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> we’re optimistic about what’s next. Well... what's next for me is rewriting this application in the next 30 days. Not feeling too "optimistic" there about t

> we’re optimistic about what’s next. Well... what's next for me is rewriting this application in the next 30 days. Not feeling too "optimistic" there about that.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
aw3c2 9y ago
Which API(s) do you rely on? Are you sure that self-hosting them is not an option?
- freyfogle 9y ago
  I can't speak for the commenter above, but as someone who runs a paid service built on open geodata I can tell you our best customers are those who first try to self host and then realize what a pain that is. The challenge is not just keeping the software up to date, but that you also need to keep the data fresh. How fresh of course depends on your exact use case, of course, but for perspective OpenStreetMap has 3-4 million edits per day. It's totally doable - and is technically very interesting, but in much the same way that fixing your own car or baking your own bread is doable and fun. It's more cost-effective to hand it off to a reliable expert. Building/installing is (relatively) easy. Maintaining is hard.
  - MattBlissett 9y ago
    Even without a requirement to stay particularly up to date, the size of the datasets makes working with OpenStreetMap reasonably complicated. I needed tiles in non-web-standard projections: equirectangular and polar (EPSG:4326, 3575 and 3031). ESRI used to provide equirectangular tiles[0], but have deprecated the service. Polarmap have an Arctic map, but only at standard resolution [1]. I couldn't find an Antarctic map. With a fair amount of fiddling, and building on the work OpenMapTiles.org have done, it was possible to generate the tiles, but I now realise why few people have attempted this: it requires a lot of processing power, technical ability to get everything working properly, and cartography to have a map that looks good (not just the final styling, but the choice of what data is present in each layer of vector tiles). I met the minimum of what we needed [2], but I need to find more time to do the rest -- like contours. [0] http://server.arcgisonline.com/arcgis/rest/services/ESRI_StreetMap_World_2D/MapServer?f=jsapi http://server.arcgisonline.com/arcgis/rest/services/ESRI_Str... [1] https://webmap.arcticconnect.org/polarmap.js/examples/PolarMap/quick-start/ https://webmap.arcticconnect.org/polarmap.js/examples/PolarM... [2a] Small demo: https://api.gbif.org/v2/map/demo7.html https://api.gbif.org/v2/map/demo7.html (shows northern fulmar seabirds) [2b] An overview of the tiles: https://tile.gbif.org/ui/ https://tile.gbif.org/ui/ [2c] In production https://www.gbif.org/species/2481433 https://www.gbif.org/species/2481433 (click to change the projection)
- gopi_ar 9y ago
  We did a study on self-hosting vs saas for geocoding. Here it is: https://view.attach.io/ryiFAKzmb https://view.attach.io/ryiFAKzmb It's a bit marketing-y though :-) Disclosure: we host an OSM compatible geocoder at https://locationiq.org https://locationiq.org
johansch 9y ago
They are optimistic about getting paid next month.
freyfogle 9y ago
Do you need geocoding? I ask because I am one of the makers of the OpenCage geocoder. We offer forward and reverse geocoding from open data (primarily OpenStreetMap, but also others). We're listed in the migration guide, and we'll be offering 20% off our pricing for all former Mapzen customers. Blog post about that is coming shortly. I hope we can help you. https://geocoder.opencagedata.com https://geocoder.opencagedata.com Edit: here's the post about the 20% lifetime discount for former Mapzen customers: https://blog.opencagedata.com/post/mapzen https://blog.opencagedata.com/post/mapzen
- aw3c2 9y ago
  Is your code free and open-source?
  - freyfogle 9y ago
    Our code is not, that said it is "just" a very thin layer to various opensource and open data geocoders. See: https://geocoder.opencagedata.com/credits https://geocoder.opencagedata.com/credits
    - aw3c2 9y ago
      Oh nice!
- voltagex_ 9y ago
  I'm sorry, but the last time I tried OpenCage it was terrible. And by terrible, I mean in line with everything else that uses OSM-based data. Geocoding is hard and I wish you luck, but you've got a long way to go.
  - heurist 9y ago
    I've never come across a geocoder better or cheaper than Google, unfortunately. They all claim accuracy but fail in trivial cases, or interpolate to the wrong part of the street where Google is spot on (though Google has its occasional flaws). I'd love to see competition but it's probably not coming any time soon.
gopi_ar 9y ago
We're putting up a mapzen / pelias compatible endpoint soon on our geocoding service. https://locationiq.org https://locationiq.org It's OSM compatible at the moment.

