10 ms·

Julian Assange's stay in London embassy untenable, says Ecuador

61 points by fmihaila 9y ago

junkscience2017 9y ago
has he seriously not left this building in that many years?
bhickey 9y ago
Why on earth haven't they removed him in a diplomatic bag or handcuffed to their ambassador?
- SEJeff 9y ago
  The cuffs could be removed as being attached to an ambassador doesn't give one diplomatic immunity. Putting him in a GIANT diplomatic bag is actually an interesting idea.
  - wallflower 9y ago
    Reminds me of that scene from Lethal Weapon 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiXNUaSjXRY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiXNUaSjXRY
  - serf 9y ago
    >Putting him in a GIANT diplomatic bag... Wikipedia mentions a previous time this may have happened. "In 1964, a Moroccan-born Israeli double agent named Mordechai Ben Masoud Louk (also known as Josef Dahan) was drugged, bound, and placed in a diplomatic mailing crate at the Egyptian Embassy in Rome, but was rescued by Italian authorities.[4] The box that he had been sealed into "had almost certainly been used before for human cargo,"[5] including possibly for an Egyptian military official who had defected to Italy several years before but then disappeared without a trace before reappearing under Egyptian custody and facing trial."
  - RantyDave 9y ago
    It can't be that hard, heavy for sure b.... oh, you mean alive.
- sesutton 9y ago
  They probably don't want to destroy diplomatic relations with the UK. The UK could also have just expelled the entire Argentinian embassy as well.
tristanb 9y ago
Or you know, he could let the justice system run its course.
- eitland 9y ago
  Maybe because many of us has reason to belive this isn't about justice but about how to get hold of Assange? I'm no big fan of that man but there are so many questions around this investigation that I have serious problems believing most of the official story.
  - QAPereo 9y ago
    It’s almost like there should be some place to work out questions of fact, publicly, with a focus on evidence... maybe a judge and some lawyers, I don’t know, some kind of koort... quort... court.
    - DashRattlesnake 9y ago
      > It’s almost like there should be some place to work out questions of fact, publicly, with a focus on evidence... maybe a judge and some lawyers, I don’t know, some kind of koort... quort... court. This kind of snark is obnoxious and never adds anything.
      - eitland 9y ago
        Even if I'm a big fan of HN style discussion and this snark was directed at me I'll say it adds to the discission because it allows me to add some depth to the argument. I'm generally a huge fan of European police and think they often don’t get enough credit for the work they do. That said, in this particular case there is a number of red flags for me, e.g.: - generally Scandinavian police won't go to these lengths for cases like this. Why this time? - why wouldn't they even meet him in the embassy until their deadlines started approaching? If I was trying to sort a case big enough to require extradition requests then flying to London to interview would be a no-brainer.
chiaro 9y ago
The reasons why Ecuador took Assange in in the first place no longer make much sense. Under Correa, there were a number of tensions with the US that were looming large in Ecuadorian political landscape following a default in 08. By taking in Assange, Correa could both shore up anti-US sentiments at home that were mounting in criticism over an oil export deal, and get a bargaining chip to boot if he needed it. With Correa out of the picture and China stepping in and propping up exports, this makes little sense, and Assange's value as a bargaining chip is dubious to a Trump admin. Back when Wikileaks had a better reputation, it also helped affray Correa's attacks on free speech at home. Now that Assange's reputation is in the gutter, he's only a liability to Ecuador.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > Assange's value as a bargaining chip is dubious to a Trump admin. I expect that Trump doesn't particularly want Assange (despite WikiLeaks complaining of a Trump Admin war on WikiLeaks), and I expect that he especially doesn't want Assange anywhere within reach of the Mueller investigation.
- roenxi 9y ago
  It is a shame to see Assange's welfare reduced to being a bargaining chip like this, but one imagines that he has upset too many powerful people and it is only a matter of time for him until he is back in the justice system and shuffled into a cell somewhere. I'll be counting him lucky if he avoids something like Guantanamo. It really amazes me how many people claim there are no conspiracies against Assange though - the number of things that went from 'conspiracy theory' to 'uncomfortable fact' because of Wikileaks is obviously no evidence of anything. I remember what it was like watching discussion of the 5 Eyes before Wikileaks; people were written off as cranks for opinions that turned out to be very well rooted in fact. If Wikileaks' leadership gets shut down, we are going to lose a very comforting level of insight into how decisions are actually being made by people in power; and what the moral realities of government actually are.
