6 ms·

Something I find quite strange is how South American countries pervasively discourage people from flushing used toilet paper (instead preferring to have a littl

by schoen 9y ago

Something I find quite strange is how South American countries pervasively discourage people from flushing used toilet paper (instead preferring to have a little wastebasket to collect it and later throw it away in the trash). The usual account of the reason for this is that the plumbing can't handle it -- which you also hear about some old buildings in the U.S. OK, but this norm persists even in buildings that were constructed within the last decade, like some super-recent hotels and airport terminals. Surely the plumbing there should be able to handle toilet paper, right?

diab0lic 9y ago
That plumbing eventually connects to infrastructure constructed decades ago which presumably cannot handle the paper.
oh_sigh 9y ago
If the signs say don't flush anything down, they usually mean anything other than toilet paper and bodily excretions. Flushing tampons, pads, condoms, whatever the hell else is in your pocket is common and that is what those signs are discouraging. Toilet paper is designed to basically disintegrate once it gets wet, so it is not causing any problems in plumbing
- waterphone 9y ago
  In many Central and South American countries, flushing toilet paper is explicitly discouraged.
  - siddboots 9y ago
    Same in most of SE Asia.
- girvo 9y ago
  In Cuba, we were told in no uncertain terms not to flush toilet paper (or anything else, of course).
  - oh_sigh 9y ago
    That may be because you are using paper which isn't designed to disintegrate upon contact with water. My anus does recall travels in South America where provided toilet products were rough and relatively ineffective. At least in North Africa and China you are living in a capitalistic market where toilet products of varying qualities can be readily had.
- bootlooped 9y ago
  In Korea there are buildings that still insist you don't flush toilet paper. They usually say specifically toilet paper. My position is that it would not be dangerous to ignore this, firstly, because like you stated toilet paper is very weak when wet, and secondly, the impression that I got was that it was mostly an old-fashioned idea.
  - djsumdog 9y ago
    It's a bad idea. I'm not sure about Korea specifically, but a lot of developing nations have old/narrow pipes and they don't have the waste treatment facilities to deal with toilet paper. They might not have the money to install advanced filtering or even activated charcoal. Often times the waste water is just diluted and dumped into oceans or lakes. I encounter the "toilet paper in the trash can" signs first in Moldova. The Nistru river has high levels of cholera, so it makes sense they simply do not have advanced treatment facilities.
  - oh_sigh 9y ago
    This may have to do more with their toilet paper technology instead of their pipes. Mere rolls of wood pulp may be cheaper to produce - and importantly more likely to cause clogs - in some locales than ultra soft quilted quad-ply.
- thomastjeffery 9y ago
  > Flushing tampons, pads, condoms, whatever the hell else is in your pocket is... ...always a bad idea. Just because you don't hear about problems with sewer systems, does not mean they are nonexistent. Also, flushing anything that doesn't disintegrate will quickly ruin any septic tank/leech field.
waterphone 9y ago
And restrooms in stores along the U.S. border where people cross from Mexico often have to have signs in Spanish telling people to please flush their toilet paper and not throw it on the floor beside the toilet or go out into other parts of the store and drag trash cans into the restrooms to dispose of it in. (This is not intended as a criticism of Mexicans, merely a comment on the fact that just across the border such practices still remain very active. Unfortunately due to the clash of expected practices, their belief that it's necessary to avoid clogging plumbing, and the U.S. lack of such a practice meaning there isn't a wastebasket beside each toilet, it often leads to rather unhygienic restrooms. In some cases, stores compromise and put wastebaskets in as well so everyone is satisfied.)
- james-skemp 9y ago
  And now I know why when I was at Fleet Farm yesterday there was a trash bin in the stall. Had never seen that before.
nrau 9y ago
Actually, this is the case in some Asian countries as well including parts of Japan and Indonesia.
- mantas 9y ago
  Not uncommon in Europe either. Especially in non-renovated parts of old cities or middle-of-nowhere kind of places. Old pipes just can't handle too much paper.
  - GordonS 9y ago
    As a European who has travelled through a lot of Europe, I would say it is uncommon - I don't think I've ever come across it in Europe.
    - mantas 9y ago
      Come to Baltic states or Poland then. It does happen in either super old and not yet renovated downtown buildings or roadside establishments in the middle of nowhere. Old narrow pipes just can't take paper. Especially if someone loves to fold it few times... I think I've seen that in the UK as well, but memory may be playing tricks on me.
      - GordonS 9y ago
        I've been to Poland, didn't see it there either. But I suppose I wasn't on a tour of toilets! I'm certain I haven't seen this anywhere in the UK (I live there).
- pwim 9y ago
  Here in Japan, I've never been to a place where you don't flush your toilet paper. In fact, they sometimes run into the opposite problem, with tourists not knowing you're supposed to flush the paper (https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/08/26/national/kyoto-turns-toilet-etiquette-signs-visitor-behavior-nose/ https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/08/26/national/kyoto-...). Part of this might be because you're not supposed to flush sanitary napkins or anything but toilet paper, so there's often a bin next to the toilets for disposing of those, which I could see as confusing to someone who comes from a culture where you don't flush toilet paper.
joecool1029 9y ago
Encountered it in Canada in the maritimes. Anywhere on the coast there were places that just had a pipe going straight into the ocean. Cafes, restaurants, you name it. There were even portable toilets set up with the pipes so they never had to be pumped. I'm guessing they don't want to see tons of toilet paper floating in the ocean I guess, but excrement is not a problem? Maybe someone else has some better insight, for instance I know in the states if it rains too much and sewage backs up a bit, the beaches get closed. Do Canadians not see a problem with high bacteria levels? It's not an isolated thing and comes up often... Canadians just seem backward at sewage management[1][2]. [1] http://thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/canada-dumping-raw-sewage-into-its-waterways/ http://thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/canada-dumping-... [2] https://qz.com/545922/canadas-new-government-just-approved-dumping-raw-sewage-into-the-st-lawrence-river/ https://qz.com/545922/canadas-new-government-just-approved-d...
- soperj 9y ago
  Victoria BC dumps right in the ocean too, and there's no one who saves their tp for the dump.
  - joecool1029 9y ago
    The only guess I have is that Victoria uses sewage pumps somewhere in their system that shoot it into the sewer. The maritime systems are literally just a pipe so maybe more prone to clogging?
  - empressplay 9y ago
    The outfall goes a fair way out into the strait though, it's not like the sewage is dumped 50m off shore
- sandywilkinscr 9y ago
  For systems that pump to the sea, the waste is pumped to large enough distance from the shore that by the time it reaches the shore again (as determined by currents and who knows what else) it is sufficiently disintegrated and decomposed to not be harmful for swimmers on the beach. Remember this from my uncle who is an engineer and works in sewage systems design, construction, and maintenance. A distance I think he mentioned for a specific construction he was working on was 350 meters from shore, but this could be incorrect.
djsumdog 9y ago
Same thing in Moldova. I was told it was the old plumbing that candle handle large amounts of toilet paper, but I have a feeling it might also be antiquated treatment facilities that can't deal with paper breakdown either.

