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>beloved What a strange word to apply to a medical system. I mean, really think about it. That's like saying the "DMV is beloved". It's just a strange word usa

>beloved What a strange word to apply to a medical system. I mean, really think about it. That's like saying the "DMV is beloved". It's just a strange word usage that makes me wonder if you're more of a "fan" of their system than an unbiased source. My Canadian friend I regularly play PUBG with, remarked that non-life-threatening illnesses like a broken arm can have waiting times measured in months. (Sounds like our VA.) And he lives in one of the large cities. He is glad that nobody goes bankrupt but he would NEVER use the world "beloved" to describe it. "Better than the USA"--probably, I'd easily give you that without raising my brow. But "beloved"?... I'm sorry, I just can't get past that word. It's so out-of-place. If this was a novel I was reading, I'd have to set the book down for a moment and go, "Really?"

flukus 9y ago
I can't speak for Canada, but coming from a nation with a similar health care system I can pretty comfortably say that you or your friend are lieing. No one has a months long waiting time for a broken arm, the vast majority would be treated in hours at worst. > Beloved... I'm sorry, I just can't get past that word. It's so out-of-place. Many people around the world would describe their government institutions that way, healthcare is a common one but you'll also see things like the BBC or public transit systems held in similar regard.
kinkrtyavimoodh 9y ago
That's a rather strange objection. If any bureaucracy is run smoothly efficiently and effectively, I can totally imagine people calling it beloved simply because it makes such a huge positive impact in their lives. I think this notion of not just lack of fondness for helpful government institutions but active dislike for them is more an American phenomenon and qualifies as 'strange'
emptybits 9y ago
I think it's accurate to say our healthcare system is often loved and quite dear to our hearts as Canadians. (Canadian here.) And, much like a beloved relative, our system has major annoyances and often keeps us waiting. (Can you still call Uncle Bob beloved after he shits the bed? I think you can.) But it's so core to the Canadian experience -- we all know, no matter what economic turns we might take, it's always there for us from birth to death, quirks and all. It's a constant and foundational. I reckon by early adulthood many Canadians will have personally seen it help more loved ones than it harms (while asking for little or zero additional money) ... so I think the word beloved is reasonable. I'd say our system is dear to my heart and that's synonymous with beloved.
- 52-6F-62 9y ago
  You put it well. I'd like to add further context: It saved my younger brother's life in terms of a brain operation where the (thankfully benign) tumor had reached the size of a standard California navel orange. He was a child. It cost my parents nothing for the immediate invasive surgery, the subsequent week+ stay and treatment, and recurring visits, checkups and studies. When my father was a child the Sick Kids hospital in Toronto (disclaimer: also a charity, not solely OHIP) looked after my father regularly. I grew up with stories he'd tell about the state of children in that place from the time he spent with them while he was there. --- To expand upon your statement "by early adulthood many Canadians will have personally seen it help more loved ones than it harms" — this is the best way to put it. When it's not such a scarce and hallowed resource, people don't just go to look after their health if they have money, or are sick, or worse. They go to maintain good health, and don't typically abuse it otherwise. There are holes to fill yet, but just the same I think it's common knowledge that people love the system enough that they would fight against its hypothetical removal — especially in the face of promises of tax cuts, or other "trickle-down" benefits. At the same time it doesn't change the common opinion that certain aspects need improvements.
balnaphone 9y ago
Agreed. The press will say it's "beloved," along with government-sector employees, but in reality you're as likely as not to encounter people very frustrated by the system. Everyone thinks it's better than what exists for poor Americans, and at the same time substantially inferior to what is available for rich Americans.
acidtoyman 9y ago
"... non-life-threatening illnesses like a broken arm can have waiting times measured in months ..." It astounds me that people can hear stories such as this and actually believe them. No, of course people don't wait months to get their broken arm taken care of. I broke my foot and had it in a cast that night, and the only reason it took as long as that was because I didn't realize at first that I'd broken it.
- katastic 9y ago
  My friend... lives in Canada... and his relative had to wait that long. I'm not going to throw away his experience because it doesn't fit into someone's worldview. Just because you had a good experience doesn't mean he can't have a bad one.
  - acidtoyman 9y ago
    I ... am Canadian ... and have never in my life heard anything so absurd. I'm not going to throw away a lifetime of experience because of some ridiculous and obviously false comment on the internet. Use your head: a society that couldn't deal with broken bones without months-long lineups would grind to a halt. How can you seriously believe something so ludicrous? Notice how many other Canadians are jumping in to tell you your statement is totally untrue.
lurr 9y ago
> remarked that non-life-threatening illnesses like a broken arm can have waiting times measured in months You aren't going to wait months for a broken arm. That's just not happening. The reason it's beloved is because when some guy sucker punches you and breaks your jaw it's not financially ruinous. You can go to emergency, get pulled out of line because a nurse sees you are actually in trouble, and then get surgery from a specialist a couple days later. It ends up costing you almost nothing. That's exactly what happened to my father. My mom has epilepsy. When I was a kid we had to call an ambulance multiple times because that's what we were told to do if she had a larger than normal seizure and my dad wasn't home to take care of her. We could do that because it didn't cost us thousands of dollars each time, which would have been beyond our ability to pay. My grandma has had cancer, my grandpa has had a heart attack, my other grandma had a stroke that required weeks of recovery time in hospital. My cousin was born with a hole in her heart. Another with a cleft pallet. It's not perfect. it has a lot of holes and we have problems like shortages of doctors. It's still a "beloved" system because it saves lives and does so without costing an absurd amount.

