6 ms·

I heard of this "Windows 10" indeed but does it run on Linux ?

Fnoord 9y ago
Hyper-V can run a full-blown Linux kernel + OS with virtually no performance loss compared to native (on recent x86-64 hardware). There's also Windows Subsystem for Linux. You can get a full-blown OS like Ubuntu or SuSE that way. Well, that is, sans Linux kernel and sans X11.
- ggus 9y ago
  and sans virtualization options.. no vagrant machines there : (
- vetinari 9y ago
  > Hyper-V can run a full-blown Linux kernel + OS with virtually no performance loss compared to native That's true only for CPU scheduling, or losing CPU performance. For I/O, that's not true.
  - Const-me 9y ago
    It’s also true for IO, networking, and since recently even for GPUs. Intel’s VT-d & VT-c, AMD’s Vi.
    - vetinari 9y ago
      When did that happen? I have a machine, that I'm going to switch from hyper-v to esxi, because the IO is abysmal.
      - Const-me 9y ago
        It happened quite long ago, most Intel CPUs have VT-d since Nehalem (first gen of core i-s, 2008). However, even for modern systems, not all motherboards supports that. Also sometimes the setting is disabled by default in BIOS/UEFI.
        vetinari 9y ago
        I'm talking about Hyper-V IO performance improvements, not VT-d... My E5-2630 does support VT-d, but under Hyper-V, it's not anywhere near bare metal performance.
        Fnoord 9y ago
        AFAIK the I/O issues (hardware-wise, not talking about hyper-V specifically) were solved late '00s. Whether a HVM implements it or not is a different matter. From what I found its called Enlightened I/O as mentioned here [1] and with Hyper-V it works with Windows Vista & later, Windows 2008 & later, Linux kernel 3.14 and later, and "FreeBSD". If what you say is true, and its also true for ESXi, Docker, VirtualBox, KVM, etc. It'd be devastating for containers and cloud. Docker on Windows uses Hyper-V by default btw. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper-V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper-V
        Nullabillity 9y ago
        Intel only made VT-d a standard feature in Skylake. Good luck getting a K-model Nehalem with VT-d.
      - Fnoord 9y ago
        ESXi uses the same hardware features as Hyper-V.
- kogepathic 9y ago
  > There's also Windows Subsystem for Linux. You can get a full-blown OS like Ubuntu or SuSE that way. Well, that is, sans Linux kernel and sans X11. You can use X11 applications if you install an X11 agent in Windows such as Xming. But it's not pleasant. I don't know if it's WSL or Xming at fault, but 2D performance in X is pretty abysmal. I've run applications like gedit and evince on WSL with Xming. It's also fairly annoying that you cannot print from WSL applications, and to my knowledge you cannot access devices either (e.g. USB to serial adapter).
  - cesarb 9y ago
    > I don't know if it's WSL or Xming at fault, but 2D performance in X is pretty abysmal. Xming probably isn't using the X shared memory extension, so everything has to be serialized and sent through the socket. > It's also fairly annoying that you cannot print from WSL applications Can't you configure cups within WSL to print to a network printer, and export the printer from Windows as a network printer?

Hyper-V can run a full-blown Linux kernel + OS with virtually no performance loss compared to native (on recent x86-64 hardware). There's also Windows Subsystem for Linux. You can get a full-blown OS like Ubuntu or SuSE that way. Well, that is, sans Linux kernel and sans X11.

ggus 9y ago
and sans virtualization options.. no vagrant machines there : (
vetinari 9y ago
> Hyper-V can run a full-blown Linux kernel + OS with virtually no performance loss compared to native That's true only for CPU scheduling, or losing CPU performance. For I/O, that's not true.
- Const-me 9y ago
  It’s also true for IO, networking, and since recently even for GPUs. Intel’s VT-d & VT-c, AMD’s Vi.
  - vetinari 9y ago
    When did that happen? I have a machine, that I'm going to switch from hyper-v to esxi, because the IO is abysmal.
    - Const-me 9y ago
      It happened quite long ago, most Intel CPUs have VT-d since Nehalem (first gen of core i-s, 2008). However, even for modern systems, not all motherboards supports that. Also sometimes the setting is disabled by default in BIOS/UEFI.
      - vetinari 9y ago
        I'm talking about Hyper-V IO performance improvements, not VT-d... My E5-2630 does support VT-d, but under Hyper-V, it's not anywhere near bare metal performance.
        Fnoord 9y ago
        AFAIK the I/O issues (hardware-wise, not talking about hyper-V specifically) were solved late '00s. Whether a HVM implements it or not is a different matter. From what I found its called Enlightened I/O as mentioned here [1] and with Hyper-V it works with Windows Vista & later, Windows 2008 & later, Linux kernel 3.14 and later, and "FreeBSD". If what you say is true, and its also true for ESXi, Docker, VirtualBox, KVM, etc. It'd be devastating for containers and cloud. Docker on Windows uses Hyper-V by default btw. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper-V https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper-V
      - Nullabillity 9y ago
        Intel only made VT-d a standard feature in Skylake. Good luck getting a K-model Nehalem with VT-d.
    - Fnoord 9y ago
      ESXi uses the same hardware features as Hyper-V.
kogepathic 9y ago
> There's also Windows Subsystem for Linux. You can get a full-blown OS like Ubuntu or SuSE that way. Well, that is, sans Linux kernel and sans X11. You can use X11 applications if you install an X11 agent in Windows such as Xming. But it's not pleasant. I don't know if it's WSL or Xming at fault, but 2D performance in X is pretty abysmal. I've run applications like gedit and evince on WSL with Xming. It's also fairly annoying that you cannot print from WSL applications, and to my knowledge you cannot access devices either (e.g. USB to serial adapter).
- cesarb 9y ago
  > I don't know if it's WSL or Xming at fault, but 2D performance in X is pretty abysmal. Xming probably isn't using the X shared memory extension, so everything has to be serialized and sent through the socket. > It's also fairly annoying that you cannot print from WSL applications Can't you configure cups within WSL to print to a network printer, and export the printer from Windows as a network printer?