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Why are hackers so all-or-nothing when it comes to customer feedback? Either you like everything about a product or you don’t use it. There’s no room for compla

Why are hackers so all-or-nothing when it comes to customer feedback? Either you like everything about a product or you don’t use it. There’s no room for complaints or other feedback about something a person likes overall but doesn’t find to be perfect?

figgis 9y ago
And the same people will get upset if you don't make a bug report somewhere. Feedbacks important whether it's code or just experience.
icegreentea2 9y ago
Maybe OP is making a value judgement on instagram? Maybe OP already decided that instagram's soul is not salvageable, and that they will always push advertisement that puts their profits and revenues before the preferences (and comfort and perhaps health) of the user. Maybe the parts of the system (perhaps even the entire system) are so broken, yet also strangely voluntary (in particular ways... shadow profile aside) that we might owe it to ourselves to extract ourselves from it as best as can?
- mikeash 9y ago
  I see no indication of this whatsoever. This article reads like a plea for improvement to a service she mostly enjoys.
  - icegreentea2 9y ago
    Oh I agree. I was trying to answer to why some people respond in such an all or nothing manner bout stuff like this. Some people may have already made up their minds about what role entities like fb/instagram should have (ie none), and will take any opening to try to propagate that belief. Or maybe it's just being lazy. Or both.
    - mikeash 9y ago
      Oh, I think I get what you mean now. I misunderstood "OP." You're saying, maybe the commenter I replied to has decided that this service is completely worthless, to the point that they can't understand why someone would still put up with it? I could see that being the case, although I think that's just a special case of the phenomenon I'm talking about.
  - rch 9y ago
    I assumed it's motivated by her interest in having Instagram (or similar competing organizations) contemplate the value of an 'agile' data analysis pipeline, which her employer conveniently provides.
mikestew 9y ago
Why are hackers so all-or-nothing when it comes to customer feedback Why do you think they’re a hacker? The mental picture I have is some seventeen year old who might have written some code that a compiler won’t puke on, and ergo they’ve got the world so figured out that not using a product is the “easy” answer in their mind. Now, once they grow up (chronologically or mentally) and produce software people actually use, perhaps their outlook will mature.
- mikeash 9y ago
  Because we’re on Hacker News making that kind of the default assumption, and it’s an attitude I’ve seen from hackers far and wide.
  - mikestew 9y ago
    A fair assumption for sure, but HN will let just about anyone wander in without checking credentials. OTOH, personal experience says that lack of experience is often the root cause of thinking statements such as “just don’t use it” are at all helpful to the conversation. Often it is innocent, like the college hire I worked with at Microsoft who was complaining about a big customer still a version or two behind current Windows. “Why don’t they just upgrade?” “Ever roll out an OS upgrade to 10K seats? Well, when you do, you’ll realize why they don’t ‘just upgrade’.” It was an innocent question, but revealed a lot of inexperience, and IMO, empathy. But a lot of times it seem Mr. Grumpy Pants forgets exactly why they’re writing code in the first place, and laying the onus on the user is a demonstration of that.
- aluhut 9y ago
  I'm not sure which was worse, your or his comment.
  - mikestew 9y ago
    Meh, to me that was the charitable interpretation, as time and experience can fix it. I’d rather not think that such a statement comes from a professional adult writing software for end users.
mnm1 9y ago
Maybe because boycotting is the only real power consumers have in our economy? Sure, there's room for complaints for people that don't mind wasting their time on futile acts that change nothing.
- mikeash 9y ago
  Power can be exercised without actually performing the act that gives you power. For example, if I have a gun pointed at you and I request your wallet, that request has power even if I don't actually shoot you.
leetcrew 9y ago
Maybe some people actually agree with the sentiment of the article but are disappointed that no one takes any real action. Almost everyone I know hates these kinds of ads and the way social media uses our information, but all they do to combat it is write blog posts and comments about how they wish it were different. I think its pretty clear at this point that nothing is going to change if all we do is talk. Facebook knows that a bunch of blog posts are really no threat to its bottom line. So I think its not unreasonable to ask why people are unwilling to boycott services that they criticize so harshly.

