4 ms·

The solution is a battery you can replace, like every phone used to have. There aren’t only two solutions to this problem. (Technically you can still replace

by ohyes 9y ago

The solution is a battery you can replace, like every phone used to have. There aren’t only two solutions to this problem. (Technically you can still replace the iPhone battery, unfortunately it isn’t trivial like in the bad old days when phones didn’t have high def touch screens.)

jamesrom 9y ago
This isn't a solution. It's a trade off like every other decision.
- ohyes 9y ago
  Yeah thats true it’s a tradeoff, but by that definition there are no solutions to anything. So I’d argue it’s both a solution and a tradeoff.
  - asimpletune 9y ago
    There are definitely still solutions.
    - Whitestrake 9y ago
      Other than: 1. Allow performance to degrade 2. Allow longevity to degrade 3. Allow the battery to be replaced 4. Some revolutionary battery technology that doesn't degrade?? What solutions are you thinking of?
      - rileymat2 9y ago
        Let the user toggle between 1 and 2? Which could be useful for new phones where, even though currently full, you know you won’t be able to charge next.
        Fnoord 9y ago
        > Let the user toggle between 1 and 2? Wrong company, pal. Apple historically decides for the user. Heck, they still do it with their App Store. Often that may go right, but not always.
        evilduck 9y ago
        Apple already includes a low power mode toggle. It could be updated or altered to account for this.
        Whitestrake 9y ago
        For comparison, my Samsung phones have had CPU underclocking in the low power modes. I'm not sure if that's true of all Androids or not.
      - ohyes 9y ago
        Well, they've actually done kinetic charging smartphones, but it had a battery and i believe it was extremely expensive. So if you did that and instead of a battery combined it with a (relatively large) capacitor (or some sort of amazing spring) you could have the iPhone equivalent of a shake and shine flashlight. (One bonus being that there would be absolutely no holes, as it would not be possible to charge it via a wall outlet). It would be completely impractical, but there wouldn't be a battery, so the battery wouldn't degrade. The alternative storage mechanism might degrade, and who knows what all of the shaking would do to the delicate electronics, likely nothing good. Anyway, I think it'll catch on. I look forward to watching young people on the train shake their iPhone vigorously before making a silly face and taking a picture of themselves in 10 years time.
- znpy 9y ago
  Immagine having a car whose gas tank you are not allowed to refill...
  - nkristoffersen 9y ago
    And yet, in this analogy, you can refill/recharge the tank/battery. And if your tank/battery becomes faulty, you can replace the tank/battery. Just like reality :-)
  - morganvachon 9y ago
    Besides the fact that car/device analogies are always flawed, yours is approaching it from the wrong angle in the first place. The "tank" is the physical battery, and we "refill" it by recharging it. Apple wouldn't stop its users from recharging the phone, that would be insane. To try to salvage your analogy, I'll put forth an anecdote. Last year I restored my deceased father's 1988 Bronco II. One of the issues it had was low fuel pressure, which I narrowed down to the in-tank fuel pump (the Bronco was over-engineered and had two pumps, one in the tank and one on the frame). It wasn't able to push fuel fast enough for the engine to run at top performance. Sound familiar? So I had two choices, replace it myself or take it to a shop, kind of like how you can attempt to replace your phone's battery if you know what you're doing, or take it to a repair shop and let a pro do it for a fee. I'm a competent shadetree mechanic, so I did it myself and saved a few hundred dollars, and it is back to normal operation again.
  - TheOtherHobbes 9y ago
    Imagine a car with a gas tank that shrinks over time, and whose top speed drops accordingly. Imagine that some cars allow the gas tank to be changed by the user. But this one doesn't. Imagine the company that makes the car never mentions the shrinkage or the gradual reduction in top speed, and has no program or system that allows you to fix this - beyond buying a newer car.
    - schrodinger 9y ago
      >Imagine the company that makes the car never mentions the shrinkage or the gradual reduction in top speed, and has no program or system that allows you to fix this - beyond buying a newer car. They'll replace the battery for you, or there are a ton of 3rd party places that'll do it.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
ballenf 9y ago
iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare. I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60. Knockoffs would start out decent and then die within a few weeks to months. Apple's approach gets my vote. You get the upside of built-in battery and the peace of mind when you do need a replacement. [Just to balance that, let me be clear that Apple's choice with regard to crippling my phone pisses me off. I just replaced an iPhone 6 that felt painfully slow and now I know why (I had tested the battery and it was at 75% -- I didn't realize replacing it would speed up the phone).]
- lostlogin 9y ago
  > iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY It really is DIY. There are thousands of guide that can be followed successfully.
  - alkonaut 9y ago
    It's pretty tricky though, and even for a tinkerer it's not trivial. I changed screens, home buttons etc, and find that much easier than changing batteries. I haven't failed to replace a screen on neither the 5 or the 6, but I failed with a battery on the 6, due to broken battery tab and not enough guts to heat/bend it out (I left it for someone else). Now, I completely agree with the design decisions of the iPhone. The completely sealed body is great for water resistance and having the battery replaced is still pretty cheap, especially if you use (I usually just let someone replace with a 3rd party battery for cheap, as this usually takes place after warranty expired). The battery needs to have extra space (or bad things will happen) so it effectively has to be fixed on one side inside the body. Gluing it is a pretty cheap solution to that problem.
- Fnoord 9y ago
  > iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare. The easiness of replacing the battery has gone up with iPhone 7/8/X compared to iPhone 6. You can verify this on iFixit guides. The iPhone 6 is _relatively_ easy to replace because you don't need say a heatgun. You do need some special screwdrivers which you gotta buy. You can, on iFixit. I just bought a whole kit (on sale during Black Friday). > I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60. 20 EUR for mine: https://shop.fairphone.com/en/spare-parts/fairphone-2-battery https://shop.fairphone.com/en/spare-parts/fairphone-2-batter... Replacing any parts on my phone is very easy. Only thing is that the main module with CPU board etc is ~300 EUR.
nbanks 9y ago
I replace my iPhone battery with a cheap one off eBay every year or two when something else breaks. Battery life is pretty good, but the screen pops up now making the phone 0.5mm thicker. It's doing OK for a 5 year old phone, but my friends can't believe I paid $800 for an iPhone 5.
- coldtea 9y ago
  >I replace my iPhone battery with a cheap one off eBay A great way to increase the odds of an explosion near your face or office desk!
- terminalcommand 9y ago
  If the screen is popping up, that condition might be trigerred by a swollen battery. My iPhone 5 also did that, after a while, it worsened so much that the screen colors became affected. I took it to an apple store, paid the fee and had them replace the battery. IMHO a swollen battery is a huge risk, and apple should have replaced my phone without charge. Anyways, be careful and if the battery is swollen, it's time for yet another battery change :)
  - nbanks 9y ago
    My first battery was definitely swollen, and this may be why the screen doesn't snap back into place.
- ghostbrainalpha 9y ago
  I don't understand. Why did you pay $800 for an iPhone 5?
  - azurelogic 9y ago
    Maybe the poster is talking about total sunk cost of phone and all of the batteries
  - nbanks 9y ago
    That's what a 64GB iPhone 5 cost at the time.
mschuster91 9y ago
> unfortunately it isn’t trivial With a good heat gun and toolkit, it's doable in anything from 15-30 min (more if the case is bent or damaged from falls).
- krylon 9y ago
  That pretty much meets my definition of "not trivial". In most Android phones (the ones I have used, at least), replacing the battery took less than one minute.

