it to be? From my personal experience, the women I worked with were a minority in tech, and they actually enjoyed working in a male dominated environment. They told me guys are more up front, and they preferred that over working in woman dominated environments where there is a lot of backstabbing going on. I worked for a lot of female managers, and they were very good at their job. Probably because women are socially softer than men (=men have more ego). That's what I mean with respect. We will treat women as co-workers, not as people to have potentially sex with, and not with 'oh my god, there's a woman in the workplace, let's act totally different than we normally do not to scare her away'.

koonsolo 9y ago

> This is when you end up with Uber, where these complaints were ignored and they eventually ended up with Susan Fowler incident. Sorry, but Susan Fowler did not complain about 'dongle' jokes, this was a serious case of sexual harassment. Not seeing the distinction between the two is a serious problem. > Are European workplaces completely welcoming to women, as European feminists would like it to be? From my personal experience, the women I worked with were a minority in tech, and they actually enjoyed working in a male dominated environment. They told me guys are more up front, and they preferred that over working in woman dominated environments where there is a lot of backstabbing going on. I worked for a lot of female managers, and they were very good at their job. Probably because women are socially softer than men (=men have more ego). That's what I mean with respect. We will treat women as co-workers, not as people to have potentially sex with, and not with 'oh my god, there's a woman in the workplace, let's act totally different than we normally do not to scare her away'.