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> Middle class people can take advantage of those investment returns as well. How exactly do you define "middle class"? Because by the popular definition of m

> Middle class people can take advantage of those investment returns as well. How exactly do you define "middle class"? Because by the popular definition of middle class, these folks can not take any meaningful advantage of any sort of investment returns. Generally speaking, middle class people barely have enough money to house and educate themselves (they must take out large barely-sustainable loans to cover either/both of those, at high risk to themselves). The wealthier of the middle class might have a basic retirement account of some sort, which might barely cover basic food+shelter+medical for their own person.

jrs95 9y ago
You're confusing what people can do with what they actually do. I've known people who make close to the median income and support 4 children, own a home, and still had enough savings to buy them all cars and pay for their college tuition. They have some amount of retirement savings as well, though I don't know how much. I've also known people who make nearly 6 figures and just spend all of their money. A more expensive apartment than they need, a more expensive car than they need, eating at restaurants all the time, buying a bunch of what are essentially toys for adults, etc. Although this is in the midwest, the cost of living is much lower here. It's quite possible that you just can't do this on your typical "middle class" income in other places.
- ABCLAW 9y ago
  The issue is specific to certain locations. Here's a research report authored by the largest bank in Canada on the point: http://www.rbc.com/newsroom/_assets-custom/pdf/20171221-ha.pdf http://www.rbc.com/newsroom/_assets-custom/pdf/20171221-ha.p... Ownership costs in Vancouver and Toronto are sitting well north of 75% of the median income for individuals in those areas. This isn't a made up issue caused by young kids eschewing spendthrift habits and buying all them dang newfangled iPhones rather than investing in equity building houses. It is an issue with the ratio of home prices to local median incomes.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > I've known people who make close to the median income and support 4 children, own a home, and still had enough savings to buy them all cars and pay for their college tuition. You just said, in effect, they had enough savings to spend them later to meet basic expenditures needed in raising children in their income level, which isn't really a sign of ability to accumulate excess capital after maintenance.
  - jrs95 9y ago
    Maybe if you just cut that part out of it, yeah
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]

jrs95 9y ago

You're confusing what people can do with what they actually do. I've known people who make close to the median income and support 4 children, own a home, and still had enough savings to buy them all cars and pay for their college tuition. They have some amount of retirement savings as well, though I don't know how much. I've also known people who make nearly 6 figures and just spend all of their money. A more expensive apartment than they need, a more expensive car than they need, eating at restaurants all the time, buying a bunch of what are essentially toys for adults, etc. Although this is in the midwest, the cost of living is much lower here. It's quite possible that you just can't do this on your typical "middle class" income in other places.

ABCLAW 9y ago
The issue is specific to certain locations. Here's a research report authored by the largest bank in Canada on the point: http://www.rbc.com/newsroom/_assets-custom/pdf/20171221-ha.pdf http://www.rbc.com/newsroom/_assets-custom/pdf/20171221-ha.p... Ownership costs in Vancouver and Toronto are sitting well north of 75% of the median income for individuals in those areas. This isn't a made up issue caused by young kids eschewing spendthrift habits and buying all them dang newfangled iPhones rather than investing in equity building houses. It is an issue with the ratio of home prices to local median incomes.
dragonwriter 9y ago
> I've known people who make close to the median income and support 4 children, own a home, and still had enough savings to buy them all cars and pay for their college tuition. You just said, in effect, they had enough savings to spend them later to meet basic expenditures needed in raising children in their income level, which isn't really a sign of ability to accumulate excess capital after maintenance.
- jrs95 9y ago
  Maybe if you just cut that part out of it, yeah
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]