by schoen 9y ago

diab0lic 9y ago

That plumbing eventually connects to infrastructure constructed decades ago which presumably cannot handle the paper.

oh_sigh 9y ago

If the signs say don't flush anything down, they usually mean anything other than toilet paper and bodily excretions. Flushing tampons, pads, condoms, whatever the hell else is in your pocket is common and that is what those signs are discouraging. Toilet paper is designed to basically disintegrate once it gets wet, so it is not causing any problems in plumbing

waterphone 9y ago
In many Central and South American countries, flushing toilet paper is explicitly discouraged.
- siddboots 9y ago
  Same in most of SE Asia.
girvo 9y ago
In Cuba, we were told in no uncertain terms not to flush toilet paper (or anything else, of course).
- oh_sigh 9y ago
  That may be because you are using paper which isn't designed to disintegrate upon contact with water. My anus does recall travels in South America where provided toilet products were rough and relatively ineffective. At least in North Africa and China you are living in a capitalistic market where toilet products of varying qualities can be readily had.
bootlooped 9y ago
In Korea there are buildings that still insist you don't flush toilet paper. They usually say specifically toilet paper. My position is that it would not be dangerous to ignore this, firstly, because like you stated toilet paper is very weak when wet, and secondly, the impression that I got was that it was mostly an old-fashioned idea.
- djsumdog 9y ago
  It's a bad idea. I'm not sure about Korea specifically, but a lot of developing nations have old/narrow pipes and they don't have the waste treatment facilities to deal with toilet paper. They might not have the money to install advanced filtering or even activated charcoal. Often times the waste water is just diluted and dumped into oceans or lakes. I encounter the "toilet paper in the trash can" signs first in Moldova. The Nistru river has high levels of cholera, so it makes sense they simply do not have advanced treatment facilities.
- oh_sigh 9y ago
  This may have to do more with their toilet paper technology instead of their pipes. Mere rolls of wood pulp may be cheaper to produce - and importantly more likely to cause clogs - in some locales than ultra soft quilted quad-ply.
thomastjeffery 9y ago
> Flushing tampons, pads, condoms, whatever the hell else is in your pocket is... ...always a bad idea. Just because you don't hear about problems with sewer systems, does not mean they are nonexistent. Also, flushing anything that doesn't disintegrate will quickly ruin any septic tank/leech field.

