5 ms·

How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing. Did you ever pause to consider ho

How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing. Did you ever pause to consider how much humanity would have progressed without him stopping so much progress in the first place? (I deleted a section on the malaria stuff; I misread your comment slightly at first.)

briankelly 9y ago
If not Bill then Bob. At least he's doing some good in the world with that cash instead of hoarding it for him and his family. If it weren't for him, how long would have malaria persisted?
- johansch 9y ago
  I think his primary motivation is so simple.. he wants people to like him. Many, many people disliked him after his predatory business days. This is the perfect way to a) keep doing interesting work, b) getting people to like him again, c) get some personal karma. I can quite easily see the appeal of this. Also; I'm a big fan of his current work. I loved how my country (Sweden) matched a very large billg foundation program funding the other year; I think he's way better equipped with handling that money than my government's idealistic but fumbling people. I just think we shouldn't forget his past just because he's turned into modern day santa. We should learn from history...
  - qubex 9y ago
    I’m not American but I wish he would decide that the situation there warrants ’philantropy’ and would this casually pour a billion or so into getting himself the Democratic nomination and the presidential election just for the sake of ousting Trump I’m a Battle Of The Billionaires (alleged, in Trump’s case).
  - hota_mazi 9y ago
    > I think his primary motivation is so simple.. he wants people to like him. Yeah, you definitely have something against him, don't you? I don't really care what his motives are, I just look at the results of his contributions and there is no doubt in my mind he will be remembered as someone who was instrumental in saving millions of lives and advancing our civilization. > Many, many people disliked him after his predatory business days. I profoundly disliked him as well back in the days, especially since I was a hard code Amiga fan. As opposed to you, I have changed my opinion based on additional data.
    - johansch 9y ago
      > Yeah, you definitely have something against him, don't you? Well, yeah. I think we'd be at least 5 years further into the future in terms of software than we currently are, possible 10, unless he hadn't abused the markets so gravely.
ben_w 9y ago
The main thing I remember from the era of Gates Is Literally Satan was the browser wars, and how awful it was that Internet Explorer was both free and tightly integrated into the operating system. #cough# Safari on Apple devices #cough# Chrome on Android and ChromeOS devices
- torstenvl 9y ago
  Dishonest comparison is dishonest. I'm pretty confident it's actually possible to uninstall Safari, and that macOS will continue to work. Besides, the integration with the operating system isn't the problem. It's the integration with the only operating system. It isn't monopoly abuse if you don't have a monopoly.
- johansch 9y ago
  That was at very end of the Gates era.
qubex 9y ago
I never liked Bill Gates when I was a power user in the nineties and early 2000s but it really is amazing that one could offset his contribution to disease eradication and his philanthropy generally with some aggravation about his business’ tactics and nebulous what-ifs about what might have happened if he had not been on the scene or had behaved differently. (Moore’s Law would did it’s thing anyway, whether he was there or not, and even with him there, Microsoft’s stranglehold on the desktop market relented anyway.) Do you really think the annoyance of a free browser warrants indicting his post-business career?
- johansch 9y ago
  You're very naive if you think that Microsoft's market abuses was limited to web browsers. This is way too non-inclusive, but at least it's something: https://www.pcmag.com/feature/302767/9-companies-microsoft-devoured-or-sued-into-oblivion https://www.pcmag.com/feature/302767/9-companies-microsoft-d... In the 80s Microsoft under Bill Gates was extremely fierce. Silicon Valley software companies lived in constant fear. There was a bunch of well-documented market abuse using the control of the OS (MS-DOS). Further reading: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41611.Hard_Drive https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41611.Hard_Drive
- johansch 9y ago
  Just noting that this comment first only talked about the browser bundling antitrust thing, and then, after I commented, completely morphed into something else.
  - qubex 9y ago
    I’m not really sure what you are referring to because I have not edited any of my comments, but this one probably closely resembles another one I made further up and therefore might give you the impression that there had been some ’morphing’ involved.
- dTal 9y ago
  >Microsoft’s stranglehold on the desktop market relented anyway Hardly. Market share is still roughly 85% Windows, 15% Mac, and fuck-all % Linux, which is reflected in the level of support provided for applications, games, hardware etc. Even disregarding compatibility, MacOS is not a straightforward alternative as it only runs on Apple hardware, which is very expensive and only offers a narrow range of opinionated designs.
hota_mazi 9y ago
> How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing Please no ad hominem attacks, focus on what I said, not how old I am. But if it matters to you, I wrote my first lines of code in 1979 on an Apple ][ and I've lived through the exact same times you did. I find little point in speculating on what could have happened that didn't, I focus on reality and what people have actually achieved in their life time.
- johansch 9y ago
  It wasn't an attack (heck, wtf, I was just asking your age, maybe stop over-dramatizing?); I was trying to find out if you had some sort of personal experience or was just parroting the newer reddit hivemind.
  - hota_mazi 9y ago
    What you did is the text book definition of an ad hominem attack: undermining someone's argument by attacking their character instead of addressing what they said.
    - johansch 9y ago
      Today I learned: Asking someone their age is equivalent to doing an ad hominem attack.
      - hota_mazi 9y ago
        > How old are you? Is fine. > How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing Is an ad hominem attack.
        johansch 9y ago
        How about this for an attack? What is your current connection to the Microsoft ecosystem?
webreac 9y ago
Hello, I have also lost karma points on this subject. I also feel that Microsoft had a very negative effect on the progress of computer science during many years but it is very difficult to convince other generations. There were many positive and negative effects. To grasp the global effect, you need to have lived all the progress of the previous years before Microsoft and you need to have followed all the commercials fights to eradicate concurrence (dr dos, stacker, borland c++, ...).
- johansch 9y ago
  Hi. It does illustrate the power of the combination of time and lots of money. You can literally alter truths.
- johansch 9y ago
  Two hours later. Wow, you weren't wrong about the down-voting. The lack of a sense of history here is disturbing. I thought HN was better than this.

