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I have put about 3,000km on my E-bike in the last 1.5 years. It's limited to 25km/h, because then I don't need a license, it's fast enough for city traffic (mos

by WA 9y ago

I have put about 3,000km on my E-bike in the last 1.5 years. It's limited to 25km/h, because then I don't need a license, it's fast enough for city traffic (mostly in bike lanes anyways) and I get to tow a trailer for my kid. Biggest advantage: Hills don't exist for me. We live in a city with quite a few hills and day care is about 70-100m below our appartment. Doing this trip twice a day with its 15% slope would take way longer and exhaust me, before the day even started. The way downhill to day care is now something like 10 minutes and back up 11 minutes. Biggest disadvantage: If you drive on mostly flat terrain, there's no real benefit – it might even slow you down. I get my regular bike to 25km/h easily. An E-Bike accelerates until it hits 25km/h and then it's just a damn heavy bike (17-20kg) that is slower than a regular bike (if you're a somewhat fit person). Anyways, I love the E-Bike for the simple fact that I go almost anywhere by bike, can take my kid with me and don't have to think about any hills at all.

Brakenshire 9y ago
I've read about motorized doping in bike races, with motors hidden inside the gearing, I wonder whether anyone's thought about this sort of thing for consumer bikes, and what sort of benefit you could get for, say, 1kg or half a kg of extra weight. E-bikes at the moment seem to have reconciled themselves to being twice the weight of ordinary bikes.
- tonyedgecombe 9y ago
  Something like this: https://www.vivax-assist.com/en/product/vivax-assist/vivax-assist_4-0.php https://www.vivax-assist.com/en/product/vivax-assist/vivax-a... I think the problem is range, you won't be able to hide much battery, the one on my bike weighs 6LBs and is quite bulky. In reality it doesn't really matter because the motor will more than offset the extra drag and weight of a heavy bike.
  - ufo 9y ago
    Can you pedal and use the motor at the same time in a regular ebike? I think what the parent posters want to be able to turn off the motor completely.
    - Wingman4l7 9y ago
      You can; it's called "pedal assist", and usually, the motor controllers can be set to do it at different levels of pedaling intensity. It's usually implemented by spacing magnets around the crankset and then calculating how fast they're passing by a sensor.
  - Brakenshire 9y ago
    > I think the problem is range, you won't be able to hide much battery, the one on my bike weighs 6LBs and is quite bulky. Interesting, that seems to be exactly what I was thinking of. The good thing is, it seems you could use it without a battery, or with differently sized batteries depending on need. If I'm reading this right, the motor, wiring, etc, weighs about 1000g, then a 6Ah battery another 850g, or a 9Ah battery 1250g. So only an extra kilo if you just wanted to use it as a normal bike, and if you're commuting, you might know exactly what capacity you need, and could just take that. Especially in cities, there's a lot of carrying bikes up and down stairs. Just needs to be a lot cheaper than 3000 Euros!
- fjsolwmv 9y ago
  Just strap a power drill and a caster between back seat and wheel.
- matt-attack 9y ago
  Have you seen this: https://budnitzbicycles.com/bicycles/view/titanium-ebike https://budnitzbicycles.com/bicycles/view/titanium-ebike I think it’s the closest you’ll find to a bike the looks and operates almost identically to a traditional bike. No wires, no display, excellent weight, etc. Obviously the price is out of control, but still the right idea I think.
  - soperj 9y ago
    Is it really that bad if you could use it as your car?
    - bufferoverflow 9y ago
      But you really can't. 1) cars can go a lot faster and on highways 2) cars can haul lots of cargo 3) cars can have 3-6 passengers 4) cars drive just fine in strong wind / rain / snow 5) cars are a lot safer on roads There are obvious disadvantages too, but, regardless, ebikes are not car replacements. They are good for relatively short trips in places with good bicycle infrastructure.
      - marcus_holmes 9y ago
        If you commute less than, say, 10 miles, to work then they are a functional replacement for a car. You can hire a car, or a van, for other tasks that require those advantages. Or even (shock!) use public transport.
        bufferoverflow 9y ago
        Yeah, so if you ignore all the points I've made, it is indeed a replacement. So is riding a unicycle. Or walking.
        dagurp 9y ago
        But he/she didn't. In most cities you can rent cars by the hour and that is enough for a lot of people.
- fsargent 9y ago
  You should check out vanmoof. You'd never know it was an ebike if it weren't for the iconic branding.
rorykoehler 9y ago
The 25km/h limit is why I won't buy one. Pointless for normal use.
- lumberjack 9y ago
  A fast e-bike would be dangerous, anyway. At that point, you should just get a small capacity motorcycle or a scooter.