  - justAnotherNET 9y ago
    The same people who called it all “conspiracy theory” we calling him a “Russian hack” today. Nothing has changed.
StringyBob 9y ago
I've no idea of the truth of the original allegations, or his claims that he was set up, but since then it's quite impressive how he's managed to change my perception of him and wikileaks from 'champions of freedom-of-information / free speech' to 'russian government stooge' over the last few years.
- convery 9y ago
  So, he leaks Russian government secrets while working for them? Seems legit.
  - dragonwriter 9y ago
    If you mean, when you say “legit”, “a common—cliché, even—method for a intelligence service to have their agent demonstrate bogus bona fide in order to either establish credibility or obscure their reporting relationship”, then, yes, I'd say it sounds “legit”.
    - brokenmachine 9y ago
      Truth is lies, lies is truth. How can anyone ever be legit?
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - travmatt 9y ago
    By leaking do you mean censoring emails showing Russian bank transfers to Syrian banks, then treatening reporters who actually report on it?[0] Or his tv deal with RT?[1] Or his tacit admission to Pussy Riot he works for Putin?[2] Or his failure to deliver on promised Russian leaks?[3] Or how he turned down Russia related leaks? [4] Or, my favorite, the time that he tried to discredit the panama papers showing Putin's hiding of wealth , decrying it as a CIA plot. Or are we just talking about the clearly timed leaks of Clinton emails every time Trumps campaign seemed in jeopardy? I can probably be convinced that Assange isn't just a Russian operative, but to just act like he believes in 'radical transparency' or doesn't have shady connections is laughable at this point. [0]https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/9/12864328/wikileaks-threat-reporters-syria-russia-emails https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/9/12864328/wikileaks-threat-... [1]http://bigthink.com/think-tank/julian-assange-to-host-talk-show-on-russia-today http://bigthink.com/think-tank/julian-assange-to-host-talk-s... [2]https://www.thedailybeast.com/pussy-riots-nadya-tolokno-julian-assange-is-connected-with-the-russian-government https://www.thedailybeast.com/pussy-riots-nadya-tolokno-juli... [3]https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2010/1026/WikiLeaks-ready-to-drop-a-bombshell-on-Russia.-But-will-Russians-get-to-read-about-it https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2010/1026/WikiLeaks-r... [4]http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/08/17/wikileaks-turned-down-leaks-on-russian-government-during-u-s-presidential-campaign/ http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/08/17/wikileaks-turned-down-le...
neo4sure 9y ago
Time to introduce Assange to Muller.
mauthsdki 9y ago
Respect! Without him we would know anything about Clintons, Pizzagates, Obamas juicy hidden secrets. Big thanks you really proven that our governments are liars..
ty0ki 9y ago
some of the comments in this thread are really concerning to me. i bet assange was in their good books before their political candidate lost.
ty0ki 9y ago
Clearly the man takes his orders from Vladimir Putin so bagging him and executing him is a-okay
wbillingsley 9y ago
It's getting a little hard to see what he's hiding from -- his asylum claim had been based on fears that after being extradited to Sweden he would then be sent to the US; but (according to the article) he's only facing UK charges of breaching bail conditions, and he was in the UK, seemingly unafraid of being whisked off to America, before all this erupted. To my (perhaps naive) eyes, it looked like that was the "final settlement" to defuse the situation -- the Swedish charges have been dropped but he has to face charges for the comparatively lesser offence he plainly and publicly committed (breaching UK bail conditions)? I'm not sure there is much the UK can mediate on -- they plainly can't do or say anything about whether a third country (the US) has prepared charges they are waiting to file as it's not under their control, and in any case that wouldn't have any bearing on the UK bail-skipping charges (as a suddenly-filed extradition request if anything would be more likely to succeed if he wasn't facing charges in the UK)
- justAnotherNET 9y ago
  There’s very little to meditate on. The details are largely irrelevant. We’ll kill him the second we get the chance. If US INTEL doesn’t get him mossad will. He knows he’s not long for this world, and it’s frankly very sad that this is happening at all.