briankelly 9y ago

If not Bill then Bob. At least he's doing some good in the world with that cash instead of hoarding it for him and his family. If it weren't for him, how long would have malaria persisted?

johansch 9y ago
I think his primary motivation is so simple.. he wants people to like him. Many, many people disliked him after his predatory business days. This is the perfect way to a) keep doing interesting work, b) getting people to like him again, c) get some personal karma. I can quite easily see the appeal of this. Also; I'm a big fan of his current work. I loved how my country (Sweden) matched a very large billg foundation program funding the other year; I think he's way better equipped with handling that money than my government's idealistic but fumbling people. I just think we shouldn't forget his past just because he's turned into modern day santa. We should learn from history...
- qubex 9y ago
  I’m not American but I wish he would decide that the situation there warrants ’philantropy’ and would this casually pour a billion or so into getting himself the Democratic nomination and the presidential election just for the sake of ousting Trump I’m a Battle Of The Billionaires (alleged, in Trump’s case).
- hota_mazi 9y ago
  > I think his primary motivation is so simple.. he wants people to like him. Yeah, you definitely have something against him, don't you? I don't really care what his motives are, I just look at the results of his contributions and there is no doubt in my mind he will be remembered as someone who was instrumental in saving millions of lives and advancing our civilization. > Many, many people disliked him after his predatory business days. I profoundly disliked him as well back in the days, especially since I was a hard code Amiga fan. As opposed to you, I have changed my opinion based on additional data.
  - johansch 9y ago
    > Yeah, you definitely have something against him, don't you? Well, yeah. I think we'd be at least 5 years further into the future in terms of software than we currently are, possible 10, unless he hadn't abused the markets so gravely.

