5 ms·

London has a green belt -- an area of land around it which is legally protected. This makes the cost of living in London prohibitive, and limits growth.

iagooar 9y ago
What does "legally protected" mean in this context? What makes that land different? Genuinely curious.
- chillydawg 9y ago
  It means planning permission is very rarely granted for new buildings and usually only in exceptional circumstances or when it is a public facility. Planning law in the UK has special protections for areas designated as green belt.
walrus1066 9y ago
Not sure how much it limits growth, people just cram into ever smaller living spaces, or commute in from towns further away.
- peteretep 9y ago
  It was 8.3m 100 years ago, and it's 9.1m now.
  - delecti 9y ago
    There were a couple notable wars in that time though.
    - vkou 9y ago
      England was barely affected by the first World War. France, Germany, Austria, Serbia, the Ottoman Empire, and Russia bore the brunt of the fighting. And compared to the other belligerents, it was barely affected by the second, too. British colonial policies during the war killed more of their own subjects in India, then the Germans ever did on the home isles. (For anyone wondering why India sought independence... Well, that was a factor.)
      - ihsw2 9y ago
        The British economy nosedived into total exhaustion of resources, with resource rationing extending to 1956. It was closely intertwined with the French economy for a century before WW2 and its assets were wholly seized/decimated. If WW2 went on for much longer then the UK would have descended into universal abject poverty and total societal collapse. Granted this universal suffering of the populace ushered in the social-welfare state Britain is so commonly known for nowadays, it was nonetheless devastating.
        vkou 9y ago
        Most rationing in the UK ended in 1950. That total exhaustion of resources happened due to decolonization, and taking on much debt (Much of which was inflated away over the next decade.) As it turned out, the resource shortages didn't matter, either, due to free trade. 1945 to 1960 had the highest rate of economic growth that the UK has ever experienced. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United_Kingdom#/media/File:Annual_U.K._GDP_Growth,_1948_to_2012.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United...
    - mbesto 9y ago
      Which would have done what? Reduce the population because of death?
      - rspeer 9y ago
        Moving out of London during the Blitz was a way to avoid death.
    - smnrchrds 9y ago
      The first world war barely registers on the graph. The second world war shows a small decrease in population. But the largest decrease is seen in the 70s and 80s. I have no idea why. But see the data for yourself: https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/population-change-1939-2015 https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/population-change-1939-20...
cromon 9y ago
London hasn't fallen in population since the 90s in fact it's been a steady rise since then(0). These are just the official stats, anecdotally there is noticeably a lot more people in London than when I was a teenager. (0) https://www.trustforlondon.org.uk/data/londons-population-over-time/ https://www.trustforlondon.org.uk/data/londons-population-ov...
- peteretep 9y ago
  It's still the same as it was in 1939 though... And if you compare it with any Chinese city, London's slow re-population looks exceptionally sluggish.
  - igravious 9y ago
    Where are the people going to come from? UK is already 83% urbanized: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.URB.TOTL.IN.ZS?year_high_desc=true https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.URB.TOTL.IN.ZS?year_... Not many rurals gonna migrate to the big smoke and as you can tell from Brexit the Brits ain't too keen any more on inwards migration. Let's not forget that from ~1825 to ~1925 London was the largest city in the world: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_throughout_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_through...
    - justicezyx 9y ago
      Nice data, blind comparison without context is intentionally misleading
    - peteretep 9y ago
      > Where are the people going to come from? The rest of Europe.

iagooar 9y ago

What does "legally protected" mean in this context? What makes that land different? Genuinely curious.

chillydawg 9y ago
It means planning permission is very rarely granted for new buildings and usually only in exceptional circumstances or when it is a public facility. Planning law in the UK has special protections for areas designated as green belt.

walrus1066 9y ago

Not sure how much it limits growth, people just cram into ever smaller living spaces, or commute in from towns further away.

peteretep 9y ago
It was 8.3m 100 years ago, and it's 9.1m now.
- delecti 9y ago
  There were a couple notable wars in that time though.
  - vkou 9y ago
    England was barely affected by the first World War. France, Germany, Austria, Serbia, the Ottoman Empire, and Russia bore the brunt of the fighting. And compared to the other belligerents, it was barely affected by the second, too. British colonial policies during the war killed more of their own subjects in India, then the Germans ever did on the home isles. (For anyone wondering why India sought independence... Well, that was a factor.)
    - ihsw2 9y ago
      The British economy nosedived into total exhaustion of resources, with resource rationing extending to 1956. It was closely intertwined with the French economy for a century before WW2 and its assets were wholly seized/decimated. If WW2 went on for much longer then the UK would have descended into universal abject poverty and total societal collapse. Granted this universal suffering of the populace ushered in the social-welfare state Britain is so commonly known for nowadays, it was nonetheless devastating.
      - vkou 9y ago
        Most rationing in the UK ended in 1950. That total exhaustion of resources happened due to decolonization, and taking on much debt (Much of which was inflated away over the next decade.) As it turned out, the resource shortages didn't matter, either, due to free trade. 1945 to 1960 had the highest rate of economic growth that the UK has ever experienced. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United_Kingdom#/media/File:Annual_U.K._GDP_Growth,_1948_to_2012.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United...
  - mbesto 9y ago
    Which would have done what? Reduce the population because of death?
    - rspeer 9y ago
      Moving out of London during the Blitz was a way to avoid death.
  - smnrchrds 9y ago
    The first world war barely registers on the graph. The second world war shows a small decrease in population. But the largest decrease is seen in the 70s and 80s. I have no idea why. But see the data for yourself: https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/population-change-1939-2015 https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/population-change-1939-20...

cromon 9y ago

London hasn't fallen in population since the 90s in fact it's been a steady rise since then(0). These are just the official stats, anecdotally there is noticeably a lot more people in London than when I was a teenager. (0) https://www.trustforlondon.org.uk/data/londons-population-over-time/ https://www.trustforlondon.org.uk/data/londons-population-ov...

peteretep 9y ago
It's still the same as it was in 1939 though... And if you compare it with any Chinese city, London's slow re-population looks exceptionally sluggish.
- igravious 9y ago
  Where are the people going to come from? UK is already 83% urbanized: https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.URB.TOTL.IN.ZS?year_high_desc=true https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.URB.TOTL.IN.ZS?year_... Not many rurals gonna migrate to the big smoke and as you can tell from Brexit the Brits ain't too keen any more on inwards migration. Let's not forget that from ~1825 to ~1925 London was the largest city in the world: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_throughout_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_through...
  - justicezyx 9y ago
    Nice data, blind comparison without context is intentionally misleading
  - peteretep 9y ago
    > Where are the people going to come from? The rest of Europe.