61 points by fmihaila 9y ago

junkscience2017 9y ago

has he seriously not left this building in that many years?

bhickey 9y ago

Why on earth haven't they removed him in a diplomatic bag or handcuffed to their ambassador?

SEJeff 9y ago
The cuffs could be removed as being attached to an ambassador doesn't give one diplomatic immunity. Putting him in a GIANT diplomatic bag is actually an interesting idea.
- wallflower 9y ago
  Reminds me of that scene from Lethal Weapon 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiXNUaSjXRY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiXNUaSjXRY
- serf 9y ago
  >Putting him in a GIANT diplomatic bag... Wikipedia mentions a previous time this may have happened. "In 1964, a Moroccan-born Israeli double agent named Mordechai Ben Masoud Louk (also known as Josef Dahan) was drugged, bound, and placed in a diplomatic mailing crate at the Egyptian Embassy in Rome, but was rescued by Italian authorities.[4] The box that he had been sealed into "had almost certainly been used before for human cargo,"[5] including possibly for an Egyptian military official who had defected to Italy several years before but then disappeared without a trace before reappearing under Egyptian custody and facing trial."
- RantyDave 9y ago
  It can't be that hard, heavy for sure b.... oh, you mean alive.
sesutton 9y ago
They probably don't want to destroy diplomatic relations with the UK. The UK could also have just expelled the entire Argentinian embassy as well.

tristanb 9y ago

Or you know, he could let the justice system run its course.

eitland 9y ago
Maybe because many of us has reason to belive this isn't about justice but about how to get hold of Assange? I'm no big fan of that man but there are so many questions around this investigation that I have serious problems believing most of the official story.
- QAPereo 9y ago
  It’s almost like there should be some place to work out questions of fact, publicly, with a focus on evidence... maybe a judge and some lawyers, I don’t know, some kind of koort... quort... court.
  - DashRattlesnake 9y ago
    > It’s almost like there should be some place to work out questions of fact, publicly, with a focus on evidence... maybe a judge and some lawyers, I don’t know, some kind of koort... quort... court. This kind of snark is obnoxious and never adds anything.
    - eitland 9y ago
      Even if I'm a big fan of HN style discussion and this snark was directed at me I'll say it adds to the discission because it allows me to add some depth to the argument. I'm generally a huge fan of European police and think they often don’t get enough credit for the work they do. That said, in this particular case there is a number of red flags for me, e.g.: - generally Scandinavian police won't go to these lengths for cases like this. Why this time? - why wouldn't they even meet him in the embassy until their deadlines started approaching? If I was trying to sort a case big enough to require extradition requests then flying to London to interview would be a no-brainer.

chiaro 9y ago

The reasons why Ecuador took Assange in in the first place no longer make much sense. Under Correa, there were a number of tensions with the US that were looming large in Ecuadorian political landscape following a default in 08. By taking in Assange, Correa could both shore up anti-US sentiments at home that were mounting in criticism over an oil export deal, and get a bargaining chip to boot if he needed it. With Correa out of the picture and China stepping in and propping up exports, this makes little sense, and Assange's value as a bargaining chip is dubious to a Trump admin. Back when Wikileaks had a better reputation, it also helped affray Correa's attacks on free speech at home. Now that Assange's reputation is in the gutter, he's only a liability to Ecuador.

dragonwriter 9y ago
> Assange's value as a bargaining chip is dubious to a Trump admin. I expect that Trump doesn't particularly want Assange (despite WikiLeaks complaining of a Trump Admin war on WikiLeaks), and I expect that he especially doesn't want Assange anywhere within reach of the Mueller investigation.
roenxi 9y ago
It is a shame to see Assange's welfare reduced to being a bargaining chip like this, but one imagines that he has upset too many powerful people and it is only a matter of time for him until he is back in the justice system and shuffled into a cell somewhere. I'll be counting him lucky if he avoids something like Guantanamo. It really amazes me how many people claim there are no conspiracies against Assange though - the number of things that went from 'conspiracy theory' to 'uncomfortable fact' because of Wikileaks is obviously no evidence of anything. I remember what it was like watching discussion of the 5 Eyes before Wikileaks; people were written off as cranks for opinions that turned out to be very well rooted in fact. If Wikileaks' leadership gets shut down, we are going to lose a very comforting level of insight into how decisions are actually being made by people in power; and what the moral realities of government actually are.
- justAnotherNET 9y ago
  The same people who called it all “conspiracy theory” we calling him a “Russian hack” today. Nothing has changed.