ben_w 9y ago

The main thing I remember from the era of Gates Is Literally Satan was the browser wars, and how awful it was that Internet Explorer was both free and tightly integrated into the operating system. #cough# Safari on Apple devices #cough# Chrome on Android and ChromeOS devices

torstenvl 9y ago
Dishonest comparison is dishonest. I'm pretty confident it's actually possible to uninstall Safari, and that macOS will continue to work. Besides, the integration with the operating system isn't the problem. It's the integration with the only operating system. It isn't monopoly abuse if you don't have a monopoly.
johansch 9y ago
That was at very end of the Gates era.

qubex 9y ago

I never liked Bill Gates when I was a power user in the nineties and early 2000s but it really is amazing that one could offset his contribution to disease eradication and his philanthropy generally with some aggravation about his business’ tactics and nebulous what-ifs about what might have happened if he had not been on the scene or had behaved differently. (Moore’s Law would did it’s thing anyway, whether he was there or not, and even with him there, Microsoft’s stranglehold on the desktop market relented anyway.) Do you really think the annoyance of a free browser warrants indicting his post-business career?

johansch 9y ago
You're very naive if you think that Microsoft's market abuses was limited to web browsers. This is way too non-inclusive, but at least it's something: https://www.pcmag.com/feature/302767/9-companies-microsoft-devoured-or-sued-into-oblivion https://www.pcmag.com/feature/302767/9-companies-microsoft-d... In the 80s Microsoft under Bill Gates was extremely fierce. Silicon Valley software companies lived in constant fear. There was a bunch of well-documented market abuse using the control of the OS (MS-DOS). Further reading: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41611.Hard_Drive https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41611.Hard_Drive
johansch 9y ago
Just noting that this comment first only talked about the browser bundling antitrust thing, and then, after I commented, completely morphed into something else.
- qubex 9y ago
  I’m not really sure what you are referring to because I have not edited any of my comments, but this one probably closely resembles another one I made further up and therefore might give you the impression that there had been some ’morphing’ involved.
dTal 9y ago
>Microsoft’s stranglehold on the desktop market relented anyway Hardly. Market share is still roughly 85% Windows, 15% Mac, and fuck-all % Linux, which is reflected in the level of support provided for applications, games, hardware etc. Even disregarding compatibility, MacOS is not a straightforward alternative as it only runs on Apple hardware, which is very expensive and only offers a narrow range of opinionated designs.

hota_mazi 9y ago

> How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing Please no ad hominem attacks, focus on what I said, not how old I am. But if it matters to you, I wrote my first lines of code in 1979 on an Apple ][ and I've lived through the exact same times you did. I find little point in speculating on what could have happened that didn't, I focus on reality and what people have actually achieved in their life time.

johansch 9y ago
It wasn't an attack (heck, wtf, I was just asking your age, maybe stop over-dramatizing?); I was trying to find out if you had some sort of personal experience or was just parroting the newer reddit hivemind.
- hota_mazi 9y ago
  What you did is the text book definition of an ad hominem attack: undermining someone's argument by attacking their character instead of addressing what they said.
  - johansch 9y ago
    Today I learned: Asking someone their age is equivalent to doing an ad hominem attack.
    - hota_mazi 9y ago
      > How old are you? Is fine. > How old are you? Let me just guess; not old enough to have experienced living/working in tech while Bill was doing his thing Is an ad hominem attack.
      - johansch 9y ago
        How about this for an attack? What is your current connection to the Microsoft ecosystem?

webreac 9y ago

Hello, I have also lost karma points on this subject. I also feel that Microsoft had a very negative effect on the progress of computer science during many years but it is very difficult to convince other generations. There were many positive and negative effects. To grasp the global effect, you need to have lived all the progress of the previous years before Microsoft and you need to have followed all the commercials fights to eradicate concurrence (dr dos, stacker, borland c++, ...).

johansch 9y ago
Hi. It does illustrate the power of the combination of time and lots of money. You can literally alter truths.
johansch 9y ago
Two hours later. Wow, you weren't wrong about the down-voting. The lack of a sense of history here is disturbing. I thought HN was better than this.