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I have read about the caste system and issue in India. I have lot of Indian friends in US, but I never feel that there is any caste system among them. Is that j

I have read about the caste system and issue in India. I have lot of Indian friends in US, but I never feel that there is any caste system among them. Is that just my experience (maybe my ignorance)?

known 9y ago
Nepotism also runs strong in India. Nearly 85% of the country’s businesses are family-run, and Bollywood is dominated by just a few families. Even job-seekers with impressive resumes have to fall back on personal connections to find work http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/12/world/asia/12iht-letter12.html http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/12/world/asia/12iht-letter12....
thrwyindian7898 9y ago
Indian-American born and brought up in the States. We never discussed caste. It was a non-issue. Prime Minister Modi is also Low Caste. That didn't stop him from being elected.
- walshemj 9y ago
  Having said that caste discrimination is a problem in the UK in fact I know one of the MP's that helped add caste discrimination to the Equality Act 2010. Of course this is being opposed by "community leaders". Interesting a woman from my home town was recently abused for being low caste. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38663143 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38663143 It would be interesting to beak down H1B's by caste
  - known 9y ago
    https://www.petition2congress.com/ctas/anti-caste-discrimination-legislation https://www.petition2congress.com/ctas/anti-caste-discrimina...
    - walshemj 9y ago
      Interesting ill have to send that to Parmjit - doesn't seem to have got any messages sent yet unfortunately.
- palmanis 9y ago
  That does not stop him for leveraging it for his political gains either.
lotsofpulp 9y ago
I doubt Indians in the US, especially the ones who grew up here would be participating in any type of caste "system", but people in the lower or lowest castes wouldn't be in the US in the first place due to lack of resources. It's more about your education level and how useful you are than who your ancestors were, but that is many times intertwined. Edit: India, like most places, is in the middle of re-drawing it's caste system along socioeconomic lines. Of course, the lower castes will still be on the bottom and possibly discriminated against due to being behind on resources being passed down to them.
- saagarjha 9y ago
  > but people in the lower or lowest castes wouldn't be in the US in the first place due to lack of resources While Indians in the US tend toward the upper castes, it's not true that there aren't any people in the US of lower caste as well. Even in India the disparity between the castes is narrowing as affirmative action and modernization render such differences moot–as such, it isn't really true that people of lower cast have a "lack of resources", so there are people that are able to come over.
  - lotsofpulp 9y ago
    It all depends how you define lower castes. I’m not talking about farmer vs merchant vs priest, but about the castes that are toiling in the farms and untouchables or others who can’t even read, surely they are considered to have a lack of resources.
harigov 9y ago
Most modern Indians don't have such a strong affinity to their caste but it still plays a role in their lives. Indians who moved to the US don't usually group based on their caste but in India it is still the case, especially in rural areas. Politics in India are divided along caste lines and you see all sorts of things like these, which are usually politically motivated. I can't comment on whether this particular incident is politically motivated as well.
danans 9y ago
Selection bias, because of the cultural, educational, and or financial resources required to come to the US, they are far more likely to come from the mid to upper echelons of the social structure in India. They are also more likely to be upper socioeconomic class in the US, so less incentive to act on caste identity. Most of the violent aspects of caste discrimination occur at lower socioeconomic levels, where the intensity of the tribalism is exacerbated by poverty. However, many middle class Indians in the US still follow traditional caste rules in aspects of their personal lives, particularly in marriage, and sometimes in other social associations. There is also some selection bias among many Indian immigrants towards egalitarianism, leaving behind stifling aspects of the old culture. The horrible acts of discrimination described in the article are a product of both the Indian social structure and the local communal conflicts.
- jxramos 9y ago
  One of my former supervisors informed me to this reality. He laments having to travel through Singapore because the experience of an Indian over there is more troubling as he is in the minority being well todo and educated while the bulk of Indians in Singapore are lower class/uneducated and treated differently. He said something to that extent, and I realized that yes the ones who managed to make the big trip here had in fact passed through a filtering process, while more local regions about India can receive those with lesser means and do.
  - danans 9y ago
    Another angle to consider is that well to do Indian immigrants in the US, while less likely to follow the traditional codified restrictions of caste, are quite likely to engage in their adoptive societies' own (often unspoken) rules around class. Hence, in places like the US, Indians are more likely to have professional spouses, whether those spouses are Indian or not.
pvelagal 9y ago
Practice of caste system is negligent among the educated, especially folks who come to US and in Indian metros (millions live) and most of the towns. It is still followed to some extent in 'redneck' villages in interior parts of India where one knows the other by name and caste. As far as entry into temples, all major hindu temples dont follow it or just dont care. Millions visit these temples each day. But, most of the incidents of late are more politically motivated than caste related. Current PM Modi himself is of lower caste. Also India and Hinduism is not uniform. Lower castes (designated as shudra in caste heirarchy) are called upper castes in south and hold political power. Its complicated.
- defo_nonconvex 9y ago
  Mmm I don't know, I've met some educated and/or wealthy 1st and 2nd gen Indian immigrants who get pretty hoity-toity about being a brahmin.
  - pvelagal 9y ago
    As they are immigrants, I wonder what they think about white supremacists / neo-nazis ?
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
nonamechicken 9y ago
Indian who was born and grew up there. Caste was never a thing outside of arranged marriages. The only time I hear about it is from news when there were protests from certain castes recently demanding reservation or from places like reddit and hn where someone would post about casteism in India.
- ap3 9y ago
  What is your (parents) caste ? Is it offensive to ask this about indians in the US?
  - vijay_nair 9y ago
    Another Hindu Nair here; it’s not offensive to ask, only discriminate. Nair is actually included in my name so you get the caste info just by getting my name.
  - nonamechicken 9y ago
    I am a Hindu Nair (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nair). There is also a sub caste-I don't know which one it is. Both my parents are Nairs, but belonging to different sub castes I think. As for offensiveness, I don't remember anybody asking me about my caste (outside of govt forms-they need it for job/educational reservations) except once. He (an Indian from my state) didn't ask me my caste, he heard my name and immediately said "oh you are a Nair" and I felt really weird and wanted to end the conversation quickly. If a foreigner asks me, I don't think I would mind. I am not sure if I would be comfortable if an Indian asks me though.
  - fellellor 9y ago
    I feel it's offensive. But a foreigner may do so out of curiosity and ignorance so I can't be angry about it.
bobosha 9y ago
Interestingly, caste in India is a lot like race in America - becoming less of an issue with each passing generation. There are occasional flare-ups especially in the impoverished regions.
- known 9y ago
  Casteism = Racism + Slavery