by ohyes 9y ago

jamesrom 9y ago

This isn't a solution. It's a trade off like every other decision.

ohyes 9y ago
Yeah thats true it’s a tradeoff, but by that definition there are no solutions to anything. So I’d argue it’s both a solution and a tradeoff.
- asimpletune 9y ago
  There are definitely still solutions.
  - Whitestrake 9y ago
    Other than: 1. Allow performance to degrade 2. Allow longevity to degrade 3. Allow the battery to be replaced 4. Some revolutionary battery technology that doesn't degrade?? What solutions are you thinking of?
    - rileymat2 9y ago
      Let the user toggle between 1 and 2? Which could be useful for new phones where, even though currently full, you know you won’t be able to charge next.
      - Fnoord 9y ago
        > Let the user toggle between 1 and 2? Wrong company, pal. Apple historically decides for the user. Heck, they still do it with their App Store. Often that may go right, but not always.
        evilduck 9y ago
        Apple already includes a low power mode toggle. It could be updated or altered to account for this.
        Whitestrake 9y ago
        For comparison, my Samsung phones have had CPU underclocking in the low power modes. I'm not sure if that's true of all Androids or not.
    - ohyes 9y ago
      Well, they've actually done kinetic charging smartphones, but it had a battery and i believe it was extremely expensive. So if you did that and instead of a battery combined it with a (relatively large) capacitor (or some sort of amazing spring) you could have the iPhone equivalent of a shake and shine flashlight. (One bonus being that there would be absolutely no holes, as it would not be possible to charge it via a wall outlet). It would be completely impractical, but there wouldn't be a battery, so the battery wouldn't degrade. The alternative storage mechanism might degrade, and who knows what all of the shaking would do to the delicate electronics, likely nothing good. Anyway, I think it'll catch on. I look forward to watching young people on the train shake their iPhone vigorously before making a silly face and taking a picture of themselves in 10 years time.
znpy 9y ago
Immagine having a car whose gas tank you are not allowed to refill...
- nkristoffersen 9y ago
  And yet, in this analogy, you can refill/recharge the tank/battery. And if your tank/battery becomes faulty, you can replace the tank/battery. Just like reality :-)
- morganvachon 9y ago
  Besides the fact that car/device analogies are always flawed, yours is approaching it from the wrong angle in the first place. The "tank" is the physical battery, and we "refill" it by recharging it. Apple wouldn't stop its users from recharging the phone, that would be insane. To try to salvage your analogy, I'll put forth an anecdote. Last year I restored my deceased father's 1988 Bronco II. One of the issues it had was low fuel pressure, which I narrowed down to the in-tank fuel pump (the Bronco was over-engineered and had two pumps, one in the tank and one on the frame). It wasn't able to push fuel fast enough for the engine to run at top performance. Sound familiar? So I had two choices, replace it myself or take it to a shop, kind of like how you can attempt to replace your phone's battery if you know what you're doing, or take it to a repair shop and let a pro do it for a fee. I'm a competent shadetree mechanic, so I did it myself and saved a few hundred dollars, and it is back to normal operation again.
- TheOtherHobbes 9y ago
  Imagine a car with a gas tank that shrinks over time, and whose top speed drops accordingly. Imagine that some cars allow the gas tank to be changed by the user. But this one doesn't. Imagine the company that makes the car never mentions the shrinkage or the gradual reduction in top speed, and has no program or system that allows you to fix this - beyond buying a newer car.
  - schrodinger 9y ago
    >Imagine the company that makes the car never mentions the shrinkage or the gradual reduction in top speed, and has no program or system that allows you to fix this - beyond buying a newer car. They'll replace the battery for you, or there are a ton of 3rd party places that'll do it.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

