6 ms·

Reported crime. They also reclassified many crimes. Also, cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience). Yes, there are less homicides t

Reported crime. They also reclassified many crimes. Also, cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience). Yes, there are less homicides than ever, but it's still painful to watch manipulation of statistics in slow motion. On the flip side sex crimes are quite up (again, reported).

donohoe 9y ago
>> cops aren't always eager to take reports Well, that’s not new, so it’s not like cops suddenly stopped reporting even more crime
cpncrunch 9y ago
>cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience). Perhaps for something like an iphone being stolen, but I doubt that applies to homicides.
- mancerayder 9y ago
  Of course not. You can't cover those up, or downplay them. Downplaying crimes means less serious crimes on the books, which makes the department commander look better, and improves re-election chances for mayors. In NYC, due to the 1990's and the vivid memories some of us have of what safety was like then, crime is an extremely make-or-break factor in electoral races. Unfortunately, these memories are fading and people's understanding of crime reporting statistics aren't improving, either. Yes, it's official that NYC reclassified many crimes in the last 24 months. Whether or not this was good is subject to debate; but undoubtedly it leads to a 'lower crime rate.' That's the legal, official piece of the puzzle. The unoffocial one comes to play when you try to convince the cops not to downplay a crime you report. No one carries statistics on officers downgrading crimes when they file reports. This became really obvious when sex crime victims started getting press attention and reporting anecdote after anecdote of victim-blaming, indifference and worse.
danso 9y ago
I can also speak from experience that not all NYPD are eager to take in a report of violent crime, but the OP isn't just talking about felonies, but homicides. "The Wire" Season 4 aside, it's much harder for the police to fudge a body count. An increase in reported sexual assaults isn't necessarily a signal of crime trends as it may reflect an increase in willingness of victims to report versus past years. Speaking of Baltimore and its homicide rate, the Sun had a great investigation in 2010 that busted the department for having a sharp drop in reported rapes while having a steady/increasing homicide rate -- a great example of the use of (relatively simple) statistics -- such as how Baltimore was one of the few major cities to have more homicides than rapes -- that effected change: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-city-rapes-gallery-storygallery.html http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-city-rapes-gal... A followup story reported the "good" news: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-md-ci-sex-offense-changes-20110630-story.html http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-md-ci-sex-offense-change... > A major category of crime is up substantially in Baltimore, and police and city officials are pleased. > A year after The Baltimore Sun revealed that the city led the country in the number of rape reports discarded by detectives — part of what women's advocates and victims said was a broader pattern of ignoring sexual assaults — the number of rapes being reported is up more than 50 percent.
- phonon 9y ago
  > but the OP isn't just talking about felonies, but homicides. "The Wire" Season 4 aside, it's much harder for the police to fudge a body count. Yes, but you also need to take into account that emergency rooms have gotten much better at treating gunshot wounds and other serious crime-related traumas. I.e. even with the same exact level of crime, the homicide rate would still have gone down significantly over the last few decades.
  - ch4s3 9y ago
    ERs are required to report stabbings and gun shots, so that would still be captured in the crime rate.
    - danso 9y ago
conistonwater 9y ago
That's a pretty strong claim, is the difference significant there? What's your source on that?
shams93 9y ago
Yeah here in Los Angeles your tenant can put your building manager in the hospital on a meth induced violence binge and even destroy the property but they won't make an arrest even when there's a victim in the hospital. So for example this crime that really happened was not allowed to be reported.
- mancerayder 9y ago
  They don't make an arrest to help the higher ups prevent another crime on the books, because they're lazy/unwilling, or another reason?
JumpCrisscross 9y ago
> cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience) Cops have no say in whether to take or not take a report. Call 311, make a police report, meet the officer dispatched to you and sign. I agree that getting the NYPD to actually act on a police report is puzzlingly difficult.
- yellowstuff 9y ago
  I've heard of NYC cops doing tricks like reporting a bag stolen off the subway as "lost property" if the victim didn't actually see someone take it. There was also an infamous case where a pattern of attempted rapes got reported as lesser crimes like trespassing, so a serial offend who should have gotten a serious investigation never got one, and went uncaught for a long time.
- sedachv 9y ago
  > Cops have no say in whether to take or not take a report. One time I tried to report a theft. I gave up after the third time the cop who was answering the phones at the local police station hung up on me.
  - nerdponx 9y ago
    The other day I tried to report someone who was blatantly trying to sell me a stolen computer. I was disappointed to find that they don't maintain any kind of database of serial numbers of lost and stolen electronics. The implication is that, if you do lose something or have it stolen, there is no way for the police to help you get it back.
    - learc83 9y ago
      That's mostly because the percentage of people who keep track of the SN of their electronics is close to 0.
    - chimeracoder 9y ago
      > I was disappointed to find that they don't maintain any kind of database of serial numbers of lost and stolen electronics. NYC actually does, but you have to register your number before it gets stolen. Usually this is fine, because most people don't know their serial number after the device is stolen, unless they've thought to register it beforehand anyway.
forapurpose 9y ago
> sex crimes are quite up (again, reported) From the article: rapes were down from last year by one, to 1,417, misdemeanor sex crimes — a catchall for various types of misconduct that includes groping — ticked up 9.3 percent to 3,585 so far In addition, note that this is the year of the #metoo movement
Simon_says 9y ago
"Sex crime" can mean rape, prostitution, or peeing in bushes. Can you be more specific?