flukus 9y ago

I can't speak for Canada, but coming from a nation with a similar health care system I can pretty comfortably say that you or your friend are lieing. No one has a months long waiting time for a broken arm, the vast majority would be treated in hours at worst. > Beloved... I'm sorry, I just can't get past that word. It's so out-of-place. Many people around the world would describe their government institutions that way, healthcare is a common one but you'll also see things like the BBC or public transit systems held in similar regard.

kinkrtyavimoodh 9y ago

That's a rather strange objection. If any bureaucracy is run smoothly efficiently and effectively, I can totally imagine people calling it beloved simply because it makes such a huge positive impact in their lives. I think this notion of not just lack of fondness for helpful government institutions but active dislike for them is more an American phenomenon and qualifies as 'strange'

emptybits 9y ago

I think it's accurate to say our healthcare system is often loved and quite dear to our hearts as Canadians. (Canadian here.) And, much like a beloved relative, our system has major annoyances and often keeps us waiting. (Can you still call Uncle Bob beloved after he shits the bed? I think you can.) But it's so core to the Canadian experience -- we all know, no matter what economic turns we might take, it's always there for us from birth to death, quirks and all. It's a constant and foundational. I reckon by early adulthood many Canadians will have personally seen it help more loved ones than it harms (while asking for little or zero additional money) ... so I think the word beloved is reasonable. I'd say our system is dear to my heart and that's synonymous with beloved.

52-6F-62 9y ago
You put it well. I'd like to add further context: It saved my younger brother's life in terms of a brain operation where the (thankfully benign) tumor had reached the size of a standard California navel orange. He was a child. It cost my parents nothing for the immediate invasive surgery, the subsequent week+ stay and treatment, and recurring visits, checkups and studies. When my father was a child the Sick Kids hospital in Toronto (disclaimer: also a charity, not solely OHIP) looked after my father regularly. I grew up with stories he'd tell about the state of children in that place from the time he spent with them while he was there. --- To expand upon your statement "by early adulthood many Canadians will have personally seen it help more loved ones than it harms" — this is the best way to put it. When it's not such a scarce and hallowed resource, people don't just go to look after their health if they have money, or are sick, or worse. They go to maintain good health, and don't typically abuse it otherwise. There are holes to fill yet, but just the same I think it's common knowledge that people love the system enough that they would fight against its hypothetical removal — especially in the face of promises of tax cuts, or other "trickle-down" benefits. At the same time it doesn't change the common opinion that certain aspects need improvements.

balnaphone 9y ago

Agreed. The press will say it's "beloved," along with government-sector employees, but in reality you're as likely as not to encounter people very frustrated by the system. Everyone thinks it's better than what exists for poor Americans, and at the same time substantially inferior to what is available for rich Americans.

acidtoyman 9y ago

"... non-life-threatening illnesses like a broken arm can have waiting times measured in months ..." It astounds me that people can hear stories such as this and actually believe them. No, of course people don't wait months to get their broken arm taken care of. I broke my foot and had it in a cast that night, and the only reason it took as long as that was because I didn't realize at first that I'd broken it.

katastic 9y ago
My friend... lives in Canada... and his relative had to wait that long. I'm not going to throw away his experience because it doesn't fit into someone's worldview. Just because you had a good experience doesn't mean he can't have a bad one.
- acidtoyman 9y ago
  I ... am Canadian ... and have never in my life heard anything so absurd. I'm not going to throw away a lifetime of experience because of some ridiculous and obviously false comment on the internet. Use your head: a society that couldn't deal with broken bones without months-long lineups would grind to a halt. How can you seriously believe something so ludicrous? Notice how many other Canadians are jumping in to tell you your statement is totally untrue.

lurr 9y ago

> remarked that non-life-threatening illnesses like a broken arm can have waiting times measured in months You aren't going to wait months for a broken arm. That's just not happening. The reason it's beloved is because when some guy sucker punches you and breaks your jaw it's not financially ruinous. You can go to emergency, get pulled out of line because a nurse sees you are actually in trouble, and then get surgery from a specialist a couple days later. It ends up costing you almost nothing. That's exactly what happened to my father. My mom has epilepsy. When I was a kid we had to call an ambulance multiple times because that's what we were told to do if she had a larger than normal seizure and my dad wasn't home to take care of her. We could do that because it didn't cost us thousands of dollars each time, which would have been beyond our ability to pay. My grandma has had cancer, my grandpa has had a heart attack, my other grandma had a stroke that required weeks of recovery time in hospital. My cousin was born with a hole in her heart. Another with a cleft pallet. It's not perfect. it has a lot of holes and we have problems like shortages of doctors. It's still a "beloved" system because it saves lives and does so without costing an absurd amount.