I have read about the caste system and issue in India. I have lot of Indian friends in US, but I never feel that there is any caste system among them. Is that just my experience (maybe my ignorance)?

known 9y ago

Nepotism also runs strong in India. Nearly 85% of the country’s businesses are family-run, and Bollywood is dominated by just a few families. Even job-seekers with impressive resumes have to fall back on personal connections to find work http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/12/world/asia/12iht-letter12.html http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/12/world/asia/12iht-letter12....

thrwyindian7898 9y ago

Indian-American born and brought up in the States. We never discussed caste. It was a non-issue. Prime Minister Modi is also Low Caste. That didn't stop him from being elected.

walshemj 9y ago
Having said that caste discrimination is a problem in the UK in fact I know one of the MP's that helped add caste discrimination to the Equality Act 2010. Of course this is being opposed by "community leaders". Interesting a woman from my home town was recently abused for being low caste. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38663143 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38663143 It would be interesting to beak down H1B's by caste
- known 9y ago
  https://www.petition2congress.com/ctas/anti-caste-discrimination-legislation https://www.petition2congress.com/ctas/anti-caste-discrimina...
  - walshemj 9y ago
    Interesting ill have to send that to Parmjit - doesn't seem to have got any messages sent yet unfortunately.
palmanis 9y ago
That does not stop him for leveraging it for his political gains either.

lotsofpulp 9y ago

I doubt Indians in the US, especially the ones who grew up here would be participating in any type of caste "system", but people in the lower or lowest castes wouldn't be in the US in the first place due to lack of resources. It's more about your education level and how useful you are than who your ancestors were, but that is many times intertwined. Edit: India, like most places, is in the middle of re-drawing it's caste system along socioeconomic lines. Of course, the lower castes will still be on the bottom and possibly discriminated against due to being behind on resources being passed down to them.

