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>Who voted for Kalanick? What gave him the right? You could say people voted with their wallets.

forapurpose 9y ago
> You could say people voted with their wallets. You could say it, but that's not how democracy or legitimate government and lawmaking works. And in Uber's case, the wallets voting are a few investors who subsidized the customers.
- Fricken 9y ago
  What makes a government legit? People support it. What makes Uber legit? People support it. Although I guess a government doesn't need the support of the people to maintain legitimacy, it just needs to be able to maintain a monopoly on violence. And if Uber had a monopoly on the taxi industry maybe it wouldn't need the people's support either.
  - 659087 9y ago
    It's not hard to gain support when you're selling dollars bills for half price.
  - forapurpose 9y ago
    > What makes a government legit? People support it. > What makes Uber legit? People support it. Really? Uber has the legitimacy of government? Wow.
- kamaal 9y ago
  For better or worse, thats how it should work. Failure of centrally planned economies all across the globe says something. Markets don't have elections and most politicians/bureaucrats don't exactly have the competency to decide what should be good for everyone. Letting people vote with their wallets has largely worked. Of course no system is perfect, but this is as fair as it gets.
  - crdoconnor 9y ago
    The centrally planned NHS achieves similar public health outcomes to the US for less than half of the cost. The excellent Cuban health system achieves the same for roughly 1/10th the cost. Which part of "double the price same product" counts largely "worked" and why do you want me to give up my cheaper system for yours?
    - whb07 9y ago
      Well, this isn’t my point of view but the US largely subsidizes the medicine and research for the rest of the world when it comes to health. Just look at the number of medical innovations year coming the rest of the world COMBINED vs the US. Clearly there’s some free riding happening by the rest. Furthermore, don’t ever say “excellent Cuban” anything. There’s a reason why people try to cross shark infested waters on dingy rafts from Cuba to Key West, Florida. People vote with their feet and wallets.
    - megaman22 9y ago
      We can discuss the efficiency of a market-based health care system when such a thing exists. The current system is as artificial and corrupted as the taxi medallion situation. If only I could walk into a health care facility and see the prices posted on the wall for various procedures, or get an estimate upfront, the way I can at any auto garage...
      - crdoconnor 9y ago
        No true scotsman...
  - forapurpose 9y ago
    > For better or worse, thats how it should work. Failure of centrally planned economies all across the globe says something. This issue has nothing to do with central planning. Free market theory does not support legal anarchy. It really should work that businesses can do whatever they want, irrespective of the law? Can they murder? Steal? Damage your property and life? It's absurd.
NotSammyHagar 9y ago
>>Who voted for Kalanick? What gave him the right? >You could say people voted with their wallets. Money should never overwhelm the will of the people. I say this even though I hated the way taxis used to work, with the artificial limitation, and I love a chance to take a much more convenient app based ride, I really despise how they got away with violating at least any standard of reasonable behavior, but also they were apparently violating the law literally - one example being paying the hackers not to hack and not telling anyone.
- krrrh 9y ago
  Everything you say is true, but the vested rent-seeking interests of the medallion holders that for years caused untold costs to people who needed transportation, and to the economy as a whole, was also despicable. Money was already overwhelming the will of everyone who couldn’t get a cab, who had to buy a car they didn’t want to own, and who had to put up with a higher percentage of drunk drivers. Just because it was that way for decades and few imagined it could be different, it didn’t make it right. It’s like the quote from the Chronicles of Riddick, “sometimes the only way to stop evil is not with good. You must confront it with another kind of evil”.
  - crdoconnor 9y ago
    I think Goldman Sachs took an Uber stake around the time it dumped it's medallions. So the identity of the rent seekers at the top hasn't even changed. But you use an app now... so, yay? I think anybody who takes a rent seekers' side over even the most despicable politician doesn't deserve to live in a Democracy.
    - rtx 9y ago
      As a rent seeker, democracy protects me.
      - crdoconnor 9y ago
        No, as a rent seeker donations to politicians and think tanks protect you. More democracy puts your rents at risk.
bildung 9y ago
> You could say people voted with their wallets. Problem is some wallets are empty and some are full, whereas in a democracy every vote has the same weight.