donohoe 9y ago

>> cops aren't always eager to take reports Well, that’s not new, so it’s not like cops suddenly stopped reporting even more crime

cpncrunch 9y ago

>cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience). Perhaps for something like an iphone being stolen, but I doubt that applies to homicides.

mancerayder 9y ago
Of course not. You can't cover those up, or downplay them. Downplaying crimes means less serious crimes on the books, which makes the department commander look better, and improves re-election chances for mayors. In NYC, due to the 1990's and the vivid memories some of us have of what safety was like then, crime is an extremely make-or-break factor in electoral races. Unfortunately, these memories are fading and people's understanding of crime reporting statistics aren't improving, either. Yes, it's official that NYC reclassified many crimes in the last 24 months. Whether or not this was good is subject to debate; but undoubtedly it leads to a 'lower crime rate.' That's the legal, official piece of the puzzle. The unoffocial one comes to play when you try to convince the cops not to downplay a crime you report. No one carries statistics on officers downgrading crimes when they file reports. This became really obvious when sex crime victims started getting press attention and reporting anecdote after anecdote of victim-blaming, indifference and worse.

danso 9y ago

I can also speak from experience that not all NYPD are eager to take in a report of violent crime, but the OP isn't just talking about felonies, but homicides. "The Wire" Season 4 aside, it's much harder for the police to fudge a body count. An increase in reported sexual assaults isn't necessarily a signal of crime trends as it may reflect an increase in willingness of victims to report versus past years. Speaking of Baltimore and its homicide rate, the Sun had a great investigation in 2010 that busted the department for having a sharp drop in reported rapes while having a steady/increasing homicide rate -- a great example of the use of (relatively simple) statistics -- such as how Baltimore was one of the few major cities to have more homicides than rapes -- that effected change: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-city-rapes-gallery-storygallery.html http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/bal-city-rapes-gal... A followup story reported the "good" news: http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-md-ci-sex-offense-changes-20110630-story.html http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/bs-md-ci-sex-offense-change... > A major category of crime is up substantially in Baltimore, and police and city officials are pleased. > A year after The Baltimore Sun revealed that the city led the country in the number of rape reports discarded by detectives — part of what women's advocates and victims said was a broader pattern of ignoring sexual assaults — the number of rapes being reported is up more than 50 percent.

phonon 9y ago
> but the OP isn't just talking about felonies, but homicides. "The Wire" Season 4 aside, it's much harder for the police to fudge a body count. Yes, but you also need to take into account that emergency rooms have gotten much better at treating gunshot wounds and other serious crime-related traumas. I.e. even with the same exact level of crime, the homicide rate would still have gone down significantly over the last few decades.
- ch4s3 9y ago
  ERs are required to report stabbings and gun shots, so that would still be captured in the crime rate.
  - danso 9y ago

conistonwater 9y ago

That's a pretty strong claim, is the difference significant there? What's your source on that?

shams93 9y ago

Yeah here in Los Angeles your tenant can put your building manager in the hospital on a meth induced violence binge and even destroy the property but they won't make an arrest even when there's a victim in the hospital. So for example this crime that really happened was not allowed to be reported.

mancerayder 9y ago
They don't make an arrest to help the higher ups prevent another crime on the books, because they're lazy/unwilling, or another reason?

JumpCrisscross 9y ago

> cops aren't always eager to take reports (I speak from experience) Cops have no say in whether to take or not take a report. Call 311, make a police report, meet the officer dispatched to you and sign. I agree that getting the NYPD to actually act on a police report is puzzlingly difficult.

yellowstuff 9y ago
I've heard of NYC cops doing tricks like reporting a bag stolen off the subway as "lost property" if the victim didn't actually see someone take it. There was also an infamous case where a pattern of attempted rapes got reported as lesser crimes like trespassing, so a serial offend who should have gotten a serious investigation never got one, and went uncaught for a long time.
sedachv 9y ago
> Cops have no say in whether to take or not take a report. One time I tried to report a theft. I gave up after the third time the cop who was answering the phones at the local police station hung up on me.
- nerdponx 9y ago
  The other day I tried to report someone who was blatantly trying to sell me a stolen computer. I was disappointed to find that they don't maintain any kind of database of serial numbers of lost and stolen electronics. The implication is that, if you do lose something or have it stolen, there is no way for the police to help you get it back.
  - learc83 9y ago
    That's mostly because the percentage of people who keep track of the SN of their electronics is close to 0.
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > I was disappointed to find that they don't maintain any kind of database of serial numbers of lost and stolen electronics. NYC actually does, but you have to register your number before it gets stolen. Usually this is fine, because most people don't know their serial number after the device is stolen, unless they've thought to register it beforehand anyway.

forapurpose 9y ago

> sex crimes are quite up (again, reported) From the article: rapes were down from last year by one, to 1,417, misdemeanor sex crimes — a catchall for various types of misconduct that includes groping — ticked up 9.3 percent to 3,585 so far In addition, note that this is the year of the #metoo movement

Simon_says 9y ago

"Sex crime" can mean rape, prostitution, or peeing in bushes. Can you be more specific?