7 ms·

Here you have a 'counterdote' : I am 43. After the first year of high school ( I was 13 ), we were allowed to travel to the other side of the country by train,

Here you have a 'counterdote' : I am 43. After the first year of high school ( I was 13 ), we were allowed to travel to the other side of the country by train, sleep in a youth hostel and return at the end of the next day. This is NL, the other side of the country is only 350km. When we tell younger friends, they refuse to believe.

vasilipupkin 9y ago
ok, but NL has like zero crime, so it doesn't seem like a big deal
- the-dude 9y ago
  True, we have no police either.
  - harlanji 9y ago
    Lao Tzu sees a correlation. I'm 32, and my boundaries gradually increased from "the front yard, ask to go across the street" to "the street, ask to go around the block or park" etc. I lived in urban South Minneapolis, so not rough but not gentle... enough to build habitual awareness. We were a roving pack of 5+ kids at a given time, as many as 12 or so. I addicted myself to computer screens against my parents' wishes (they prefer TV), although if not for screens I'd probably do as my vice principal said and "flip [him] a good burger someday". There were ample police and one possible abduction attempt outside with my cousin while very young, sooo...
- vasilipupkin 9y ago
  why am I getting all these downvotes? clearly, it's much safer for a teenager to ride the train in the Netherlands from one end to the other, than to do a similar thing in Chicago, let's say. So, yeah, it's not that impressive.
  - vasilipupkin 9y ago
    so why more downvotes? can someone explain to me the logic of what exactly you are disagreeing with?
    - jjawssd 9y ago
      Don't take it personally. You won't get many warm replies from American city dwellers for pointing out the failures of their communities.
      - vasilipupkin 9y ago
        I don't. I just get annoyed when people simply downvote instead of commenting when I point out a fact that in the Netherlands it's safer to let a 13 year old ride the train than where I live.
      - thousandautumns 9y ago
        I think Americans are probably among the first to admit the issues with their communities, hence the increased trend in helicopter parenting.
neverminder 9y ago
Well, I was walking to school 3 km (2 miles) one way alone since I was 6 years old (Europe). Pretty sure today my parents would be thrown in jail or something for "child neglect" (or whatever the latest PC buzzword for that is). Times are changing, but I don't think it's for the better.
- geodel 9y ago
  Right, I guess underlying theme is to delay dealing with real world as much as possible. It seems to be happening everywhere.
- naugtur 9y ago
  Same story with me, starting at age 7, but in Poland. I crossed the biggest street in the 38k population town on my way. But I think parents were ok with it mostly because it was considered normal at the time and noone spent time pondering what could happen.
pavel_lishin 9y ago
America is a wholly different place. I was born in the mid-80s in Moscow, Russia, and moved to America when I was ten. Before I moved, I was regularly taking the subway, with transfers, to school - by myself. Here in America, I had a coworker a few years ago who literally would not let his double-digit-aged children cross the street to school by themselves. It's a weird fuckin' place.
- JustSomeNobody 9y ago
  I was born in '71. When I was 11 or 12 my friends and I could ride our bikes basically wherever we wanted to go. Our only rule was be home before the street lights turned on. The 80's happened which brought a few highly publicized child abductions/murders. Notably the Walsh child. His father scared every parent into becoming a helicopter parent. (Not judging, just saying). People really haven't loosened up much since. Every stranger is dangerous.
  - the-dude 9y ago
    Strangely enough, the movie E.T. comes to my mind. It is a movie of my 'era' and it depicted a loose (normal) parenting style. Of course it was fiction, but still.
    - JustSomeNobody 9y ago
      Not fiction for me[0]. This was pretty much us. We could go where ever. And yeah, my folks parenting style was a bit... loose. But I was never one to get into trouble really, so there was some trust built up there. [0] Except the alien thing.
    - bg4 9y ago
      Born in 1977. When in elementary school I would leave in morning, come home for lunch, come back for dinner, come back when getting dark. I would ride my bike all over the neighborhood, play in the creek, play in the woods, etc. Just like the kids in Stranger Things. If I let my elementary age children do that today the police would be called. My sister has had neighbors call because her kids were playing in their front yard. It's a 100% sad and ridiculous situation. We're raising an imprisoned generation who can't handle anything. How is staring at a glowing screen all day a childhood? EDIT: I suppose I should tone down my rhetoric but this really worries me.