> You could say people voted with their wallets. You could say it, but that's not how democracy or legitimate government and lawmaking works. And in Uber's case, the wallets voting are a few investors who subsidized the customers.

Fricken 9y ago
What makes a government legit? People support it. What makes Uber legit? People support it. Although I guess a government doesn't need the support of the people to maintain legitimacy, it just needs to be able to maintain a monopoly on violence. And if Uber had a monopoly on the taxi industry maybe it wouldn't need the people's support either.
- 659087 9y ago
  It's not hard to gain support when you're selling dollars bills for half price.
- forapurpose 9y ago
  > What makes a government legit? People support it. > What makes Uber legit? People support it. Really? Uber has the legitimacy of government? Wow.
kamaal 9y ago
For better or worse, thats how it should work. Failure of centrally planned economies all across the globe says something. Markets don't have elections and most politicians/bureaucrats don't exactly have the competency to decide what should be good for everyone. Letting people vote with their wallets has largely worked. Of course no system is perfect, but this is as fair as it gets.
- crdoconnor 9y ago
  The centrally planned NHS achieves similar public health outcomes to the US for less than half of the cost. The excellent Cuban health system achieves the same for roughly 1/10th the cost. Which part of "double the price same product" counts largely "worked" and why do you want me to give up my cheaper system for yours?
  - whb07 9y ago
    Well, this isn’t my point of view but the US largely subsidizes the medicine and research for the rest of the world when it comes to health. Just look at the number of medical innovations year coming the rest of the world COMBINED vs the US. Clearly there’s some free riding happening by the rest. Furthermore, don’t ever say “excellent Cuban” anything. There’s a reason why people try to cross shark infested waters on dingy rafts from Cuba to Key West, Florida. People vote with their feet and wallets.
  - megaman22 9y ago
    We can discuss the efficiency of a market-based health care system when such a thing exists. The current system is as artificial and corrupted as the taxi medallion situation. If only I could walk into a health care facility and see the prices posted on the wall for various procedures, or get an estimate upfront, the way I can at any auto garage...
    - crdoconnor 9y ago
      No true scotsman...
- forapurpose 9y ago
  > For better or worse, thats how it should work. Failure of centrally planned economies all across the globe says something. This issue has nothing to do with central planning. Free market theory does not support legal anarchy. It really should work that businesses can do whatever they want, irrespective of the law? Can they murder? Steal? Damage your property and life? It's absurd.

NotSammyHagar 9y ago

>>Who voted for Kalanick? What gave him the right? >You could say people voted with their wallets. Money should never overwhelm the will of the people. I say this even though I hated the way taxis used to work, with the artificial limitation, and I love a chance to take a much more convenient app based ride, I really despise how they got away with violating at least any standard of reasonable behavior, but also they were apparently violating the law literally - one example being paying the hackers not to hack and not telling anyone.

krrrh 9y ago
Everything you say is true, but the vested rent-seeking interests of the medallion holders that for years caused untold costs to people who needed transportation, and to the economy as a whole, was also despicable. Money was already overwhelming the will of everyone who couldn’t get a cab, who had to buy a car they didn’t want to own, and who had to put up with a higher percentage of drunk drivers. Just because it was that way for decades and few imagined it could be different, it didn’t make it right. It’s like the quote from the Chronicles of Riddick, “sometimes the only way to stop evil is not with good. You must confront it with another kind of evil”.
- crdoconnor 9y ago
  I think Goldman Sachs took an Uber stake around the time it dumped it's medallions. So the identity of the rent seekers at the top hasn't even changed. But you use an app now... so, yay? I think anybody who takes a rent seekers' side over even the most despicable politician doesn't deserve to live in a Democracy.
  - rtx 9y ago
    As a rent seeker, democracy protects me.
    - crdoconnor 9y ago
      No, as a rent seeker donations to politicians and think tanks protect you. More democracy puts your rents at risk.

bildung 9y ago

> You could say people voted with their wallets. Problem is some wallets are empty and some are full, whereas in a democracy every vote has the same weight.