4 ms·

Does anyone know if the IBM AS/400 architecture is affected? Edit: I'm referring to the System/38 architecture that used capability-based addressing.

skissane 9y ago
The AS/400 nowadays is called "IBM i". The note says IBM i is affected: "AIX and i operating system patches will start to become available February 12". Since the mid-1990s it has run on POWER so if POWER is affected it obviously would be too.
- dfox 9y ago
  Another question is whether it is actually exploitable from OS/i userspace.
  - skissane 9y ago
    Well, if you consider PASE lets you run AIX binaries, if it is exploitable on AIX the same exploit would probably work on IBM i. (PASE only supports a subset of AIX system calls though.) Also, if it is exploitable from Java, nowadays the IBM i JVM is J9, almost the same as AIX. (This used to be different – the "Classic JVM" was integrated into the TIMI infrastructure, so quite different from JVMs on other platforms.)
    - carey 9y ago
      I'm more interested in the non-PASE (more accurately, non-Teraspace) situation. The single level store maps every program into the same address space. Will POWER speculatively access another user's data before it discovers that the pointer is invalid or the array index is out of range?
      - justincormack 9y ago
        Yes, it is an interesting case, I hope we get more detail than this paper soon.
- puzzle 9y ago
  Yeah, they replaced their custom CISC with a POWER + a bunch of extra instructions + a special processor mode + RAM with extra bits.
- sllabres 9y ago
  I dont find something mentioning Spectre or Meltdown in the original blog post fom IBM, but POWER 6 (2007) is most probably not affected by Metdown as it is an in-order architecture.
Fnoord 9y ago
Its called IBM System i nowadays, and hasn't been called AS/400 since 2000 [1]. FTA: "We will provide further communication on supported generations prior to POWER7+, including firmware patches and availability." POWER7+ is used in since 2012. They all seem to be based on POWER architecture these days (first devices using PowerPC/POWER3 in 1997). Also of note, the firmware patches will be available on jan 9 but they also require OS patches. The Linux patches will be available on jan 9 and the AIX patches arrive on feb 12. They don't mention IBM i (OS/400) at all. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_System_i https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_System_i
- scdlbx 9y ago
  Not sure if the content changed, but the article currently states: "AIX and i operating system patches will start to become available February 12."
  - Fnoord 9y ago
    My bad, thanks for the correction. Probably I misread.

skissane 9y ago

The AS/400 nowadays is called "IBM i". The note says IBM i is affected: "AIX and i operating system patches will start to become available February 12". Since the mid-1990s it has run on POWER so if POWER is affected it obviously would be too.

dfox 9y ago
Another question is whether it is actually exploitable from OS/i userspace.
- skissane 9y ago
  Well, if you consider PASE lets you run AIX binaries, if it is exploitable on AIX the same exploit would probably work on IBM i. (PASE only supports a subset of AIX system calls though.) Also, if it is exploitable from Java, nowadays the IBM i JVM is J9, almost the same as AIX. (This used to be different – the "Classic JVM" was integrated into the TIMI infrastructure, so quite different from JVMs on other platforms.)
  - carey 9y ago
    I'm more interested in the non-PASE (more accurately, non-Teraspace) situation. The single level store maps every program into the same address space. Will POWER speculatively access another user's data before it discovers that the pointer is invalid or the array index is out of range?
    - justincormack 9y ago
      Yes, it is an interesting case, I hope we get more detail than this paper soon.
puzzle 9y ago
Yeah, they replaced their custom CISC with a POWER + a bunch of extra instructions + a special processor mode + RAM with extra bits.
sllabres 9y ago
I dont find something mentioning Spectre or Meltdown in the original blog post fom IBM, but POWER 6 (2007) is most probably not affected by Metdown as it is an in-order architecture.

Fnoord 9y ago

Its called IBM System i nowadays, and hasn't been called AS/400 since 2000 [1]. FTA: "We will provide further communication on supported generations prior to POWER7+, including firmware patches and availability." POWER7+ is used in since 2012. They all seem to be based on POWER architecture these days (first devices using PowerPC/POWER3 in 1997). Also of note, the firmware patches will be available on jan 9 but they also require OS patches. The Linux patches will be available on jan 9 and the AIX patches arrive on feb 12. They don't mention IBM i (OS/400) at all. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_System_i https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_System_i

scdlbx 9y ago
Not sure if the content changed, but the article currently states: "AIX and i operating system patches will start to become available February 12."
- Fnoord 9y ago
  My bad, thanks for the correction. Probably I misread.