  - gkya 9y ago
    I wonder if sth. like an electric Vespa would be feasible. You would be able to pack in more battery than an e-bike, but the last mile would be a problem because you can't just pedal the rest of the way.
    - hocuspocus 9y ago
      Not only it's feasible, it's done. Cf. Gogoro for the most iconic ones (but there are plenty of other brands too).
    - zerni 9y ago
      Check out unumotors.com
    - rorykoehler 9y ago
      The problem in Singapore is you need to get a COE for motorbikes. They cost at least 5x what am ebike would cost. I want an electrical assist bicycle that goes 50kmh and is nimble not a scooter that goes 80kmh, costs an order of magnitude more and rides like a death trap. I'd be happy if they provided some sort of intermediate license with a test for faster ebikes.
  - adrianN 9y ago
    It would be good if they went 30-35, so that you don't impede traffic on streets with a 30km/h limit. I don't think the additional 15% speed would make that much of a safety difference, compared to cars overtaking you.
alfla 9y ago
I'm on my second converted (bafang) e-bike, been riding about 4000 KM the past two years all year (Norway). I love it! I use it as my main means of transportation, both to work and for other transport needs. My first one was a cheap/old 26" dirtbike with hydraulic brakes. It was OK but the front shock and relatively skinny wheels were a limiting factor. My second bike is a mid/high quality 27.5" dirtbike with a good front shock and good hydraulic brakes. And it's a really good bike all year. I highly recommend getting fairly large wheels with wide tires and a good front shock for a conversion bike.
- kennethh 9y ago
  I live in Norway also and was wondering about buying a conversion kit, do you have links to the kit you bought?
  - alfla 9y ago
    Elsykkelbutikken.no imports directly from China. They are super helpful.
whiddershins 9y ago
Do you bring your kid in a trailer in city traffic? I’ve seen people do similar and it gives me a nervous fit. Looks insanely dangerous from a bystander POV.
- WA 9y ago
  Yes, but not a big city in Germany. Many bike lanes and speed limit of 30-40km/h. Also several roads with two lanes. If there is no bike lane, I take the entire lane to prevent cars from passing by closely. I certainly wouldn’t drive with a trailer everywhere though.
- tnolet 9y ago
  This extremely common in Dutch cities like Amsterdam too.
clarry 9y ago
I love the idea of an e-bike but the 25kph limit just kills it. I already average over 25kph on a typical non-winter commute and there are no hills to speak of in my area. There aren't that many stoplights either.
verelo 9y ago
Do people give you trouble for riding in bike lanes? I know here in Toronto people hate the Vespa-like ebikes. They’re too slow for cars lanes, endangering the rider, and too fast for bike lanes, endangering bikers. Personally, i feel like you should just not have the 25kmh limit and need a license.
Fnoord 9y ago
"Biggest disadvantage: If you drive on mostly flat terrain, there's no real benefit – it might even slow you down." I'm from that country with the bikes 'n dykes (The Netherlands) and lately it seems a trend that elder use e-bikes instead of whatever else they were using (car, moped, bicycle, legwagon). They're severely slowed down if they were to use a regular bike. This way, they can get some fresh air and actually see some of nature and adjacent cities/village. The biggest disadvantage to me is the high price. Combine that with these elder who'd also use these e-bikes to go for longer routes but then they'd not put their bike locked securely (and you should use some good locks). Cause yeah, losing 1-2k EUR from just doing groceries is a shame. They're also a bit more difficult to transport in public transport than a regular bike and more so a folding bike (latter is freely used on Dutch railways called NS). I also notice that the e-bikes can pass me on longer courses, but if we're going from traffic light to traffic light I accelerate way quicker on my regular bicycle than e-bikes. If I do my best, I can slowly pass an e-biker. If you wanna take your kid with you, a "bakfiets" (a bicycle with a way to transport items in the front of the wheel see [1]) also works. Especially common in Amsterdam. The Cube Design Museum in Kerkrade had an exhibition (in NL/EN/DE language available) about bicycles with all kind of bicycles of the past and the future, including experimental designs. When I went, IIRC in september 2017, they also had an exposition about toilets, and a floor about past failed designs (a lot of electronics but not solely), There's World of Bricks (Lego) as well in the Continuum Museum nearby. Recommended! (Disclaimer: not affiliated.) [1] https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakfiets https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakfiets [2] http://www.cubedesignmuseum.nl/nl/blog/persbericht-fietsen-van-de-toekomst-nieuwe-expositie-cube-design-museum http://www.cubedesignmuseum.nl/nl/blog/persbericht-fietsen-v...