waterphone 9y ago

And restrooms in stores along the U.S. border where people cross from Mexico often have to have signs in Spanish telling people to please flush their toilet paper and not throw it on the floor beside the toilet or go out into other parts of the store and drag trash cans into the restrooms to dispose of it in. (This is not intended as a criticism of Mexicans, merely a comment on the fact that just across the border such practices still remain very active. Unfortunately due to the clash of expected practices, their belief that it's necessary to avoid clogging plumbing, and the U.S. lack of such a practice meaning there isn't a wastebasket beside each toilet, it often leads to rather unhygienic restrooms. In some cases, stores compromise and put wastebaskets in as well so everyone is satisfied.)

james-skemp 9y ago
And now I know why when I was at Fleet Farm yesterday there was a trash bin in the stall. Had never seen that before.

nrau 9y ago

Actually, this is the case in some Asian countries as well including parts of Japan and Indonesia.

mantas 9y ago
Not uncommon in Europe either. Especially in non-renovated parts of old cities or middle-of-nowhere kind of places. Old pipes just can't handle too much paper.
- GordonS 9y ago
  As a European who has travelled through a lot of Europe, I would say it is uncommon - I don't think I've ever come across it in Europe.
  - mantas 9y ago
    Come to Baltic states or Poland then. It does happen in either super old and not yet renovated downtown buildings or roadside establishments in the middle of nowhere. Old narrow pipes just can't take paper. Especially if someone loves to fold it few times... I think I've seen that in the UK as well, but memory may be playing tricks on me.
    - GordonS 9y ago
      I've been to Poland, didn't see it there either. But I suppose I wasn't on a tour of toilets! I'm certain I haven't seen this anywhere in the UK (I live there).
pwim 9y ago
Here in Japan, I've never been to a place where you don't flush your toilet paper. In fact, they sometimes run into the opposite problem, with tourists not knowing you're supposed to flush the paper (https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/08/26/national/kyoto-turns-toilet-etiquette-signs-visitor-behavior-nose/ https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/08/26/national/kyoto-...). Part of this might be because you're not supposed to flush sanitary napkins or anything but toilet paper, so there's often a bin next to the toilets for disposing of those, which I could see as confusing to someone who comes from a culture where you don't flush toilet paper.

joecool1029 9y ago

Encountered it in Canada in the maritimes. Anywhere on the coast there were places that just had a pipe going straight into the ocean. Cafes, restaurants, you name it. There were even portable toilets set up with the pipes so they never had to be pumped. I'm guessing they don't want to see tons of toilet paper floating in the ocean I guess, but excrement is not a problem? Maybe someone else has some better insight, for instance I know in the states if it rains too much and sewage backs up a bit, the beaches get closed. Do Canadians not see a problem with high bacteria levels? It's not an isolated thing and comes up often... Canadians just seem backward at sewage management[1][2]. [1] http://thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/canada-dumping-raw-sewage-into-its-waterways/ http://thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/canada-dumping-... [2] https://qz.com/545922/canadas-new-government-just-approved-dumping-raw-sewage-into-the-st-lawrence-river/ https://qz.com/545922/canadas-new-government-just-approved-d...

soperj 9y ago
Victoria BC dumps right in the ocean too, and there's no one who saves their tp for the dump.
- joecool1029 9y ago
  The only guess I have is that Victoria uses sewage pumps somewhere in their system that shoot it into the sewer. The maritime systems are literally just a pipe so maybe more prone to clogging?
- empressplay 9y ago
  The outfall goes a fair way out into the strait though, it's not like the sewage is dumped 50m off shore
sandywilkinscr 9y ago
For systems that pump to the sea, the waste is pumped to large enough distance from the shore that by the time it reaches the shore again (as determined by currents and who knows what else) it is sufficiently disintegrated and decomposed to not be harmful for swimmers on the beach. Remember this from my uncle who is an engineer and works in sewage systems design, construction, and maintenance. A distance I think he mentioned for a specific construction he was working on was 350 meters from shore, but this could be incorrect.

djsumdog 9y ago

Same thing in Moldova. I was told it was the old plumbing that candle handle large amounts of toilet paper, but I have a feeling it might also be antiquated treatment facilities that can't deal with paper breakdown either.