ballenf 9y ago

iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare. I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60. Knockoffs would start out decent and then die within a few weeks to months. Apple's approach gets my vote. You get the upside of built-in battery and the peace of mind when you do need a replacement. [Just to balance that, let me be clear that Apple's choice with regard to crippling my phone pisses me off. I just replaced an iPhone 6 that felt painfully slow and now I know why (I had tested the battery and it was at 75% -- I didn't realize replacing it would speed up the phone).]

lostlogin 9y ago
> iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY It really is DIY. There are thousands of guide that can be followed successfully.
- alkonaut 9y ago
  It's pretty tricky though, and even for a tinkerer it's not trivial. I changed screens, home buttons etc, and find that much easier than changing batteries. I haven't failed to replace a screen on neither the 5 or the 6, but I failed with a battery on the 6, due to broken battery tab and not enough guts to heat/bend it out (I left it for someone else). Now, I completely agree with the design decisions of the iPhone. The completely sealed body is great for water resistance and having the battery replaced is still pretty cheap, especially if you use (I usually just let someone replace with a 3rd party battery for cheap, as this usually takes place after warranty expired). The battery needs to have extra space (or bad things will happen) so it effectively has to be fixed on one side inside the body. Gluing it is a pretty cheap solution to that problem.
Fnoord 9y ago
> iPhones do have replaceable batteries, only not DIY. It's like $80 w/o warranty or AppleCare. The easiness of replacing the battery has gone up with iPhone 7/8/X compared to iPhone 6. You can verify this on iFixit guides. The iPhone 6 is _relatively_ easy to replace because you don't need say a heatgun. You do need some special screwdrivers which you gotta buy. You can, on iFixit. I just bought a whole kit (on sale during Black Friday). > I've bought dozens of Android replacement batteries and the only batteries worth the cost of shipping were actual real OEM ones. And those always cost >$60. 20 EUR for mine: https://shop.fairphone.com/en/spare-parts/fairphone-2-battery https://shop.fairphone.com/en/spare-parts/fairphone-2-batter... Replacing any parts on my phone is very easy. Only thing is that the main module with CPU board etc is ~300 EUR.

nbanks 9y ago

I replace my iPhone battery with a cheap one off eBay every year or two when something else breaks. Battery life is pretty good, but the screen pops up now making the phone 0.5mm thicker. It's doing OK for a 5 year old phone, but my friends can't believe I paid $800 for an iPhone 5.

coldtea 9y ago
>I replace my iPhone battery with a cheap one off eBay A great way to increase the odds of an explosion near your face or office desk!
terminalcommand 9y ago
If the screen is popping up, that condition might be trigerred by a swollen battery. My iPhone 5 also did that, after a while, it worsened so much that the screen colors became affected. I took it to an apple store, paid the fee and had them replace the battery. IMHO a swollen battery is a huge risk, and apple should have replaced my phone without charge. Anyways, be careful and if the battery is swollen, it's time for yet another battery change :)
- nbanks 9y ago
  My first battery was definitely swollen, and this may be why the screen doesn't snap back into place.
ghostbrainalpha 9y ago
I don't understand. Why did you pay $800 for an iPhone 5?
- azurelogic 9y ago
  Maybe the poster is talking about total sunk cost of phone and all of the batteries
- nbanks 9y ago
  That's what a 64GB iPhone 5 cost at the time.

mschuster91 9y ago

> unfortunately it isn’t trivial With a good heat gun and toolkit, it's doable in anything from 15-30 min (more if the case is bent or damaged from falls).

krylon 9y ago
That pretty much meets my definition of "not trivial". In most Android phones (the ones I have used, at least), replacing the battery took less than one minute.