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Why is the resolution still so low? Why not even 4K combined?

by devit 9y ago

andybak 9y ago
Because GPUs are struggling with many titles even at current resolutions.
- moron4hire 9y ago
  A lower resolution image would still look better upscaled on a higher resolution display because it would reduce the screen-door effect. Plus, it would help future-proof the device a little bit. But that might be the problem, they don't have to have too large of jumps between iterations so they have more launch events and sell more devices.
- devit 9y ago
  Then just simplify the game's 3D scenes? Also, this seems an inaccurate claim: e.g. a single $449 GTX 1070 Ti can do at least 50fps at 4K maximum quality in all tested games in https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070-ti-founders-edition-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-... This means that for 1000$ a dual 1070 Ti workstation should be able to do 4K 120hz just fine in all games, perhaps slightly lowering presets on GTA V. Of course this being cutting edge graphics a quad GPU setup is more reasonable which would allow 4K per eye at 120hz max quality, possibly even more with tweaked settings.
  - Strom 9y ago
    > 1070 Ti can do at least 50fps at 4K maximum quality in all tested games [1] Looking at the data in the link you provided, this does not seem to be the case. 26.3 @ Deus Ex: Mankind Divided 34.3 @ Grand Theft Auto V 36.8 @ Ghost Recon Wildlands 42.5 @ Dawn of War III 44.0 @ Total War: Warhammer 53.3 @ Battlefield 1 56.0 @ F1 2016 56.9 @ Ashes of the Singularity 63.9 @ DOOM The tested 9 games result in a median of 44.0 fps, average of 46.0 fps. Certainly well below at least 50fps. > a dual 1070 Ti workstation should be able to do 4K 120hz just fine As someone with experience running tri-crossfire in the past, a 2.4x improvement claim from SLI seems suspect. Let's look at some data of what actually happens with 1070 Ti SLI. [2] 1.39x @ Middle-Earth: Shadow of War 1.66x @ Ghost Recon Wildlands 1.67x @ Deus Ex: Mankind Divided 1.73x @ Battlefield 1 1.86x @ Destiny 2 1.90x @ Grand Theft Auto V 1.91x @ Rise Of The Tomb Raider 1.95x @ Sniper Elite 4 The tested 8 games result in a median of 1.80x fps, average of 1.76x fps. Definitely less than 2.4x. > a quad GPU setup is more reasonable Unfortunately the scaling factor plummets fast after the 2nd card. Three or four cards usually means you're well in the realm of diminishing returns. What's more, SLI/CrossFire have frame pacing issues. The resulting microstutter is annoying on a regular screen, but even more harmful in VR. Then there's also the problem that some rendering techniques are not compatible with SLI/CrossFire, and thus some games are not. GPU driver support actually adding SLI/CrossFire support comes several months after the release of the game as standard practice. To make matters worse, everything GPU related is just the beginning of one's problems when it comes to really high frame rates. Computing animations, physics, game rule logic at 120Hz+ also demands real good CPU and RAM. A good widely deployed example of this is the Xbox One X. Although it has a powerful GPU it still delivers frame rates as low as 10 in CPU-heavy games like PUBG. Most games have to target 30, and 60 is available only to a select few. -- [1] https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070-ti-founders-edition-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-... [2] http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1070_ti_2_way_sli_review,20.html http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1070_ti_2_w...
  - andybak 9y ago
    > Then just simplify the game's 3D scenes? I'm sure everyone will be happy with that compromise. After all graphical fidelity is very low on the average gamer's list of priorities /s Also - 50fps is not regarded as acceptable for VR. Oculus sets 90fps as the lowest framerate to avoid VR sickness.
T-A 9y ago
You need a lot of GPU to produce two different images at 90 FPS. If 60 FPS look OK to you on a normal monitor, multiply by 2 for the stereoscopic vision and by 1.5 for the higher frame rate, for a total factor 3. That's how much more powerful your GPU needs to be in order to handle the same scene in VR, at the same load level. At this time, very few people have (or would be willing to buy) systems that powerful.
- maturz 9y ago
  There are ways around that like up-scaling a lower resolution or if you add eye-tracking you can do foveated rendering (only render what you focus on with high resolution).