figgis 9y ago

And the same people will get upset if you don't make a bug report somewhere. Feedbacks important whether it's code or just experience.

icegreentea2 9y ago

Maybe OP is making a value judgement on instagram? Maybe OP already decided that instagram's soul is not salvageable, and that they will always push advertisement that puts their profits and revenues before the preferences (and comfort and perhaps health) of the user. Maybe the parts of the system (perhaps even the entire system) are so broken, yet also strangely voluntary (in particular ways... shadow profile aside) that we might owe it to ourselves to extract ourselves from it as best as can?

mikeash 9y ago
I see no indication of this whatsoever. This article reads like a plea for improvement to a service she mostly enjoys.
- icegreentea2 9y ago
  Oh I agree. I was trying to answer to why some people respond in such an all or nothing manner bout stuff like this. Some people may have already made up their minds about what role entities like fb/instagram should have (ie none), and will take any opening to try to propagate that belief. Or maybe it's just being lazy. Or both.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    Oh, I think I get what you mean now. I misunderstood "OP." You're saying, maybe the commenter I replied to has decided that this service is completely worthless, to the point that they can't understand why someone would still put up with it? I could see that being the case, although I think that's just a special case of the phenomenon I'm talking about.
- rch 9y ago
  I assumed it's motivated by her interest in having Instagram (or similar competing organizations) contemplate the value of an 'agile' data analysis pipeline, which her employer conveniently provides.

mikestew 9y ago

Why are hackers so all-or-nothing when it comes to customer feedback Why do you think they’re a hacker? The mental picture I have is some seventeen year old who might have written some code that a compiler won’t puke on, and ergo they’ve got the world so figured out that not using a product is the “easy” answer in their mind. Now, once they grow up (chronologically or mentally) and produce software people actually use, perhaps their outlook will mature.

mikeash 9y ago
Because we’re on Hacker News making that kind of the default assumption, and it’s an attitude I’ve seen from hackers far and wide.
- mikestew 9y ago
  A fair assumption for sure, but HN will let just about anyone wander in without checking credentials. OTOH, personal experience says that lack of experience is often the root cause of thinking statements such as “just don’t use it” are at all helpful to the conversation. Often it is innocent, like the college hire I worked with at Microsoft who was complaining about a big customer still a version or two behind current Windows. “Why don’t they just upgrade?” “Ever roll out an OS upgrade to 10K seats? Well, when you do, you’ll realize why they don’t ‘just upgrade’.” It was an innocent question, but revealed a lot of inexperience, and IMO, empathy. But a lot of times it seem Mr. Grumpy Pants forgets exactly why they’re writing code in the first place, and laying the onus on the user is a demonstration of that.
aluhut 9y ago
I'm not sure which was worse, your or his comment.
- mikestew 9y ago
  Meh, to me that was the charitable interpretation, as time and experience can fix it. I’d rather not think that such a statement comes from a professional adult writing software for end users.

mnm1 9y ago

Maybe because boycotting is the only real power consumers have in our economy? Sure, there's room for complaints for people that don't mind wasting their time on futile acts that change nothing.

mikeash 9y ago
Power can be exercised without actually performing the act that gives you power. For example, if I have a gun pointed at you and I request your wallet, that request has power even if I don't actually shoot you.

leetcrew 9y ago

Maybe some people actually agree with the sentiment of the article but are disappointed that no one takes any real action. Almost everyone I know hates these kinds of ads and the way social media uses our information, but all they do to combat it is write blog posts and comments about how they wish it were different. I think its pretty clear at this point that nothing is going to change if all we do is talk. Facebook knows that a bunch of blog posts are really no threat to its bottom line. So I think its not unreasonable to ask why people are unwilling to boycott services that they criticize so harshly.