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Maybe a sign of issues in the field is that people hiring undervalue interpersonal skills/relationships and what it means to be "capable," which I do think is a

Maybe a sign of issues in the field is that people hiring undervalue interpersonal skills/relationships and what it means to be "capable," which I do think is a flaw in Damore's original memo.

winston_smith 9y ago
Been a while since I read it, but I believe he actually advocated for that. First he tried to establish that the sexes have some differences, then said we should see if we can make the workplace culture less biased toward the male-friendly characteristics.
Idontknowmyuser 9y ago
that was actually a point in his memo. "Women on average show a higher interest in people and men in things ○ We can make software engineering more people-oriented with pair programming and more collaboration. Unfortunately, there may be limits to how people-oriented certain roles at Google can be and we shouldn't deceive ourselves or students into thinking otherwise (some of our programs to get female students into coding might be doing this). ● Women on average are more cooperative ○ Allow those exhibiting cooperative behavior to thrive. Recent updates to Perf may be doing this to an extent, but maybe there's more we can do. ○ This doesn't mean that we should remove all competitiveness from Google. Competitiveness and self reliance can be valuable traits and we shouldn't necessarily disadvantage those that have them, like what's been done in education."
- elicash 9y ago
  > We can make software engineering more people-oriented with pair programming and more collaboration This is different than my point. I'm saying that software engineering IS people-oriented as it exists and that it's simply undervalued. > Unfortunately, there may be limits to how people-oriented certain roles at Google can be What roles at Google shouldn't be people-oriented? This just strikes me as an absurd thing to say.
  - Idontknowmyuser 9y ago
    a limit to how hot something can get get, doesn't imply that something shouldn't be hot.

Maybe a sign of issues in the field is that people hiring undervalue interpersonal skills/relationships and what it means to be "capable," which I do think is a flaw in Damore's original memo.

winston_smith 9y ago

Been a while since I read it, but I believe he actually advocated for that. First he tried to establish that the sexes have some differences, then said we should see if we can make the workplace culture less biased toward the male-friendly characteristics.

Idontknowmyuser 9y ago

that was actually a point in his memo. "Women on average show a higher interest in people and men in things ○ We can make software engineering more people-oriented with pair programming and more collaboration. Unfortunately, there may be limits to how people-oriented certain roles at Google can be and we shouldn't deceive ourselves or students into thinking otherwise (some of our programs to get female students into coding might be doing this). ● Women on average are more cooperative ○ Allow those exhibiting cooperative behavior to thrive. Recent updates to Perf may be doing this to an extent, but maybe there's more we can do. ○ This doesn't mean that we should remove all competitiveness from Google. Competitiveness and self reliance can be valuable traits and we shouldn't necessarily disadvantage those that have them, like what's been done in education."

elicash 9y ago
> We can make software engineering more people-oriented with pair programming and more collaboration This is different than my point. I'm saying that software engineering IS people-oriented as it exists and that it's simply undervalued. > Unfortunately, there may be limits to how people-oriented certain roles at Google can be What roles at Google shouldn't be people-oriented? This just strikes me as an absurd thing to say.
- Idontknowmyuser 9y ago
  a limit to how hot something can get get, doesn't imply that something shouldn't be hot.