Why is the resolution still so low? Why not even 4K combined?

by devit 9y ago

Why is the resolution still so low? Why not even 4K combined?

andybak 9y ago

Because GPUs are struggling with many titles even at current resolutions.

moron4hire 9y ago
A lower resolution image would still look better upscaled on a higher resolution display because it would reduce the screen-door effect. Plus, it would help future-proof the device a little bit. But that might be the problem, they don't have to have too large of jumps between iterations so they have more launch events and sell more devices.
devit 9y ago
Then just simplify the game's 3D scenes? Also, this seems an inaccurate claim: e.g. a single $449 GTX 1070 Ti can do at least 50fps at 4K maximum quality in all tested games in https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070-ti-founders-edition-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-... This means that for 1000$ a dual 1070 Ti workstation should be able to do 4K 120hz just fine in all games, perhaps slightly lowering presets on GTA V. Of course this being cutting edge graphics a quad GPU setup is more reasonable which would allow 4K per eye at 120hz max quality, possibly even more with tweaked settings.
- Strom 9y ago
  > 1070 Ti can do at least 50fps at 4K maximum quality in all tested games [1] Looking at the data in the link you provided, this does not seem to be the case. 26.3 @ Deus Ex: Mankind Divided 34.3 @ Grand Theft Auto V 36.8 @ Ghost Recon Wildlands 42.5 @ Dawn of War III 44.0 @ Total War: Warhammer 53.3 @ Battlefield 1 56.0 @ F1 2016 56.9 @ Ashes of the Singularity 63.9 @ DOOM The tested 9 games result in a median of 44.0 fps, average of 46.0 fps. Certainly well below at least 50fps. > a dual 1070 Ti workstation should be able to do 4K 120hz just fine As someone with experience running tri-crossfire in the past, a 2.4x improvement claim from SLI seems suspect. Let's look at some data of what actually happens with 1070 Ti SLI. [2] 1.39x @ Middle-Earth: Shadow of War 1.66x @ Ghost Recon Wildlands 1.67x @ Deus Ex: Mankind Divided 1.73x @ Battlefield 1 1.86x @ Destiny 2 1.90x @ Grand Theft Auto V 1.91x @ Rise Of The Tomb Raider 1.95x @ Sniper Elite 4 The tested 8 games result in a median of 1.80x fps, average of 1.76x fps. Definitely less than 2.4x. > a quad GPU setup is more reasonable Unfortunately the scaling factor plummets fast after the 2nd card. Three or four cards usually means you're well in the realm of diminishing returns. What's more, SLI/CrossFire have frame pacing issues. The resulting microstutter is annoying on a regular screen, but even more harmful in VR. Then there's also the problem that some rendering techniques are not compatible with SLI/CrossFire, and thus some games are not. GPU driver support actually adding SLI/CrossFire support comes several months after the release of the game as standard practice. To make matters worse, everything GPU related is just the beginning of one's problems when it comes to really high frame rates. Computing animations, physics, game rule logic at 120Hz+ also demands real good CPU and RAM. A good widely deployed example of this is the Xbox One X. Although it has a powerful GPU it still delivers frame rates as low as 10 in CPU-heavy games like PUBG. Most games have to target 30, and 60 is available only to a select few. -- [1] https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070-ti-founders-edition-review/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/11987/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-... [2] http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1070_ti_2_way_sli_review,20.html http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_1070_ti_2_w...
- andybak 9y ago
  > Then just simplify the game's 3D scenes? I'm sure everyone will be happy with that compromise. After all graphical fidelity is very low on the average gamer's list of priorities /s Also - 50fps is not regarded as acceptable for VR. Oculus sets 90fps as the lowest framerate to avoid VR sickness.

T-A 9y ago

You need a lot of GPU to produce two different images at 90 FPS. If 60 FPS look OK to you on a normal monitor, multiply by 2 for the stereoscopic vision and by 1.5 for the higher frame rate, for a total factor 3. That's how much more powerful your GPU needs to be in order to handle the same scene in VR, at the same load level. At this time, very few people have (or would be willing to buy) systems that powerful.

maturz 9y ago
There are ways around that like up-scaling a lower resolution or if you add eye-tracking you can do foveated rendering (only render what you focus on with high resolution).