by WA 9y ago

Brakenshire 9y ago

I've read about motorized doping in bike races, with motors hidden inside the gearing, I wonder whether anyone's thought about this sort of thing for consumer bikes, and what sort of benefit you could get for, say, 1kg or half a kg of extra weight. E-bikes at the moment seem to have reconciled themselves to being twice the weight of ordinary bikes.

tonyedgecombe 9y ago
Something like this: https://www.vivax-assist.com/en/product/vivax-assist/vivax-assist_4-0.php https://www.vivax-assist.com/en/product/vivax-assist/vivax-a... I think the problem is range, you won't be able to hide much battery, the one on my bike weighs 6LBs and is quite bulky. In reality it doesn't really matter because the motor will more than offset the extra drag and weight of a heavy bike.
- ufo 9y ago
  Can you pedal and use the motor at the same time in a regular ebike? I think what the parent posters want to be able to turn off the motor completely.
  - Wingman4l7 9y ago
    You can; it's called "pedal assist", and usually, the motor controllers can be set to do it at different levels of pedaling intensity. It's usually implemented by spacing magnets around the crankset and then calculating how fast they're passing by a sensor.
- Brakenshire 9y ago
  > I think the problem is range, you won't be able to hide much battery, the one on my bike weighs 6LBs and is quite bulky. Interesting, that seems to be exactly what I was thinking of. The good thing is, it seems you could use it without a battery, or with differently sized batteries depending on need. If I'm reading this right, the motor, wiring, etc, weighs about 1000g, then a 6Ah battery another 850g, or a 9Ah battery 1250g. So only an extra kilo if you just wanted to use it as a normal bike, and if you're commuting, you might know exactly what capacity you need, and could just take that. Especially in cities, there's a lot of carrying bikes up and down stairs. Just needs to be a lot cheaper than 3000 Euros!
fjsolwmv 9y ago
Just strap a power drill and a caster between back seat and wheel.
matt-attack 9y ago
Have you seen this: https://budnitzbicycles.com/bicycles/view/titanium-ebike https://budnitzbicycles.com/bicycles/view/titanium-ebike I think it’s the closest you’ll find to a bike the looks and operates almost identically to a traditional bike. No wires, no display, excellent weight, etc. Obviously the price is out of control, but still the right idea I think.
- soperj 9y ago
  Is it really that bad if you could use it as your car?
  - bufferoverflow 9y ago
    But you really can't. 1) cars can go a lot faster and on highways 2) cars can haul lots of cargo 3) cars can have 3-6 passengers 4) cars drive just fine in strong wind / rain / snow 5) cars are a lot safer on roads There are obvious disadvantages too, but, regardless, ebikes are not car replacements. They are good for relatively short trips in places with good bicycle infrastructure.
    - marcus_holmes 9y ago
      If you commute less than, say, 10 miles, to work then they are a functional replacement for a car. You can hire a car, or a van, for other tasks that require those advantages. Or even (shock!) use public transport.
      - bufferoverflow 9y ago
        Yeah, so if you ignore all the points I've made, it is indeed a replacement. So is riding a unicycle. Or walking.
        dagurp 9y ago
        But he/she didn't. In most cities you can rent cars by the hour and that is enough for a lot of people.
fsargent 9y ago
You should check out vanmoof. You'd never know it was an ebike if it weren't for the iconic branding.

rorykoehler 9y ago

The 25km/h limit is why I won't buy one. Pointless for normal use.

