4 ms·

But the opposite view could just as easily be used as a justification: I.e. "We're just animals, no different from any other. So anything we do is a part of nat

But the opposite view could just as easily be used as a justification: I.e. "We're just animals, no different from any other. So anything we do is a part of nature, and we shouldn't second guess it, any more than any other animal would second guess its instincts." I think we need to recognise that we are, at least, unique. And that we have a unique ability to affect the world, for good or ill, that sets us apart from other animals. That shouldn't be an excuse for hubris, but it should be reflected in how we view ourselves as a species.

padobson 9y ago
But the opposite view could just as easily be used as a justification Agreed. Human animals will always find pseudo-rational reasons to do nefarious things.
- dasil003 9y ago
  ...and to define things as nefarious.
  - ieatfood 9y ago
    That's the fruit of knowledge of good and evil, isn't it?
anigbrowl 9y ago
This argument is frequently deployed in numerous political contexts.
pygy_ 9y ago
I mostly agree with you, but I would frame things differently. We are animals, and everything we do is part of nature. Nature isn't either inherently good or evil, and natural processes can be self-destructive. And while we probably don't have qualitatively unique features we distinguish ourselves quantitatively on many axes, especially when it comes to storing and transmitting information and therefore influencing the rest of the world. We may be more powerful than other species, but I'm afraid that on the knowledge/wisdom scale, we're only good enough to be dangerous. Seeing ourselves as a part of nature is necessary to limit the damage we do.
crpatino 9y ago
What about, "We are just animals, and everything we do is part of nature. Just like other advanced animals, we have evolved means to shape our behavior beyond mere instict. Let's learn what those means are, so we can shape our own behavior purposefully". Surely that beats moralizing (which does not work) or harsh punishment (which barely works, and only in the most narrow sense).

padobson 9y ago

But the opposite view could just as easily be used as a justification Agreed. Human animals will always find pseudo-rational reasons to do nefarious things.

dasil003 9y ago
...and to define things as nefarious.
- ieatfood 9y ago
  That's the fruit of knowledge of good and evil, isn't it?

anigbrowl 9y ago

This argument is frequently deployed in numerous political contexts.

pygy_ 9y ago

I mostly agree with you, but I would frame things differently. We are animals, and everything we do is part of nature. Nature isn't either inherently good or evil, and natural processes can be self-destructive. And while we probably don't have qualitatively unique features we distinguish ourselves quantitatively on many axes, especially when it comes to storing and transmitting information and therefore influencing the rest of the world. We may be more powerful than other species, but I'm afraid that on the knowledge/wisdom scale, we're only good enough to be dangerous. Seeing ourselves as a part of nature is necessary to limit the damage we do.

crpatino 9y ago

What about, "We are just animals, and everything we do is part of nature. Just like other advanced animals, we have evolved means to shape our behavior beyond mere instict. Let's learn what those means are, so we can shape our own behavior purposefully". Surely that beats moralizing (which does not work) or harsh punishment (which barely works, and only in the most narrow sense).