> we’re optimistic about what’s next. Well... what's next for me is rewriting this application in the next 30 days. Not feeling too "optimistic" there about that.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

aw3c2 9y ago

Which API(s) do you rely on? Are you sure that self-hosting them is not an option?

freyfogle 9y ago
I can't speak for the commenter above, but as someone who runs a paid service built on open geodata I can tell you our best customers are those who first try to self host and then realize what a pain that is. The challenge is not just keeping the software up to date, but that you also need to keep the data fresh. How fresh of course depends on your exact use case, of course, but for perspective OpenStreetMap has 3-4 million edits per day. It's totally doable - and is technically very interesting, but in much the same way that fixing your own car or baking your own bread is doable and fun. It's more cost-effective to hand it off to a reliable expert. Building/installing is (relatively) easy. Maintaining is hard.
- MattBlissett 9y ago
  Even without a requirement to stay particularly up to date, the size of the datasets makes working with OpenStreetMap reasonably complicated. I needed tiles in non-web-standard projections: equirectangular and polar (EPSG:4326, 3575 and 3031). ESRI used to provide equirectangular tiles[0], but have deprecated the service. Polarmap have an Arctic map, but only at standard resolution [1]. I couldn't find an Antarctic map. With a fair amount of fiddling, and building on the work OpenMapTiles.org have done, it was possible to generate the tiles, but I now realise why few people have attempted this: it requires a lot of processing power, technical ability to get everything working properly, and cartography to have a map that looks good (not just the final styling, but the choice of what data is present in each layer of vector tiles). I met the minimum of what we needed [2], but I need to find more time to do the rest -- like contours. [0] http://server.arcgisonline.com/arcgis/rest/services/ESRI_StreetMap_World_2D/MapServer?f=jsapi http://server.arcgisonline.com/arcgis/rest/services/ESRI_Str... [1] https://webmap.arcticconnect.org/polarmap.js/examples/PolarMap/quick-start/ https://webmap.arcticconnect.org/polarmap.js/examples/PolarM... [2a] Small demo: https://api.gbif.org/v2/map/demo7.html https://api.gbif.org/v2/map/demo7.html (shows northern fulmar seabirds) [2b] An overview of the tiles: https://tile.gbif.org/ui/ https://tile.gbif.org/ui/ [2c] In production https://www.gbif.org/species/2481433 https://www.gbif.org/species/2481433 (click to change the projection)
gopi_ar 9y ago
We did a study on self-hosting vs saas for geocoding. Here it is: https://view.attach.io/ryiFAKzmb https://view.attach.io/ryiFAKzmb It's a bit marketing-y though :-) Disclosure: we host an OSM compatible geocoder at https://locationiq.org https://locationiq.org

johansch 9y ago

They are optimistic about getting paid next month.

freyfogle 9y ago

Do you need geocoding? I ask because I am one of the makers of the OpenCage geocoder. We offer forward and reverse geocoding from open data (primarily OpenStreetMap, but also others). We're listed in the migration guide, and we'll be offering 20% off our pricing for all former Mapzen customers. Blog post about that is coming shortly. I hope we can help you. https://geocoder.opencagedata.com https://geocoder.opencagedata.com Edit: here's the post about the 20% lifetime discount for former Mapzen customers: https://blog.opencagedata.com/post/mapzen https://blog.opencagedata.com/post/mapzen

aw3c2 9y ago
Is your code free and open-source?
- freyfogle 9y ago
  Our code is not, that said it is "just" a very thin layer to various opensource and open data geocoders. See: https://geocoder.opencagedata.com/credits https://geocoder.opencagedata.com/credits
  - aw3c2 9y ago
    Oh nice!
voltagex_ 9y ago
I'm sorry, but the last time I tried OpenCage it was terrible. And by terrible, I mean in line with everything else that uses OSM-based data. Geocoding is hard and I wish you luck, but you've got a long way to go.
- heurist 9y ago
  I've never come across a geocoder better or cheaper than Google, unfortunately. They all claim accuracy but fail in trivial cases, or interpolate to the wrong part of the street where Google is spot on (though Google has its occasional flaws). I'd love to see competition but it's probably not coming any time soon.

gopi_ar 9y ago

We're putting up a mapzen / pelias compatible endpoint soon on our geocoding service. https://locationiq.org https://locationiq.org It's OSM compatible at the moment.