lumberjack 9y ago
A fast e-bike would be dangerous, anyway. At that point, you should just get a small capacity motorcycle or a scooter.
- gkya 9y ago
  I wonder if sth. like an electric Vespa would be feasible. You would be able to pack in more battery than an e-bike, but the last mile would be a problem because you can't just pedal the rest of the way.
  - hocuspocus 9y ago
    Not only it's feasible, it's done. Cf. Gogoro for the most iconic ones (but there are plenty of other brands too).
  - zerni 9y ago
    Check out unumotors.com
  - rorykoehler 9y ago
    The problem in Singapore is you need to get a COE for motorbikes. They cost at least 5x what am ebike would cost. I want an electrical assist bicycle that goes 50kmh and is nimble not a scooter that goes 80kmh, costs an order of magnitude more and rides like a death trap. I'd be happy if they provided some sort of intermediate license with a test for faster ebikes.
- adrianN 9y ago
  It would be good if they went 30-35, so that you don't impede traffic on streets with a 30km/h limit. I don't think the additional 15% speed would make that much of a safety difference, compared to cars overtaking you.

alfla 9y ago

I'm on my second converted (bafang) e-bike, been riding about 4000 KM the past two years all year (Norway). I love it! I use it as my main means of transportation, both to work and for other transport needs. My first one was a cheap/old 26" dirtbike with hydraulic brakes. It was OK but the front shock and relatively skinny wheels were a limiting factor. My second bike is a mid/high quality 27.5" dirtbike with a good front shock and good hydraulic brakes. And it's a really good bike all year. I highly recommend getting fairly large wheels with wide tires and a good front shock for a conversion bike.

kennethh 9y ago
I live in Norway also and was wondering about buying a conversion kit, do you have links to the kit you bought?
- alfla 9y ago
  Elsykkelbutikken.no imports directly from China. They are super helpful.

whiddershins 9y ago

Do you bring your kid in a trailer in city traffic? I’ve seen people do similar and it gives me a nervous fit. Looks insanely dangerous from a bystander POV.

WA 9y ago
Yes, but not a big city in Germany. Many bike lanes and speed limit of 30-40km/h. Also several roads with two lanes. If there is no bike lane, I take the entire lane to prevent cars from passing by closely. I certainly wouldn’t drive with a trailer everywhere though.
tnolet 9y ago
This extremely common in Dutch cities like Amsterdam too.

clarry 9y ago

I love the idea of an e-bike but the 25kph limit just kills it. I already average over 25kph on a typical non-winter commute and there are no hills to speak of in my area. There aren't that many stoplights either.

verelo 9y ago

Do people give you trouble for riding in bike lanes? I know here in Toronto people hate the Vespa-like ebikes. They’re too slow for cars lanes, endangering the rider, and too fast for bike lanes, endangering bikers. Personally, i feel like you should just not have the 25kmh limit and need a license.

Fnoord 9y ago

"Biggest disadvantage: If you drive on mostly flat terrain, there's no real benefit – it might even slow you down." I'm from that country with the bikes 'n dykes (The Netherlands) and lately it seems a trend that elder use e-bikes instead of whatever else they were using (car, moped, bicycle, legwagon). They're severely slowed down if they were to use a regular bike. This way, they can get some fresh air and actually see some of nature and adjacent cities/village. The biggest disadvantage to me is the high price. Combine that with these elder who'd also use these e-bikes to go for longer routes but then they'd not put their bike locked securely (and you should use some good locks). Cause yeah, losing 1-2k EUR from just doing groceries is a shame. They're also a bit more difficult to transport in public transport than a regular bike and more so a folding bike (latter is freely used on Dutch railways called NS). I also notice that the e-bikes can pass me on longer courses, but if we're going from traffic light to traffic light I accelerate way quicker on my regular bicycle than e-bikes. If I do my best, I can slowly pass an e-biker. If you wanna take your kid with you, a "bakfiets" (a bicycle with a way to transport items in the front of the wheel see [1]) also works. Especially common in Amsterdam. The Cube Design Museum in Kerkrade had an exhibition (in NL/EN/DE language available) about bicycles with all kind of bicycles of the past and the future, including experimental designs. When I went, IIRC in september 2017, they also had an exposition about toilets, and a floor about past failed designs (a lot of electronics but not solely), There's World of Bricks (Lego) as well in the Continuum Museum nearby. Recommended! (Disclaimer: not affiliated.) [1] https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakfiets https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakfiets [2] http://www.cubedesignmuseum.nl/nl/blog/persbericht-fietsen-van-de-toekomst-nieuwe-expositie-cube-design-museum http://www.cubedesignmuseum.nl/nl/blog/persbericht-fietsen-v...