7 ms·

Bitcoin is as real as the USD. At least with Bitcoin you know what the properties of your currency are. The Federal Reserve doesn't even publish the amount of

Bitcoin is as real as the USD. At least with Bitcoin you know what the properties of your currency are. The Federal Reserve doesn't even publish the amount of M3 money anymore: https://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h6/discm3.htm https://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h6/discm3.htm If that doesn't give you pause, I don't know what will.

victor106 9y ago
> The Federal Reserve doesn't even publish the amount of M3 money anymore: except they do. See below. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S I am not anti-crypto. I think in the future most transactions would move there. But the state of the current crypto's won't get us there. If you close your eyes for a min and just think about the .com bust that is exactly what is happening here. I know of companies during that time that had nothing to do with IT and they would just announce that they are investing in IT and there stocks would triple. Read below for similar crypto news. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-18/fintech-mircocap-stock-jumps-2-400-after-touting-crypto-link https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-18/fintech-m...
- etr-strike 9y ago
  Hmm I'm confused in that case. Did the Fed start publishing it again? The link I provided is to the official Federal Reserve website clearly stating they are discontinuing the publication of M3.
- mitchellberry 9y ago
  > except they do. See below. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S > Source: Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development St Louis fed is publishing third party estimates there, official reporting stopped in 2007.
  - victor106 9y ago
    See this https://mises.org/library/death-m3-fifth-anniversary https://mises.org/library/death-m3-fifth-anniversary And https://www.garynorth.com/public/6538.cfm https://www.garynorth.com/public/6538.cfm TLDR: The end of the first link provides a response from Bernanke which says that the public would still have access to the data but the fed won’t aggregate it and report it. What the OECD does is the aggregation and reporting based on the raw fed data. The second link provides why the M3 was useless to begin with.
adrianN 9y ago
You can't pay your taxes in Bitcoin.
- down 9y ago
  as you can't pay them with gold..
  - adrianN 9y ago
    Gold doesn't claim to be a currency just as real as the Dollar.
  - saalweachter 9y ago
    You know, I'm willing to bet if you showed up at your local tax collector's with a large enough chunk of gold, they'd work with you.
    - tlholaday 9y ago
      Yes, but if you showed up in Tax Court with a chunk of gold, you would risk being held in contempt.
      - AskewEgret 9y ago
        A 1-ounce gold coin issued by the US Mint is legal tender to the tune of $50. It says so right on the coin. If you want to pay your taxes using gold coins, go right ahead. They will gladly accept it.
- 55555 9y ago
  What? That doesn't even make any sense. You can sell the bitcoin for USD then pay your taxes. Just like you can't pay your taxes with 1 billion dollars worth of Facebook stock or gold. The argument you are looking for is: "USD has value BECAUSE the state makes you pay your taxes in it." Notice that that argument does not end with, "and this is the only way a commodity or currency can have value." Because there are different reasons that different things have value and more than one thing has value. Your comment is intellectually lazy and you don't have to believe in crypto to come to this conclusion.
lurr 9y ago
> Bitcoin is as real as the USD Not really. The USD is as real as the US government. If the US government collapses I'm not going to trust Bitcoin to save me.

victor106 9y ago

> The Federal Reserve doesn't even publish the amount of M3 money anymore: except they do. See below. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S I am not anti-crypto. I think in the future most transactions would move there. But the state of the current crypto's won't get us there. If you close your eyes for a min and just think about the .com bust that is exactly what is happening here. I know of companies during that time that had nothing to do with IT and they would just announce that they are investing in IT and there stocks would triple. Read below for similar crypto news. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-18/fintech-mircocap-stock-jumps-2-400-after-touting-crypto-link https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-18/fintech-m...

etr-strike 9y ago
Hmm I'm confused in that case. Did the Fed start publishing it again? The link I provided is to the official Federal Reserve website clearly stating they are discontinuing the publication of M3.
mitchellberry 9y ago
> except they do. See below. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MABMM301USA657S > Source: Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development St Louis fed is publishing third party estimates there, official reporting stopped in 2007.
- victor106 9y ago
  See this https://mises.org/library/death-m3-fifth-anniversary https://mises.org/library/death-m3-fifth-anniversary And https://www.garynorth.com/public/6538.cfm https://www.garynorth.com/public/6538.cfm TLDR: The end of the first link provides a response from Bernanke which says that the public would still have access to the data but the fed won’t aggregate it and report it. What the OECD does is the aggregation and reporting based on the raw fed data. The second link provides why the M3 was useless to begin with.

adrianN 9y ago

You can't pay your taxes in Bitcoin.

down 9y ago
as you can't pay them with gold..
- adrianN 9y ago
  Gold doesn't claim to be a currency just as real as the Dollar.
- saalweachter 9y ago
  You know, I'm willing to bet if you showed up at your local tax collector's with a large enough chunk of gold, they'd work with you.
  - tlholaday 9y ago
    Yes, but if you showed up in Tax Court with a chunk of gold, you would risk being held in contempt.
    - AskewEgret 9y ago
      A 1-ounce gold coin issued by the US Mint is legal tender to the tune of $50. It says so right on the coin. If you want to pay your taxes using gold coins, go right ahead. They will gladly accept it.
55555 9y ago
What? That doesn't even make any sense. You can sell the bitcoin for USD then pay your taxes. Just like you can't pay your taxes with 1 billion dollars worth of Facebook stock or gold. The argument you are looking for is: "USD has value BECAUSE the state makes you pay your taxes in it." Notice that that argument does not end with, "and this is the only way a commodity or currency can have value." Because there are different reasons that different things have value and more than one thing has value. Your comment is intellectually lazy and you don't have to believe in crypto to come to this conclusion.

lurr 9y ago

> Bitcoin is as real as the USD Not really. The USD is as real as the US government. If the US government collapses I'm not going to trust Bitcoin to save me.