StringyBob 9y ago

I've no idea of the truth of the original allegations, or his claims that he was set up, but since then it's quite impressive how he's managed to change my perception of him and wikileaks from 'champions of freedom-of-information / free speech' to 'russian government stooge' over the last few years.

convery 9y ago
So, he leaks Russian government secrets while working for them? Seems legit.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  If you mean, when you say “legit”, “a common—cliché, even—method for a intelligence service to have their agent demonstrate bogus bona fide in order to either establish credibility or obscure their reporting relationship”, then, yes, I'd say it sounds “legit”.
  - brokenmachine 9y ago
    Truth is lies, lies is truth. How can anyone ever be legit?
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- travmatt 9y ago
  By leaking do you mean censoring emails showing Russian bank transfers to Syrian banks, then treatening reporters who actually report on it?[0] Or his tv deal with RT?[1] Or his tacit admission to Pussy Riot he works for Putin?[2] Or his failure to deliver on promised Russian leaks?[3] Or how he turned down Russia related leaks? [4] Or, my favorite, the time that he tried to discredit the panama papers showing Putin's hiding of wealth , decrying it as a CIA plot. Or are we just talking about the clearly timed leaks of Clinton emails every time Trumps campaign seemed in jeopardy? I can probably be convinced that Assange isn't just a Russian operative, but to just act like he believes in 'radical transparency' or doesn't have shady connections is laughable at this point. [0]https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/9/12864328/wikileaks-threat-reporters-syria-russia-emails https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/9/12864328/wikileaks-threat-... [1]http://bigthink.com/think-tank/julian-assange-to-host-talk-show-on-russia-today http://bigthink.com/think-tank/julian-assange-to-host-talk-s... [2]https://www.thedailybeast.com/pussy-riots-nadya-tolokno-julian-assange-is-connected-with-the-russian-government https://www.thedailybeast.com/pussy-riots-nadya-tolokno-juli... [3]https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2010/1026/WikiLeaks-ready-to-drop-a-bombshell-on-Russia.-But-will-Russians-get-to-read-about-it https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2010/1026/WikiLeaks-r... [4]http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/08/17/wikileaks-turned-down-leaks-on-russian-government-during-u-s-presidential-campaign/ http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/08/17/wikileaks-turned-down-le...

neo4sure 9y ago

Time to introduce Assange to Muller.

mauthsdki 9y ago

Respect! Without him we would know anything about Clintons, Pizzagates, Obamas juicy hidden secrets. Big thanks you really proven that our governments are liars..

ty0ki 9y ago

some of the comments in this thread are really concerning to me. i bet assange was in their good books before their political candidate lost.

ty0ki 9y ago

Clearly the man takes his orders from Vladimir Putin so bagging him and executing him is a-okay

wbillingsley 9y ago

It's getting a little hard to see what he's hiding from -- his asylum claim had been based on fears that after being extradited to Sweden he would then be sent to the US; but (according to the article) he's only facing UK charges of breaching bail conditions, and he was in the UK, seemingly unafraid of being whisked off to America, before all this erupted. To my (perhaps naive) eyes, it looked like that was the "final settlement" to defuse the situation -- the Swedish charges have been dropped but he has to face charges for the comparatively lesser offence he plainly and publicly committed (breaching UK bail conditions)? I'm not sure there is much the UK can mediate on -- they plainly can't do or say anything about whether a third country (the US) has prepared charges they are waiting to file as it's not under their control, and in any case that wouldn't have any bearing on the UK bail-skipping charges (as a suddenly-filed extradition request if anything would be more likely to succeed if he wasn't facing charges in the UK)

justAnotherNET 9y ago
There’s very little to meditate on. The details are largely irrelevant. We’ll kill him the second we get the chance. If US INTEL doesn’t get him mossad will. He knows he’s not long for this world, and it’s frankly very sad that this is happening at all.