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Can anybody cite prior art on the notion that corporations are paperclip maximizes? It's not really a profound idea, I don't think, but the notion came to me ab

Can anybody cite prior art on the notion that corporations are paperclip maximizes? It's not really a profound idea, I don't think, but the notion came to me about a month ago, and shortly after SciFi author Ted Chiang[1] said the same thing on BuzzFeed, and here's Charlie Stross saying it. Is this an example of simultaneous invention, or has it been kicking around for a while, and I just haven't noticed? [1]https://www.buzzfeed.com/tedchiang/the-real-danger-to-civilization-isnt-ai-its-runaway?utm_term=.ie2Dm2ORv#.do2VP2pAz https://www.buzzfeed.com/tedchiang/the-real-danger-to-civili...

3pt14159 9y ago
It's funny, I also thought of it mere seconds before reading it in this article. I have this bad habit of scrolling to the middle of a document before reading it to see if the first half is even worth reading (if I'm confused, then yes it is) and when he mentioned "paperclip maximizers" without context to capitalism my first thought was to tie it to corporations. It's so obvious now that I'm embarrassed I didn't think of it first.
mortenjorck 9y ago
The earliest I can recall being exposed to the concept was this 2013 blog article: http://omniorthogonal.blogspot.com/2013/02/hostile-ai-youre-soaking-in-it.html http://omniorthogonal.blogspot.com/2013/02/hostile-ai-youre-...
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reidacdc 9y ago
There's a related idea in a movie made in 2003, called "The Corporation". The movie is pretty strongly anti-corporate, and the main point of it is that, in their role as actors in the legal system, "legal persons", corporations are deeply sociopathic, and perhaps ought not to be tolerated, or at least should be more regulated. It's been a while since I saw it, but I think a few AI-like features are mentioned, even if the corporations-as-AIs idea is not spelled out. Their lifespan, in particular, I recall coming up. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation_(film) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation_(film) Edit: Removed markdown formatting.
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hug 9y ago
I feel like this is a sentiment that should be fairly familiar to you if you have read Stross' previous works. There are points in Accelerando (2005) where semisentient AI corporations are a threat to the protagonist, along with things like automatic legal-system denial-of-service attacks on other corporations. If you haven't read it, you should. It is here.: http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/fiction/accelerando/accelerando.html http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/fiction/accelera...
maxerickson 9y ago
Stross has articulated the general concept before: http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2010/12/invaders-from-mars.html http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2010/12/invaders... (which I can find because of my 2 year old comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11488412 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11488412 )
abecedarius 9y ago
Organizations-as-AIs (both corporations and governments) was brought up in Engines of Creation in the mid-80s. I suppose Drexler got the idea from the MIT AI culture (I don't remember anything specific about corporations, but there was e.g. Hewitt & someone else's "The Scientific Community Metaphor") and Hayek.

3pt14159 9y ago

It's funny, I also thought of it mere seconds before reading it in this article. I have this bad habit of scrolling to the middle of a document before reading it to see if the first half is even worth reading (if I'm confused, then yes it is) and when he mentioned "paperclip maximizers" without context to capitalism my first thought was to tie it to corporations. It's so obvious now that I'm embarrassed I didn't think of it first.

mortenjorck 9y ago

The earliest I can recall being exposed to the concept was this 2013 blog article: http://omniorthogonal.blogspot.com/2013/02/hostile-ai-youre-soaking-in-it.html http://omniorthogonal.blogspot.com/2013/02/hostile-ai-youre-...

deleted 9y ago

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reidacdc 9y ago

There's a related idea in a movie made in 2003, called "The Corporation". The movie is pretty strongly anti-corporate, and the main point of it is that, in their role as actors in the legal system, "legal persons", corporations are deeply sociopathic, and perhaps ought not to be tolerated, or at least should be more regulated. It's been a while since I saw it, but I think a few AI-like features are mentioned, even if the corporations-as-AIs idea is not spelled out. Their lifespan, in particular, I recall coming up. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation_(film) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation_(film) Edit: Removed markdown formatting.

deleted 9y ago

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hug 9y ago

I feel like this is a sentiment that should be fairly familiar to you if you have read Stross' previous works. There are points in Accelerando (2005) where semisentient AI corporations are a threat to the protagonist, along with things like automatic legal-system denial-of-service attacks on other corporations. If you haven't read it, you should. It is here.: http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/fiction/accelerando/accelerando.html http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/fiction/accelera...

maxerickson 9y ago

Stross has articulated the general concept before: http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2010/12/invaders-from-mars.html http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2010/12/invaders... (which I can find because of my 2 year old comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11488412 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11488412 )

abecedarius 9y ago

Organizations-as-AIs (both corporations and governments) was brought up in Engines of Creation in the mid-80s. I suppose Drexler got the idea from the MIT AI culture (I don't remember anything specific about corporations, but there was e.g. Hewitt & someone else's "The Scientific Community Metaphor") and Hayek.