vasilipupkin 9y ago

ok, but NL has like zero crime, so it doesn't seem like a big deal

the-dude 9y ago
True, we have no police either.
- harlanji 9y ago
  Lao Tzu sees a correlation. I'm 32, and my boundaries gradually increased from "the front yard, ask to go across the street" to "the street, ask to go around the block or park" etc. I lived in urban South Minneapolis, so not rough but not gentle... enough to build habitual awareness. We were a roving pack of 5+ kids at a given time, as many as 12 or so. I addicted myself to computer screens against my parents' wishes (they prefer TV), although if not for screens I'd probably do as my vice principal said and "flip [him] a good burger someday". There were ample police and one possible abduction attempt outside with my cousin while very young, sooo...
vasilipupkin 9y ago
why am I getting all these downvotes? clearly, it's much safer for a teenager to ride the train in the Netherlands from one end to the other, than to do a similar thing in Chicago, let's say. So, yeah, it's not that impressive.
- vasilipupkin 9y ago
  so why more downvotes? can someone explain to me the logic of what exactly you are disagreeing with?
  - jjawssd 9y ago
    Don't take it personally. You won't get many warm replies from American city dwellers for pointing out the failures of their communities.
    - vasilipupkin 9y ago
      I don't. I just get annoyed when people simply downvote instead of commenting when I point out a fact that in the Netherlands it's safer to let a 13 year old ride the train than where I live.
    - thousandautumns 9y ago
      I think Americans are probably among the first to admit the issues with their communities, hence the increased trend in helicopter parenting.

neverminder 9y ago

Well, I was walking to school 3 km (2 miles) one way alone since I was 6 years old (Europe). Pretty sure today my parents would be thrown in jail or something for "child neglect" (or whatever the latest PC buzzword for that is). Times are changing, but I don't think it's for the better.

geodel 9y ago
Right, I guess underlying theme is to delay dealing with real world as much as possible. It seems to be happening everywhere.
naugtur 9y ago
Same story with me, starting at age 7, but in Poland. I crossed the biggest street in the 38k population town on my way. But I think parents were ok with it mostly because it was considered normal at the time and noone spent time pondering what could happen.

pavel_lishin 9y ago

America is a wholly different place. I was born in the mid-80s in Moscow, Russia, and moved to America when I was ten. Before I moved, I was regularly taking the subway, with transfers, to school - by myself. Here in America, I had a coworker a few years ago who literally would not let his double-digit-aged children cross the street to school by themselves. It's a weird fuckin' place.

JustSomeNobody 9y ago
I was born in '71. When I was 11 or 12 my friends and I could ride our bikes basically wherever we wanted to go. Our only rule was be home before the street lights turned on. The 80's happened which brought a few highly publicized child abductions/murders. Notably the Walsh child. His father scared every parent into becoming a helicopter parent. (Not judging, just saying). People really haven't loosened up much since. Every stranger is dangerous.
- the-dude 9y ago
  Strangely enough, the movie E.T. comes to my mind. It is a movie of my 'era' and it depicted a loose (normal) parenting style. Of course it was fiction, but still.
  - JustSomeNobody 9y ago
    Not fiction for me[0]. This was pretty much us. We could go where ever. And yeah, my folks parenting style was a bit... loose. But I was never one to get into trouble really, so there was some trust built up there. [0] Except the alien thing.
  - bg4 9y ago
    Born in 1977. When in elementary school I would leave in morning, come home for lunch, come back for dinner, come back when getting dark. I would ride my bike all over the neighborhood, play in the creek, play in the woods, etc. Just like the kids in Stranger Things. If I let my elementary age children do that today the police would be called. My sister has had neighbors call because her kids were playing in their front yard. It's a 100% sad and ridiculous situation. We're raising an imprisoned generation who can't handle anything. How is staring at a glowing screen all day a childhood? EDIT: I suppose I should tone down my rhetoric but this really worries me.