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I don’t understand the legitimacy of the criticisms that this article is leveling at the former. I can’t tell why it’s saying anything more than “I don’t like t

I don’t understand the legitimacy of the criticisms that this article is leveling at the former. I can’t tell why it’s saying anything more than “I don’t like this study therefore it’s wrong and stupid and dangerous.” As it stands now, North Carolina has an electoral system that gives the minority party a veto proof absolute majority in their legislative branch, which seems like the opposite of democracy. I’d think the criticism would be more honest if it engaged with the facts plainly, instead of basing itself on just the personal opinions of the author.

sp332 9y ago
Any study that puts North Korea that high on a measure of democracy is going to take a serious credibility hit. Also according to the same paper, there are many states that score lower than NC on the same scale. So the first article calling out NC cherry-picked data from a questionable study.
- travmatt 9y ago
  Again I’m just not seeing any engagement with actual data beyond - “I don’t like this study so obviously it’s flawed and you must agree with me because fairness.” I’ll put it more simply, again. North Carolina has an electoral system that gives the minority party an absolute veto proof majority of their congress. In my view that is incompatible with democracy, and I don’t understand why I should give any credence to a criticism who can’t engage with that point honestly and forthrightly. I’m open to hearing more about alternative opinions, but for me that requires a better argument.
  - sp332 9y ago
    I don’t understand why I should give any credence to a criticism who can’t engage with that point honestly and forthrightly. That's exactly why the original article can be dismissed. Of course there's a lot wrong in NC but no one has to engage data that is put forward in bad faith. Find (or write) a "forthright" argument first.
    - travmatt 9y ago
      I don’t think i understand your viewpoint, please help me. In my view, the simple fact that North Carolina has a minority party that has an absolute veto proof majority is in itself incompatible with democracy. Even though places like North Korea or Oman do not have democracies, their ruling parties do have constituencies that are loyal to them, and you may ‘rank’ these constituencies by size. The fact that North Carolina relies on a smaller constituency for control doesn’t invalidate this study in my eyes, rather highlights the disenfranchisement North Carolina is imposing upon certain citizens.
      - sp332 9y ago
        That sounds like a completely reasonable idea. Too bad the article didn't include it.

sp332 9y ago

Any study that puts North Korea that high on a measure of democracy is going to take a serious credibility hit. Also according to the same paper, there are many states that score lower than NC on the same scale. So the first article calling out NC cherry-picked data from a questionable study.

travmatt 9y ago
Again I’m just not seeing any engagement with actual data beyond - “I don’t like this study so obviously it’s flawed and you must agree with me because fairness.” I’ll put it more simply, again. North Carolina has an electoral system that gives the minority party an absolute veto proof majority of their congress. In my view that is incompatible with democracy, and I don’t understand why I should give any credence to a criticism who can’t engage with that point honestly and forthrightly. I’m open to hearing more about alternative opinions, but for me that requires a better argument.
- sp332 9y ago
  I don’t understand why I should give any credence to a criticism who can’t engage with that point honestly and forthrightly. That's exactly why the original article can be dismissed. Of course there's a lot wrong in NC but no one has to engage data that is put forward in bad faith. Find (or write) a "forthright" argument first.
  - travmatt 9y ago
    I don’t think i understand your viewpoint, please help me. In my view, the simple fact that North Carolina has a minority party that has an absolute veto proof majority is in itself incompatible with democracy. Even though places like North Korea or Oman do not have democracies, their ruling parties do have constituencies that are loyal to them, and you may ‘rank’ these constituencies by size. The fact that North Carolina relies on a smaller constituency for control doesn’t invalidate this study in my eyes, rather highlights the disenfranchisement North Carolina is imposing upon certain citizens.
    - sp332 9y ago
      That sounds like a completely reasonable idea. Too bad the article didn't include it.