saagarjha 9y ago
> but people in the lower or lowest castes wouldn't be in the US in the first place due to lack of resources While Indians in the US tend toward the upper castes, it's not true that there aren't any people in the US of lower caste as well. Even in India the disparity between the castes is narrowing as affirmative action and modernization render such differences moot–as such, it isn't really true that people of lower cast have a "lack of resources", so there are people that are able to come over.
- lotsofpulp 9y ago
  It all depends how you define lower castes. I’m not talking about farmer vs merchant vs priest, but about the castes that are toiling in the farms and untouchables or others who can’t even read, surely they are considered to have a lack of resources.

harigov 9y ago

Most modern Indians don't have such a strong affinity to their caste but it still plays a role in their lives. Indians who moved to the US don't usually group based on their caste but in India it is still the case, especially in rural areas. Politics in India are divided along caste lines and you see all sorts of things like these, which are usually politically motivated. I can't comment on whether this particular incident is politically motivated as well.

danans 9y ago

Selection bias, because of the cultural, educational, and or financial resources required to come to the US, they are far more likely to come from the mid to upper echelons of the social structure in India. They are also more likely to be upper socioeconomic class in the US, so less incentive to act on caste identity. Most of the violent aspects of caste discrimination occur at lower socioeconomic levels, where the intensity of the tribalism is exacerbated by poverty. However, many middle class Indians in the US still follow traditional caste rules in aspects of their personal lives, particularly in marriage, and sometimes in other social associations. There is also some selection bias among many Indian immigrants towards egalitarianism, leaving behind stifling aspects of the old culture. The horrible acts of discrimination described in the article are a product of both the Indian social structure and the local communal conflicts.

jxramos 9y ago
One of my former supervisors informed me to this reality. He laments having to travel through Singapore because the experience of an Indian over there is more troubling as he is in the minority being well todo and educated while the bulk of Indians in Singapore are lower class/uneducated and treated differently. He said something to that extent, and I realized that yes the ones who managed to make the big trip here had in fact passed through a filtering process, while more local regions about India can receive those with lesser means and do.
- danans 9y ago
  Another angle to consider is that well to do Indian immigrants in the US, while less likely to follow the traditional codified restrictions of caste, are quite likely to engage in their adoptive societies' own (often unspoken) rules around class. Hence, in places like the US, Indians are more likely to have professional spouses, whether those spouses are Indian or not.

pvelagal 9y ago

Practice of caste system is negligent among the educated, especially folks who come to US and in Indian metros (millions live) and most of the towns. It is still followed to some extent in 'redneck' villages in interior parts of India where one knows the other by name and caste. As far as entry into temples, all major hindu temples dont follow it or just dont care. Millions visit these temples each day. But, most of the incidents of late are more politically motivated than caste related. Current PM Modi himself is of lower caste. Also India and Hinduism is not uniform. Lower castes (designated as shudra in caste heirarchy) are called upper castes in south and hold political power. Its complicated.

defo_nonconvex 9y ago
Mmm I don't know, I've met some educated and/or wealthy 1st and 2nd gen Indian immigrants who get pretty hoity-toity about being a brahmin.
- pvelagal 9y ago
  As they are immigrants, I wonder what they think about white supremacists / neo-nazis ?

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

nonamechicken 9y ago

Indian who was born and grew up there. Caste was never a thing outside of arranged marriages. The only time I hear about it is from news when there were protests from certain castes recently demanding reservation or from places like reddit and hn where someone would post about casteism in India.

ap3 9y ago
What is your (parents) caste ? Is it offensive to ask this about indians in the US?
- vijay_nair 9y ago
  Another Hindu Nair here; it’s not offensive to ask, only discriminate. Nair is actually included in my name so you get the caste info just by getting my name.
- nonamechicken 9y ago
  I am a Hindu Nair (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nair). There is also a sub caste-I don't know which one it is. Both my parents are Nairs, but belonging to different sub castes I think. As for offensiveness, I don't remember anybody asking me about my caste (outside of govt forms-they need it for job/educational reservations) except once. He (an Indian from my state) didn't ask me my caste, he heard my name and immediately said "oh you are a Nair" and I felt really weird and wanted to end the conversation quickly. If a foreigner asks me, I don't think I would mind. I am not sure if I would be comfortable if an Indian asks me though.
- fellellor 9y ago
  I feel it's offensive. But a foreigner may do so out of curiosity and ignorance so I can't be angry about it.

bobosha 9y ago

Interestingly, caste in India is a lot like race in America - becoming less of an issue with each passing generation. There are occasional flare-ups especially in the impoverished regions.

known 9y ago
Casteism = Racism + Slavery